Past Use by Date

[sprite]

I hate to say it but I think MOL has reached the crucial point in his career.

So far this year his output is well below his and our standards...

Before everyone starts saying he takes a key defender, posters continue to say give youth a go, well here is an opportunity.

My reasons to think this are:

Poor conversion

Lack of confidence ( not taking marks)

Lack of pace gets into trouble too easily

Continues to be out of the contest..

Perhaps he can turn it around, but I think this season should be the closing of a fine career.

Facing facts

Sprite

[Thunder Shaker]

Next year he becomes eligible for listing on the Veterans' list.

[anniswan]

I don't think anyone is saying he is in the prime of his career. However he is still a very useful player.

This may or not be his last year, I can't see him being a long term prospect but I would rather have him in our team that be in another team.

[sprite]

Sorry but if his performance remains at this level then what good is that, we can bring in another tall suchas Vogels as a replacement.

Sprite

[sprite]

Annie, I don't think another team would pick him now. Teams go for youth now...

[goswannie14]

Originally posted by sprite
Sorry but if his performance remains at this level then what good is that, we can bring in another tall suchas Vogels as a replacement.

Sprite You didn't watch the game last week?:confused:

[sprite]

Yes I watched last week, but what I am saying is this is based on this year, plus the end of last year.

[NMWBloods]

MOL was crap tonight.

Of course he played well last week - he was on a first gamer.

[midaro]

Love to see Vogels in the team... but MOL!
He's accumulated more bownie points than Steve Waugh.

[Carolyn]

Originally posted by sprite
My reasons to think this are:

Poor conversion

Lack of confidence ( not taking marks)

Lack of pace gets into trouble too easily

Continues to be out of the contest..
Falling over a lot.

[smartplay]

Originally posted by sprite
I hate to say it but I think MOL has reached the crucial point in his career.

So far this year his output is well below his and our standards...

Before everyone starts saying he takes a key defender, posters continue to say give youth a go, well here is an opportunity.

My reasons to think this are:

Poor conversion

Lack of confidence ( not taking marks)

Lack of pace gets into trouble too easily

Continues to be out of the contest..

Perhaps he can turn it around, but I think this season should be the closing of a fine career.

Facing facts

Sprite

poor conversion/lack of confidence - you can almost sense it that he is lacking confidence in kicking as close as 35-50m out. as a key forward, he must be consistent in his goal kicking anywhere around the circle.
perhaps his duties should be further up the ground, marking & contesting as has happened some of the time, giving others greater chances at FF. if he can't do that either, then I am sure he would feel that he is letting his team/club down
if he is suffering an injury, then he should be rested. there are great players ready to come in for top exposure in readiness for tougher future rounds.
perhaps he just have to practise harder (in kicking goal) & puts in greater effort in all department. perhasp this is mental thing - some one needs to straighten his thinking-confidence.

[Nico]

He covered a lot of ground last week on a very hard surface. Probably more in any game for some time.

I suspect he probably didn't train this week. We all know he has chronic knee tendonitis so he is not going to be his best every week. Good thing is though he commands one of the best defenders so there is always that added pressure on the backs.

[smartplay]

Originally posted by Nico
He covered a lot of ground last week on a very hard surface. Probably more in any game for some time.

I suspect he probably didn't train this week. We all know he has chronic knee tendonitis so he is not going to be his best every week. Good thing is though he commands one of the best defenders so there is always that added pressure on the backs.

perhaps the solution is for him to play every alternating week.
example, next week, he is rested and the following week, he is on. this also gives emerging players opportunities to be exposed. & MOL is fresher for it.
exposing backup players at top level one a time (since the present team is doing well as at round 8) must be smart planning in anticipation of future injuries. when the need arises (to replace semi- or fully injured player), sure this exposure will give dividend.
I think there should be at least one player on rotation, every 1-3 weeks, irrespective how well the present team (as at round 8) is doing, especially with kind of weakened tendonitised MOL.

[Swansinger]

Originally posted by sprite
I hate to say it but I think MOL has reached the crucial point in his career.

Perhaps he can turn it around, but I think this season should be the closing of a fine career.

Facing facts

Sprite

And I hate to say that I agree.
Want to see Magic retire gracefully rather than fade away.

[Legs Akimbo]

I feel better with MOL in the team than not. Every player goes through a period of low confidence and MOL especially is a confidence player. He is taking the second best defender every week and still kicking a few goals and setting up others.

With good management of those knees, he has a few years yet.

I just wish he would stop grimacing and walking gingerly after every contest. It is not helping his cause.

[ROK Lobster]

Originally posted by Legs Akimbo

I just with he would stop grimacing and walking gingerly after every contest. It is not helping his cause. All sing along "...Micky's never injured, always hurt..."

[JF_Bay22_SCG]

Originally posted by sprite
Sorry but if his performance remains at this level then what good is that, we can bring in another tall suchas Vogels as a replacement.

Sprite

How about Teddy Richards? I saw enough from the pre-season match at North Sydney to see that he has a fair detail of potential and a leading marking forward, arguably more than he shows in defence where he appears to be somewhat clanger-prone.

Put Vogels in defence & Teddy in the forward line. Let's face it, Teddy couldn't be any more useless in the forward line than LRT.

JF

[NMWBloods]

Richards can't kick, so won't make a good forward.

[Tuesday]

Originally posted by midaro
He's accumulated more bownie points than Steve Waugh.

Oh, really? (http://www.realfooty.theage.com.au/realfooty/articles/2004/03/19/1079199424159.html?from=storyrhs)

Short memory.

[Legs Akimbo]

Was watching Neon Leon destroy Geelong last night and got me contemplating about whether we should target some more indigenous players in the draft. Goodes and O'loughlin are both in their late 20's. Every team, and I think particularly ours, can benefit from the particular flair and skill of indigenous players.

I think the club should have a policy of ALWAYS having several aboriginal players on the list not least of all because I think clubs should commit to supporting aboriginal football and development of aboriginal players.

[sydneyswans1989]

his kicking lets him down too much, if he could kick straighter than he would be fantastic because he presents himself & can take marks but can't convert.

[NMWBloods]

Hard to kick straight when you get one possession!

[bloodboy]

Far out people - one bad game and you want the guy to retire...

Personally, I think Magic has had a reasonable start to the season...so far he has kicked 13 or 14 goals, a return of around 2 per game...not really that bad considering some of the crap performances we put in at the start of the season. You can't sit there and tell me that because he has had one bad game that he is past it. Get real. If you are going to make these sort of recommendations, please base your findings on evidence that runs a bit longer than one week...give the bloke a fair go.

[Gary]

Sad that we can even contemplate this...but if he played like he did last night for 3 /4 weeks in a row...sprite would be right.
It is a little painful to watch the glory of youth fade like this...but the case isn't proven yet. Watch & pray!
Also, let us not call Adam "late 20's" yet!

[OldE]

I think there's a major problem when our FF (essentially) can't kick more than 35m.

[The Big Cat]

Give him a break! He's kicked some long goals this year and he can turn sh@@@ into strawberry jam! The way it was delivered to him on Saturday night was appauling. Even BBBH struggles when they put the ball on top of his head. And as for his speed - check out how many run down tackles he has put on this year - more than most other blokes. Last week he may have been on a kid, but he still had long leads which started on the HFF and he marked the kick out on the opposite HBF. Against the WB he may not have got it much but the bloke on him wasn't game to leave his side. MOL would make any other team in the AFL at present, so in the words of Bomber Thompson "Leave him alone!"

[Nico]

Originally posted by Legs Akimbo
Was watching Neon Leon destroy Geelong last night and got me contemplating about whether we should target some more indigenous players in the draft. Goodes and O'loughlin are both in their late 20's. Every team, and I think particularly ours, can benefit from the particular flair and skill of indigenous players.

I think the club should have a policy of ALWAYS having several aboriginal players on the list not least of all because I think clubs should commit to supporting aboriginal football and development of aboriginal players.

Absolutely disagree.

We are about winning. A lot of aboriginal players are soft bodied so when the real crunch comes too many in any one side doesn't stack up.

By all means recruit them if the suit the side or situation but not for the sake of it. We are lucky to have 2 who you could generally say are not soft bodied. I'll probably cop a schallacking for this opinion but I think Fremantle are a prime example of too many aboriginal players in the one team over the past few years.

Players should be recruited on their merits not colour or creed etc.

[Legs Akimbo]

Originally posted by Nico
Absolutely disagree.

We are about winning. A lot of aboriginal players are soft bodied so when the real crunch comes too many in any one side doesn't stack up.

By all means recruit them if the suit the side or situation but not for the sake of it. We are lucky to have 2 who you could generally say are not soft bodied. I'll probably cop a schallacking for this opinion but I think Fremantle are a prime example of too many aboriginal players in the one team over the past few years.

Players should be recruited on their merits not colour or creed etc.

Soft bodied? Right. Byron Pickett is soft bodied. And Wirrpanda is a veritable marshmallow.

[Tuesday]

Originally posted by Legs Akimbo
I think the club should have a policy of ALWAYS having several aboriginal players on the list not least of all because I think clubs should commit to supporting aboriginal football and development of aboriginal players.

Bollocks. We should support those who play Australian Football. That includes women. If you were to enforce your desired indigenous rule, then the gender rule should also be enforcable.

[NMWBloods]

I think soft bodied is the wrong description.

However, indigenous players are renowned for their flair and creativity, but not for their defensive skills. Not too many tight-checking defensive Aboriginal players.

[BigBadBarryNo1]

FOr crying out loud, don't be slack guys, LETS BACK OUR MAN!

We easily forget the fact that this is the guy who had a massive impact at the end of the main season last year.

MOL has been over-shadowed because of the dominance of Hally, Lockett in their prime, and his natural style even in the earlier stages of his career were a push/niggle-a-little, run for a lead-to-goal type player. A traditional FF indigenous goal sneak / snap / banana kicker.

MOL's role has changed and evolved as the game has. I remember when he used to slacken off in Eade's games, but certainly that hasn't been the case since Roos. He actually has the desperation in his eyes to win, and passion to play for the boys.

Although his run obviously isn't as fast as a lil 18-19 yo, since he's been back this year, I've seen him run all the way back, and make some decent runs in decent weeks, and at the very least, KEPT SPEED with his man on the weekend against the Dogs, which I haven't seen him do EVER.

Also, his tackling is massive and goal-assists in the past 2 years cannot be questioned. His height which is not often mentioned is the same as ROK's (I checked on the weekend and it is!), and just finds ways to mark without jumping up because of his knees.

Admittedly because of his traditional role as FF deep in pocket, his long kicking has never been tested as much as it has been in the past couple of years, (especially in the GF!!!) but the opposition should ignore him at their peril, as I'm pretty sure the man has got the Magic to produce on ground. We don't have a FF/HF with that kind of talent, and effectiveness as a replacement (YET..).

He's still got a 2-3 years left in those knees of his, and is a massive servant for us, and goes through those ice bucket baths for us week-in week-out just to put himself in the game.

I love him, and for crying out loud, we're SWANS fans here, and lets back this talented man! :mad:

[OldE]

Originally posted by BigBadBarryNo1
I love him, and for crying out loud, we're SWANS fans here, and lets back this talented man! :mad:

I barrack for a team, not a player. As soon as a player does enough to lose my respect, be it on or off field or both, I will not back him anymore. With O'Loughlin, it's both.

[BigBadBarryNo1]

Mate one off day in a congested forward line (Roos stacked it with 8 forwards - check our official page), and being closely checked with Eade of all people KNOWING that MOL is a dangerous forward..

[Go Swannies]

I think Magic just makes our structure work better. He and Hall have a great double act happening. Without the goal he conjures we would not have been playing in the Grand Final last year.

And I love seeing him produce the impossible, year after year. Right now he's the fittest I've seen him for years but his kicking is off. Expect it to come back - and then this thread will eat crow.

[Legs Akimbo]

Originally posted by Tuesday
Bollocks. We should support those who play Australian Football. That includes women. If you were to enforce your desired indigenous rule, then the gender rule should also be enforcable.

I cannot see parallels between affirmatively supporting aboriginal football and affirmatively supporting women's football at AFL level, without trivialising an important concept.

I think Sheedy has a strong and positive view on supporting aboriginal football in both word and deed. That is what I am referring to.

As for skills, is likely that actively targetting several of the best aboriginal players in the draft will have negaqtive results for the club? Really?

[shippo]

The guy's lacking confidence. Pure and simple. He deserves to be given the chance of to find it back, i reckon.

[Gary]

I agree...but is it an open cheque...forever?
I reiterate if he was as ineffective as that for several weeks in a row...the question becomes urgent.
His body is struggling, & will probably not get better.
I hope he finds something soon.

[shippo]

No, not forever.
Fairly negative vibe to this thread though. MOL's got plenty of tickets left

[giant]

Actually I watched a fair bit of Magic - not a great night for sure but the Doggie defender (Hargarve I think?) wore him like a glove & played an excellent game. Magic gave a contest all night & probably did set up a few goals (ROK's in the last qr in particular) - not his worst performance this year by any means.

[timthefish]

Rnd Opp Result Kicks Hbl Disp Marks Goals
8 Bulldogs Win 116-90 2 4 6 1 0
7 Richmond Win 180-62 12 1 13 10 3
6 Brisbane Win 102-70 5 2 7 2 0
5 Geelong Win 107-85 13 4 17 7 1
4 Melbourne Loss 92-97 2 1 3 1 1
3 Carlton Win 81-74 10 2 12 8 4
2 Port Loss 80-106 4 1 5 3 2
1 Essendon Loss 81-108 7 1 8 6 2


Well, I was happy to have him in rounds 5 and 7 at least. particularly in the match against geelong when he was tearing the ground up demonstrating more mobility than we'd seen in years. i doubt the pattern above is real, but if it is, we might just see a strong performance from his next match.

clearly his knees still need tighter management and there is no point playing him now only to miss his experience and skill at the end of the year. rest him this week and consider leaving him out of the long trips such as subiaco and aami. while we're winning (and winning well) we can afford to do this.

then roos should probably have a chat to him about his future after this year.

[timthefish]

Originally posted by giant
Actually I watched a fair bit of Magic - not a great night for sure but the Doggie defender (Hargarve I think?) wore him like a glove & played an excellent game. Magic gave a contest all night & probably did set up a few goals (ROK's in the last qr in particular) - not his worst performance this year by any means.

agree. i think magic was lacking the take-off to get away from him though. it's not an issue of touch, desire or even general fitness - but just those damn knees of his.

[Sanecow]

Just from memory, he was robbed by the umps at least once, brought the ball to ground for a crumber to kick a goal on another. When you play along side Hall, you don't need to kick a bag to be considered effective.

[Ruck'n'Roll]

Originally posted by Sanecow
Just from memory, he was robbed by the umps at least once, brought the ball to ground for a crumber to kick a goal on another.
I agree, the umpires were allowing his opponent to get away with an awful lot against the Dogs, and his gem against the Cats was extremely good.

[liz]

Originally posted by Sanecow
Just from memory, he was robbed by the umps at least once, brought the ball to ground for a crumber to kick a goal on another. When you play along side Hall, you don't need to kick a bag to be considered effective.

Agree with that.

Also, the Swans' forward line was particularly crowded on Sat due to Roos' refusal to allow the Dogs a spare man in defence. As a unit the forward line operated very effectively, with some very impressive set plays from stoppages and accurate snaps from a number of different players. The sum of the whole is what matters, rather than the stats of individual players.

[NMWBloods]

Sometimes I think people overestimate MOL's importance in the forward line in certain games. There is often the comment that he takes a key defender - that's often not the case. He's been given a young, inexperienced defender a number of times. The whole forward line may be playing well as a unit, however we will see what MOL offers to it over the season.

[TheHood]

If ever there was a case for resting a bloke for away games, then maybe Mick is it.

It would be great to groom Vogels or even Malcevski in that kind of forward role.

Mick will be a contributor for the rest of the year but he might just get better every fortnight rather than every week!

[Tuesday]

Originally posted by Go Swannies
He and Hall have a great double act happening.

Don't they ever....

[BigBadBarryNo1]

He was a student of the old Eade days - Eade looked up at his 3- goals the previous weekend, and overall form for the season, and knew how dangerous he was last weekend, and still is (only with better run and no real injury, and playing better than then) and WELL CHECKED HIM for a week. Simple as that.

Check the stats leading up to finals last year, or for this entire year. Not just a game against your former coach's team.

Great clubman for the game, in and out with a passion in his eyes that I've NEVER seen in him before game in game out.

We need this guy, with his dangerously silky skills every game.

Nuff said.

[australian_made]

And they dont call him MAGIC for nothing! How many times have you seen this man make a goal out of thin air?

I agree with the comments regarding perhaps managing his knees a bit better to prolong his career. I totally disagree with this forced retirement drivel though! And lets not forget, he is our teams 2nd leading goalkicker at the moment behind Hall, and he kicked 52 goals for us last year

Losing a battle or two does not contitute losing the war. Im sure there is plenty of magic left in those boots of his. And a servant like MOL should be given a bit more respect from people like us. He doesnt owe us anything.

[NMWBloods]

Considering he is a major target in the forward line, second behind Hall, his return is very mixed.

[Tuesday]

Originally posted by BigBadBarryNo1
We need this guy, with his dangerously silky skills every game.

It's commentator-speak for Aboriginal.

[Sanecow]

Originally posted by Tuesday
It's commentator-speak for Aboriginal.

Yup:

Winmar (http://saints.com.au/default.asp?pg=halloffameprofile&spg=display&personid=238581)

Pickett (http://www.heraldsun.news.com.au/footy/common/story_page/0,8033,18971282%255E19768,00.html)

Rioli (slightly amusing) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dean_Rioli)

Leon Davis (http://www.afana.com/netpaper/aug20-94465.html)

[royboy42]

Sometimes there is a tendency here to jump on players after a few off peak performances..and a lot of back pedalling later...JBolton is a fine example..Give Magic a break..2 weeks ago he dominated the fwd line..and how often does the Hall to MOL..or MOL to Hall short pass tear the opposition forward line to bits!

[Ruck'n'Roll]

Originally posted by Legs Akimbo
Was watching Neon Leon destroy Geelong last night and got me contemplating about whether we should target some more indigenous players in the draft. Goodes and O'loughlin are both in their late 20's. Every team, and I think particularly ours, can benefit from the particular flair and skill of indigenous players.


Leaving aside the whole "quota" I agree with Akimbo, we could really do with someone to rove the packs up forward. I like Schneider but he's spending less time on the forward line and Monty is a far better onballer than goal-sneak. And while I'm very happy to see McVeighs current form up forward I think a Davey/Neon/Lovett with extreme speed could be a good addition to our squad, which isn't the quickest in the league.

[SimonH]

Originally posted by Tuesday
It's commentator-speak for Aboriginal. Sometimes 'electrifying', 'excitement machine' and the rather lukewarm 'mercurial' get wheeled out as well. Speaking of which, I wouldn't mind seeing another silky-skilled, electrifying excitement machine, drafted by Sydney at the end of '06.

[Tuesday]

I would like to see someone with potential drafted, irrespective of age, gender or race.

[liz]

Originally posted by Ruckman
I think a Davey/Neon/Lovett with extreme speed could be a good addition to our squad, which isn't the quickest in the league.

Ala Simon Phillips?

Will be interesting to see if Malcolm Lynch snags a spot on the rookie list next year as a "local".

[Ruck'n'Roll]

Originally posted by liz
Ala Simon Phillips?

Will be interesting to see if Malcolm Lynch snags a spot on the rookie list next year as a "local".


Forgot about him, I've only seen 1 reserves game this year, and yes his pace would certainly fit the bill.
Just as long as we don't draft any more short, stocky, midfield types with average speed . . . we seem to have a suffiency of those.

[SimonH]

Originally posted by Tuesday
I would like to see someone with potential drafted, irrespective of age, gender or race. My 2-month old (skip) daughter has almost infinite potential, then. You look at her, and the first phrase you think of is 'huge upside...'.

[Agent 86]

Originally posted by Nico
A lot of aboriginal players are soft bodied so when the real crunch comes too many in any one side doesn't stack up.
Have you ever tackled one?

[giant]

Originally posted by Agent 86
Have you ever tackled one?

:D Classic. I still can't sleep on one side of my body after I got cleaned up by an aboriginal player that made Byron look like Spider Burton. And that was 20 years ago.

[Agent 86]

Originally posted by giant
:D Classic. I still can't sleep on one side of my body after I got cleaned up by an aboriginal player that made Byron look like Spider Burton. And that was 20 years ago.
Yep. It was about the same amount of time ago that I learnt that small & black doesn't mean "soft". I can still remember it.

[BigBadBarryNo1]

Man when you get into racial lines it just gets really sad. Goodes plays like no other black fella has before him, and that goes the same with Long, who was an absolute legend as a FF.

Pickett now he's moved to the Demons and "toughened them up", has been outstanding hard body, and I'm sure no player would want to be schmackoed by him on any given day.

Absolute rubbish they are soft bodies..

[The Big Cat]

Originally posted by BigBadBarryNo1

Absolute rubbish they are soft bodies..

Agreed. And you can't call Troy Cook soft bodied or Robby Muir from the past! Polly Farmer and Barry Cable were pretty hard at it players too.

[NMWBloods]

Originally posted by BigBadBarryNo1
that goes the same with Long, who was an absolute legend as a FF. Full forward? :confused:

[ScottH]

Originally posted by NMWBloods
Full forward? :confused: Fickle Forward?

[TheHood]

Originally posted by The Big Cat
Agreed. And you can't call Troy Cook soft bodied or Robby Muir from the past! Polly Farmer and Barry Cable were pretty hard at it players too.

Chris Lewis was a hitman.

[Tuesday]

Originally posted by SimonH
My 2-month old (skip) daughter has almost infinite potential, then. You look at her, and the first phrase you think of is 'huge upside...'.

Unless she has Hutchinson-Gilford progeria syndrome, I doubt we'll be seeing her in this year's draft.

[Sanecow]

Originally posted by Tuesday
Unless she has Hutchinson-Gilford progeria syndrome

Who doesn't have it?

[msb]

Originally posted by sydneyswans1989
his kicking lets him down too much, if he could kick straighter than he would be fantastic because he presents himself & can take marks but can't convert.

Yeah and nearly cost syd the granny last year by missing around 4 shots at goal in the last qtr! I think its time for mick to go at years end or even perhaps nurse him through the rest of this year by just playing him in the games in syd, he could be sort of used as a pinchitter to jag a goal or two. This may even prolong his career further.

[Legs Akimbo]

Assistance for ailing Full forward (http://marc.med.virginia.edu/images/projects/walker2.jpg)

or maybe this

Power up version (http://www.xensory.com/blogs/robotsnext/hal5.jpg)

[Agent 86]

Originally posted by msb
Yeah and nearly cost syd the granny last year by missing around 4 shots at goal in the last qtr! I think its time for mick to go at years end or even perhaps nurse him through the rest of this year by just playing him in the games in syd, he could be sort of used as a pinchitter to jag a goal or two. This may even prolong his career further.
QUESTION: Who kicked the most goals for Sydney in the 4 Finals games of 2005?

A) MOL
B) Baz
C) Davis
D) All of the above

[NMWBloods]

D - 8.

However, MOL wins by a mile the most number of misses.

[Agent 86]

Originally posted by NMWBloods
D - 8.

However, MOL wins by a mile the most number of misses.
Correct.

His kicking in the GF was the footballing equivalent of Ian Baker-Finch's putting. But he made very worthy contributions in the first 3 finals games & would have well and truly sealed the GF if he'd converted his chances.

I think it'd be stupid to write-off a player with his experience & a proven game-breaker in BIG games.

I just wish he wouldn't fall over so much.

[NMWBloods]

He also missed an absolute gimme in the WC QF game in the 3rd qtr - about 20m out directly in front. Did the same thing against Geelong too IIRC.

[giant]

Originally posted by NMWBloods
He also missed an absolute gimme in the WC QF game in the 3rd qtr - about 20m out directly in front. Did the same thing against Geelong too IIRC.

And also kicked an absolute ripper in the WC QF when he took a handpass of (IIRC) Bucky. But I'd hate to spoil your story....

[SimonH]

To take 4 marks inside 50 in the last quarter of a GF is well-nigh unbelievable. (Did WCE get 4 marks inside 50 across the whole match?)

The net result of 0.1 from those 4 marks was appalling; but you can't criticise that without acknowledging that few other players, bung knees or not, would have created anywhere near the number of opportunities (under incredible pressure) that he did.

[SimonH]

Originally posted by NMWBloods
He also missed an absolute gimme in the WC QF game in the 3rd qtr - about 20m out directly in front. Did the same thing against Geelong too IIRC. About 20 minutes into the 3rd quarter of the 2005 Geelong SF, Magic had a tight-angle shot for goal (from about 20 metres out). Our score was about 2.12 at the time, having spent most of the quarter in attack for not a single solitary goal. I thought, 'if he misses this we're gone'. He kicked it. In retrospect, I was right: if he had missed it, we would have been gone.

Look, no-one's denying that over the last half-a-season his conversion has been less-than-great (and on occasion, very disappointing). But across his whole career it's been a very good 387.210; it's presumptuous on the evidence so far to say that this is a terminal decline rather than a trough. In particular, he's moving at least as freely as he was in 2004/5.

[Lazarus]

I think its a bit early to write off a player of MOL talent. Players are entitled to form slumps and who knows what is up with him at the moment. Give the guy a go let him regain his confidence and you will see the MOL of old.

How soon we all forget.

Remember Captain Kirk was almost a has been and now look at him.

[NMWBloods]

Originally posted by giant
And also kicked an absolute ripper in the WC QF when he took a handpass of (IIRC) Bucky. But I'd hate to spoil your story.... "My story...??" I mentioned that he missed some easy goals. Your comment makes no difference to that. Any great goals he's kicked make no difference to that.

[Agent 86]

Originally posted by NMWBloods
... Any great goals he's kicked make no difference to that.
It does when this thread is about whether he's past his use-by-date.

[cruiser]

Originally posted by giant
And also kicked an absolute ripper in the WC QF when he took a handpass of (IIRC) Bucky. But I'd hate to spoil your story.... You've noticed too huh?

[NMWBloods]

Originally posted by Agent 86
It does when this thread is about whether he's past his use-by-date. Yes, but I was simply pointing out that he missed a number of easy shots, which he shouldn't.

I haven't said that he's finished, so I'd appreciate it if people would stop inventing some "story" for me.

Or are we still not allowed to provide alternative viewpoints because some here might have a cry...

[giant]

Originally posted by NMWBloods
Or are we still not allowed to provide alternative viewpoints because some here might have a cry...

I'd be delighted if you provided an alternative viewpoint - the old one is getting a trifle dull now.

[cruiser]

Originally posted by giant
I'd be delighted if you provided an alternative viewpoint - the old one is getting a trifle dull now. He snatched my rifle.:eek:

[NMWBloods]

Originally posted by giant
I'd be delighted if you provided an alternative viewpoint - the old one is getting a trifle dull now. Which one is "the old one"?

[NMWBloods]

Originally posted by SimonH
Look, no-one's denying that over the last half-a-season his conversion has been less-than-great (and on occasion, very disappointing). But across his whole career it's been a very good 387.210; it's presumptuous on the evidence so far to say that this is a terminal decline rather than a trough. In particular, he's moving at least as freely as he was in 2004/5. I agree it's presumptuous, hence I've not said it. I think he's struggling with form at the moment, but he's one of those players who typically gets better as the season progresses.

As for his kicking, over the past couple of years he's regularly had the yips when taking easier shots. Seems to think about the easier ones too much, and jabs at them or kicks floaters.

[ROK Lobster]

I think he chokes when there is a bit of pressure on. If the score is close he would be better off playing on.

[The Big Cat]

Originally posted by Agent 86
Correct.

His kicking in the GF was the footballing equivalent of Ian Baker-Finch's putting. He took a number of high pressure marks in the last quarter of the GF. If he hadn't, we may not have won. I thought his last quarter was as important as anything in winning the flag!

[dendol]

Originally posted by The Big Cat
He took a number of high pressure marks in the last quarter of the GF. If he hadn't, we may not have won. I thought his last quarter was as important as anything in winning the flag!

I guess chewing up all that time kicking zero points allowed Leo's mark to be the last one for the game. If there was an extra minute after that mark, Leo might have gone on one of his special runs and had a "brain explosion of the century".

Mickey won us the game by shanking those kicks. Make no mistake about that.

[satchmopugdog]

I was eavesdropping at a restaurant the other night(that's what you do when you eat alone) to some people talking about the soccer player Ronaldhino and how he can make defenders go "How did he do that?"
I immediately thought of one Swans/Brisbane game at the SCG (2004????)when MOL rolled with the bal and handballed it aound/between /over /whatever Jared Brennan's legs(another silky skilled mercurial player) and the look on his face was "How did he do that?"
It is sad to see that in the 6 weeks that I have been away that this has happened to MOL

[ScottH]

Originally posted by NMWBloods
Which one is "the old one"? It's the one before the new one!!!

[NMWBloods]

Originally posted by satchmopugdog
I was eavesdropping at a restaurant the other night(that's what you do when you eat alone) to some people talking about the soccer player Ronaldhino and how he can make defenders go "How did he do that?"
I immediately thought of one Swans/Brisbane game at the SCG (2004????)when MOL rolled with the bal and handballed it aound/between /over /whatever Jared Brennan's legs(another silky skilled mercurial player) and the look on his face was "How did he do that?"
It is sad to see that in the 6 weeks that I have been away that this has happened to MOL He can still do those things. A few weeks before, against Geelong I think, his hands were good and he was creative. However, he has struggled to get involved this year.

[NMWBloods]

Originally posted by dendol
I guess chewing up all that time kicking zero points allowed Leo's mark to be the last one for the game. If there was an extra minute after that mark, Leo might have gone on one of his special runs and had a "brain explosion of the century".

Mickey won us the game by shanking those kicks. Make no mistake about that. And Luke Ablett too - if he hadn't passed it to Cousins for a goal, then we wouldn't have kicked the goals later that won us the game.

Thanks to the butterfly also...

[Sanecow]

Originally posted by NMWBloods
And Luke Ablett too - if he hadn't passed it to Cousins for a goal, then we wouldn't have kicked the goals later that won us the game.

Thanks to the butterfly also...

I know you're being facetious but that kick and goal has been seriously suggested as a (positive) turning point in the game. I think that there seemed to be a lift in intensity from the Swans following the incident.

[NMWBloods]

Really? IIRC we went a bit flat after that for about 5 minutes - they kicked another goal and missed a couple of other opportunities.

[Sanecow]

The Eagles took shots on goal all day. It's not a useful measurement of the Swans intensity.

[NMWBloods]

Originally posted by Sanecow
The Eagles took shots on goal all day. It's not a useful measurement of the Swans intensity. Not so much in the second quarter, and it was only one thing anyway.

[Agent 86]

Originally posted by NMWBloods
Really? IIRC we went a bit flat after that for about 5 minutes - they kicked another goal and missed a couple of other opportunities.
A lot of people (including me, at the time) thought we were gone if we didn't kick the next goal after the Ablett "pass". We didn't. We did (understandably) panic for a bit - but it was short-lived. The fighting spirit was still there & we somehow managed to pull it back.

[NMWBloods]

When Banfield ran into goal I thought it was gone.

[Schneiderman]

MOL is still the most elusive forward we have, and the one who can create havoc with the oppositions defensive plans. He plays both tall and crumber roles very well, and would earn a spot even on current form in every single one of the other 15 clubs forward lines.

He kicked 52 goals last year, and some of those goals (like v Essendon at the Dome or the one from a Jones error in the PF) were just awesome. He is our answer to Farmer, Davey, Williams or N Brown, and that he can play at that level even only sporadically, considering his injuries, is a real boon to the team.

If we had another play with even half of MOL's abilities on the list, then I'd be all for resting him more often. But we dont.

And as to the point of whether he takes a key defender or not, he needs a defender of quality to prevent him scoring goals. The week he kicks three he is manned up by a weaker defender, but the week he gets a key defender and is less influential, it allows a ROK or Davis to increase their output.

He is still critical to our team.

[dendol]

Originally posted by NMWBloods
And Luke Ablett too - if he hadn't passed it to Cousins for a goal, then we wouldn't have kicked the goals later that won us the game.

Thanks to the butterfly also...
I dont know how a butterfly could affect the outcome of the game, but I spilt a bit of beer on a WCE supporter in front of my at the start of the 4th qtr. He gave met he dirtiest look, swore at me, and then shouted "comeon eagles!".

Our players heard it, thought it was wrong of him to treat me this way and decided that the best way to punish him was to win the game.

In retrospect, I won us the GF, not MOL's great 4th qtr marking performance.

[NMWBloods]

The butterfly distracted Banfield just as he was kicking for goal!

[ROK Lobster]

Originally posted by dendol
I dont know how a butterfly could affect the outcome of the game, but I spilt a bit of beer on a WCE supporter in front of my at the start of the 4th qtr. He gave met he dirtiest look, swore at me, and then shouted "comeon eagles!".

Our players heard it, thought it was wrong of him to treat me this way and decided that the best way to punish him was to win the game.

In retrospect, I won us the GF, not MOL's great 4th qtr marking performance. I think that is fair enough. You have certainly done as much as LRT and there are plenty here prepared to give him a Norm Smith medal.

[The Big Cat]

Originally posted by dendol

In retrospect, I won us the GF, not MOL's great 4th qtr marking performance. MOL was one-out in the forward line when he took a couple of those marks! He spills them and the WCE are away. He won us the game. He kicks a goal with one of those kicks and it's back to the centre. More WCE goals? Who knows? All I know is that we won the game and part of the series of events which led up to that win was MOL taking those marks and not kicking goals! That is cemented in history. Any theory about MOL getting a goal or goals puts the outcome of the game into the realms of summising. MOL's performance thus inextricably led to the victorious outcome. No argument! Incidently Noggies kick to Cousins is in the same category.

[dendol]

Originally posted by ROK Lobster
I think that is fair enough. You have certainly done as much as LRT and there are plenty here prepared to give him a Norm Smith medal.
thanks for recognising the part i played last september.

[Agent 86]

I can't believe people are still bagging LuRchT. He played well above his weight in the GF & has taken on some big tasks this year and done pretty well. At this stage I don't think we could expect much more.

[dendol]

Originally posted by The Big Cat
MOL was one-out in the forward line when he took a couple of those marks! He spills them and the WCE are away. He won us the game. He kicks a goal with one of those kicks and it's back to the centre. More WCE goals? Who knows? All I know is that we won the game and part of the series of events which led up to that win was MOL taking those marks and not kicking goals! That is cemented in history. Any theory about MOL getting a goal or goals puts the outcome of the game into the realms of summising. MOL's performance thus inextricably led to the victorious outcome. No argument! Incidently Noggies kick to Cousins is in the same category.
Im sure Noggy is running around telling the whole world how his kick to Cousin's eventually won us the flag.

[Agent 86]

And on top of all that, he's multi-talented...

LRT? (http://www.rockyhorror.com/images/downloads_pics_08.jpg)

[The Big Cat]

Originally posted by dendol
Im sure Noggy is running around telling the whole world how his kick to Cousin's eventually won us the flag. Won us the flag, via the path we took? Yes, grasshopper!

[giant]

Originally posted by dendol
thanks for recognising the part i played last september.

I thought it bloody unfair you didn't get your own float in the parade. Still RWO recognition is better than nothing...

[dendol]

Originally posted by giant
I thought it bloody unfair you didn't get your own float in the parade. Still RWO recognition is better than nothing...
Yeah that knob from Collingwood took my place. What his name... that short fat dude

[giant]

Originally posted by dendol
Yeah that knob from Collingwood took my place. What his name... that short fat dude

I did mean the GF parade, not the mardi gras?

[dendol]

Originally posted by giant
I did mean the GF parade, not the mardi gras?
LOL. Well I meant that too. You know that guy Peter Hellier plays on before the game..?

[ROK Lobster]

Originally posted by Agent 86
I can't believe people are still bagging LuRchT. He played well above his weight in the GF & has taken on some big tasks this year and done pretty well. At this stage I don't think we could expect much more. LRT doesn't bug me,it's the people who have watched him evolve from useless to occasionally competent and consider that that improvement warrants AA inclusion that do.

[giant]

Originally posted by dendol
LOL. Well I meant that too. You know that guy Peter Hellier plays on before the game..?

Oh, sorry. I thought you meant Clover Moore.

[The Big Cat]

Originally posted by dendol
LOL. Well I meant that too. You know that guy Peter Hellier plays on before the game..? Strachany the collongwood rookie?

[dendol]

Originally posted by The Big Cat
Strachany the collongwood rookie?
yeah thats the guy! cant believe he was in the gf parade in his own stupid car. I guess it was the only way a Victorian team was going to be part of the GF.

[Agent 86]

Originally posted by ROK Lobster
LRT doesn't bug me,it's the people who have watched him evolve from useless to occasionally competent and consider that that improvement warrants AA inclusion that do.
Yeah... I sorta know what you mean. But all we can expect from a player is that he does what he's out there to do & anything else is a bonus. It's probably unreasonable to expect that LRT will develop into a fully instinctive player with "silky" skills.

One of the keys to our success has been the lower tier players have been given a chance to gain confidence & feel they're a part of the team. & the same for the better players when form has eluded them.

I'd rather see us perservere with players like Torture than have 40-odd players tested in senior footy by round 10.

[Sanecow]

Originally posted by Agent 86
It's probably unreasonable to expect that LRT will develop into a fully instinctive player with "silky" skills.

Yeah, I don't think you can just up and decide to be aboriginal.

[royboy42]

ROK lobster..what club is it that you're president of? Is it some outfit that promotes negative comments re almost everything?

[Sanecow]

President of his own fan club. Membership: 1.

[Go Swannies]

This might put it in perspective:

http://sydneyswans.com.au/default.asp?pg=news&spg=display&articleid=268730


Michael O'Loughlin laments about his current form . . .

While O'Loughlin has kicked 13 goals in the opening eight rounds he doesn't feel like he has performed in the last two weeks, when the Club has managed 45 goals.

"I have struggled in the last couple of weeks so to have guys like Baz running around is great and Davo has hit some good form as well," O'Loughlin said before the closed training session at the SCG on Thursday night.

The player nicknamed 'Magic' for his silky skills had a quiet game last week - "I got beaten fair and square" - however, the week prior against Richmond he had 13 touches, ten marks and nailed three six-pointers.

[NMWBloods]

Good that he recognises it, and let's hope he improves over the course of the season as he warms to it.

[Agent 86]

Originally posted by (Go Swannies) afl.com
...The player nicknamed 'Magic' for his silky skills...
There's that word again.

[Ruck'n'Roll]

". . .closed training session at the SCG on Thursday night."
Special tactics for the Hawks?

[pillowtalk]

Originally posted by NMWBloods
Good that he recognises it, and let's hope he improves over the course of the season as he warms to it.
What he said.

Yes age, mobility, wear and tear are all a factor - but there is no denying class. Our line up is much more impressive with him than without. As a soon-to-be father, he?s got a lot to play for.

[goswannie14]

Originally posted by Ruck'n'Roll
". . .closed training session at the SCG on Thursday night."
Special tactics for the Hawks? Nah...just means the reporter couldn't find which gate was unlocked.:D

[dread and might]

Bump

[NMWBloods]

MOL was pretty good last night.

[goswannie14]

Originally posted by NMWBloods
MOL was pretty good last night. Sure was, I wonder if some of the players read this forum and are spurred on to show some people how stupid they are writing champions off too early.;)

[Big Al]

Originally posted by goswannie14
Sure was, I wonder if some of the players read this forum and are spurred on to show some people how stupid they are writing champions off too early.;)

I would have though RWO was compulsory viewing for all players as we seem to know everything. Would save on coaches salaries.;)

[Tuesday]

Save Spangher!

[bigswan]

No problem with Mick. Led well, marked well, kicked pretty well. He won't be replaced until he calls it quits and rightfully so.