redandwhiteonline.com mentioned in article in AFL magazine

[Mel_C]

Not sure if anyone has read the latest edition of the AFL Magazine "4 Quarters" but there is an article from Martin Blake who is the uncle of Jude Bolton. He makes several references to redandwhiteonline.com, in particular Nico for bagging Jude every week!! He says that he and his family read the forums regularly and aren't impressed with Nico and some of the other swans supporters who post here.
He says he also feels sorry for McVeigh's and Mathew's family and hope they are smart enough to ignore the site. He said unfortunately he can't because "he is drawn to it" and that "the passion has a hold on him". Just like it does to the rest of us I suspect :) .

Here is a little of what he wrote:


Here's what I'd like to do to "Nico", that nasty piece of rat excrement. I'd have him banned from any future Swans game, because the Swannies deserve a better class of supporter, someone with a semblance of loyalty....it's one thing to slag off people you don't know; it's another to do it behind an alias like a coward.

Nico, as he calls himself, is a contributor to redandwhiteonline.com, a website for Swans fans. He's just one of hundreds of sydney supporters who have the licence to slander and whinge and hero-worship the players who run out in the colours each weekend.

Nico's favourite whipping boy is Jude Bolton who is my nephew. Nico isn't just critical. He's like this: If Jude had 25 disposals in a game, cleared the ball from the centre a half-dozen times and separated the AC joint in his shoulder while running headlong into a pack to bail out a teammate trailing behind his man, Nico would whinge about the two kicks he booted to the opposition. He's one of those "tear my membership up" supporters and in particular, he hammers Jude. "Got lucky" was Nico's resonse when Jude kicked the winning goal for Sydney against West Coast in Perth in round 11.

[DeadlyAkkuret]

Precious.

[reigning premier]

Poor little darling....

Nico you really need to take a good long hard look at urself... Fancy using a public forum to single out someone and criticise them... :rolleyes:

[reigning premier]

God... I hope McVeigh's family weren't reading this last year.... :D

[ROK Lobster]

Martin Blake was clearly playing on Nico the day Nico had the game of his life. Either that, or Nico stole his bride sometime in the 1950s.

(Personally I'm a little disappointed I missed out on a mention.)

[satchmopugdog]

Yeh but...we do say good things too surely.

I love the Swans and will never change teams...so this is a way of venting my spleen...at times. Some posters are also very tongue in cheek.

Ok....Jude is having a better year this year without as many niggling injuries. He is good eye candy and I enjoy the interviews he does in the magazine. I remember his first game at Princes Park as it was one of the first I was able to fly over Bass Strait to see to help me rebuild my life after my divorce. Saw him at the airport the next day and thought how small he was so he does a good job going into those packs.


If I was his uncle I would be very Proud..no matter what you say if you play 200 games you must have something and what he has fits in well with the club ethos.

[TheMase]

Rubbish. If he cannot write quality football publications, he should put down the pen and get on with his life.

Nobody has a 'personal attack' towards players. Some people believe that the team could benefit by an individual being replaced by another.

This game is about the team, not the individual.

[TheMase]

Oh, and the only game Jude has had 25 possessions in (year high) was against Port Adelaide back in round 9. I have not seen a lot of criticism towards Jude in recent times.

[Glenn]

Would have thought any criticism by fans was part and parcel of professional sport.

[reigning premier]

Martin Blake was clearly playing on Nico the day Nico had the game of his life. Either that, or Nico stole his bride sometime in the 1950s.

(Personally I'm a little disappointed I missed out on a mention.)

I would of thought you were a shoe in for a mention ROK....

[Big Al]

I thought Roos told his players not to read fan forums. Jude should spend time in the Reserves for not observing team rules.

Also why single out Nico, most people on here have strong opinions about Bolton.

What a hypocrite this bloke is...he bemoans the fact that Nico calls Bolton names but proceeds to call Nico a name that would most probably get him banned if he posted it on RWO. :mad:

[ROK Lobster]

I would of thought you were a shoe in for a mention ROK....I am going to have to take responsibility for that and, in a nutshell, have a good hard look at myself and my attitude. I will go over some old threads to check, but I think it is my second and third efforts that have been letting me down. I suspect that I have become content to snipe and let the post stand or fail on its own legs (relying on premiership credits, and the glory of the being the first banner competition winner - the CS still owe me a trip onto the SCG), rather than getting back in there again and again (like Bevo/Connolly) to really drive the point home. Of course the moderators don't help but if I keep my eye on the ball and not on the posters I am sure I can regain some old form. I just hope Jude's uncle isn't done bagging RWO - when you read this Marty I think Jude is a good ordinary player who has a heart as big an elephant's and the silky skills to match.

[satchmopugdog]

I am going to have to take responsibility for that and, in a nutshell, have a good hard look at myself and my attitude. I will go over some old threads to check, but I think it is my second and third efforts that have been letting me down. I suspect that I have become content to snipe and let the post stand or fail on its own legs (relying on premiership credits, and the glory of the being the first banner competition winner - the CS still owe me a trip onto the SCG), rather than getting back in there again and again (like Bevo/Connolly) to really drive the point home. Of course the moderators don't help but if I keep my eye on the ball and not on the posters I am sure I can regain some old form. I just hope Jude's uncle isn't done bagging RWO - when you read this Marty I think Jude is a good ordinary player who has a heart as big an elephant's and the silky skills to match.

Excellent form in this passage of play...veiled hints to other threads...a bit of a personal dig and a bit of home truth. Lovely passage of play.

[Nico]

I thought Roos told his players not to read fan forums. Jude should spend time in the Reserves for not observing team rules.

Also why single out Nico, most people on here have strong opinions about Bolton.

What a hypocrite this bloke is...he bemoans the fact that Nico calls Bolton names but proceeds to call Nico a name that would most probably get him banned if he posted it on RWO. :mad:

I don't know that I have called Bolton names. For sure I have have given it to him for his poor form from 2006 onwards but Martin is a bit selective because I made comment earlier in the season after about Round 3 that his form had improved.

I may have mentioned that Jude might be better off doing a bit of K-Mart modelling in the Kid's Catalogue and I have praised him for his newsletter work on player interviews. For the most though I have criticised his play not the person. Perhaps Martin should look again at the 2007 EF and tally up the centre clearances Jude got.

On the tear up my membership reference I have never been guilty of that mentality and indeed still have my ticket from '77 with all holes punched with the Bond Corporation emblazoned on it. I wonder if Martin has ever left the ground before the final siren. Now that's the measure of a true and passionate supporter: not guilty your honour.

I have the great fortune of having spent many a time in the pub before and after a game with supporters of all Melbourne Clubs, and been able to discuss the merits of footballers all and sundry, good and ordinary, and class it as an induring highlight of my life. It just doesn't get any better. Just ask P46.

After the North game we ran into a bloke who originally barracked for Melbourne then swapped to North, we reckon he followed the Tiges also at some stage because he always turned up at Swans MCG games. Some of the banter we had over the years with this dude is legendary and I am sure other Swans supporters would remember his booming voice. He was the bloke who ran onto the ground to present the Carlton players with a wooden spoon a few years ago. He makes me look like a Kindergarten teacher when he gives it to North players, and he is usually right.

Martin appears to watch the game through rose coloured glasses and that's his right, but Martin you don't understand footy culture. Come and stand with us at the footy and find out what it is like to have a fun day at the game. I guess being related to a player he mixes with the "right people" and knows other players so of course he will take the party line.

Now let me see: Jude, yep refer above, Mathews, yes I along with others have never admired his work, Crouch, well I have questioned this year and last year whether his time was up and I nothing more than thought McVeigh wasn't hard enough at the contest. Leo, I have referred to as not having much up ground vision and Yeh I did make some tongue in check comments about BBH being rewarded with permission to go to Fiji after his lucky punch on Staker. But many thought I was wrong, very wrong with that one.

That makes 1,2,3,4,5,6 players over a couple of years and I am happy to say McVeigh proved me wrong.

But I accept Martin has his opinion as does Jim Main but I reckon I am equally as intelligent as them so I reckon I am right as often as they are. I wonder if they thought as we did as a collective at Princes Park one day watching the 2's, that one Brett Kirk had not a hope in the world of making it.

[monopoly19]

He obviously hasn't been reading recently...everyone loves McVeigh these days.

I think the smartest thing to do for all who have a thin skin regarding their beloved players (whether family members or not) would be to stay far, far away from RWO. Anonymity tends to bring out the worst in people!

[Legs Akimbo]

Great rebuttal post Nico!

Martin Blake, over to you...

[ROK Lobster]

But I accept Martin has his opinion as does Jim Main but I reckon I am equally as intelligent as them so I reckon I am right as often as they are. Great post Nico, only you sell yourself too short. Keep up the good work mate - he's just jealous that you have more readers than him.

[CureTheSane]

If this bloke had the balls to reply here, he would be treated as any other Swans supporter - with respect.
However I doubt that he will engage in a conversation with regards to the ups and downs of Jude's career, which is a shame as he most likely would raise some quite insightful points.

However, it must be said that many a time Jude has had a kick for goal that should go straight through the middle 19 times out of 20 and he misses..... badly.

That in itself is enough to draw criticism, unfair or otherwise, as he seems able to bring on the 'let down' feeling regularly.

Aside form all that, you know what they say..... any publicity...... :D

[connolly]

I suspect that I have become content to snipe and let the post stand or fail on its own legs (relying on premiership credits, and the glory of the being the first banner competition winner - the CS still owe me a trip onto the SCG), rather than getting back in there again and again (like Bevo/Connolly) to really drive the point home.

Lets face it ROK you are a fringe tiggy touch wood type of player who is very iffy in the cliches.

[connolly]

But I accept Martin has his opinion as does Jim Main but I reckon I am equally as intelligent as them so I reckon I am right as often as they are. I wonder if they thought as we did as a collective at Princes Park one day watching the 2's, that one Brett Kirk had not a hope in the world of making it.

Keep taking it one post at a time and more power to your elbow

[ROK Lobster]

I suspect that I have become content to snipe and let the post stand or fail on its own legs (relying on premiership credits, and the glory of the being the first banner competition winner - the CS still owe me a trip onto the SCG), rather than getting back in there again and again (like Bevo/Connolly) to really drive the point home.

Lets face it ROK you are a fringe tiggy touch wood type of player who is very iffy in the cliches.If the game is there to be won I'll be in there tooth and nail, but if it is shot to ribbons (one way or the other) I am happy to skirt around the edges, looking for the cheap possession (or cheap shot) or the goal of the year.

[connolly]

If the game is there to be won I'll be in there tooth and nail, but if it is shot to ribbons (one way or the other) I am happy to skirt around the edges, looking for the cheap possession (or cheap shot) or the goal of the year.

We see plenty of sizzle but not sure about the sausage

[ScottH]

I find it amazing that these people who bag our people for critisizing players, have obviously never spent much time sitting in the outer, or in a pub, or discussed footy around the water cooler on a Monday morning.

You here the same @@@@ at these places that you read here, it's just a more public place and read by many more people than just the people in immediate earshot in a pub/crowd.

Got to a tigers game Martin, those fans really do it their own, and I'm sure there are many other fans who are just as critical of players from their clubs. It does not necessarily mean they are no more of a fan than the next person.

At least it is free publicity!!! :D

[ROK Lobster]

We see plenty of sizzle but not sure about the sausageYou're a rookie son. Many of my 7000 posts have been hard ball gets - and I have the grass stains to prove it.

[CureTheSane]

I
Got to a tigers game Martin

I don't wanna go to a Tigers game :(

Oh, hang on, you were talking to...... :D

[ScottH]

I don't wanna go to a Tigers game :(

Oh, hang on, you were talking to...... :D

Mind you don't stray from the path on the way to grannys place

[NMWBloods]

I find it amazing that these people who bag our people for critisizing players, have obviously never spent much time sitting in the outer, or in a pub, or discussed footy around the water cooler on a Monday morning. Or reading or listening to the media!

[NMWBloods]

You're a rookie son. Many of my 7000 posts have been hard ball gets - and I have the grass stains to prove it.
And plenty of head bandages!

[MarshallG]

You're a rookie son. Many of my 7000 posts have been hard ball gets - and I have the grass stains to prove it.

I think forums have become the 21st century version of lunchboxes.

[ShockOfHair]

I was shocked (to my hair!) to hear Roosy say he advised players not to read RWO.

It can only do the lads good to go online and see that, no matter how well they play, there'll be someone on RWO calling for them to be dropped, or at least delisted and their house burnt down. After last week's woeful performance, god knows they need some mental toughening.

As for Roosy, I'd say come on down, choose a handle, sign up and log in to RWO. As a coach, you're supposed to speak to the media once a week. Why not do it on RWO? We know one journalist who reads it religiously.

[Nico]

I pay my membership year in year out and when players who get paid outrageous wages put in shocker after shocker or belt someone for no other reason but, "I said I couldn't guarantee it wouldn't happen again" in his 3rd match back, then I reckon I am entitled to question what in the hell is going on.

If we all followed Marty's and Jimmy's mantra there would be a half dozen hand clapping supporters in outer every week. One thing is for sure, by continuing to bag RWO they will get their free tickets to all the club functions.

Journos have to remember that without the card carrying, cheering supporters they would be reporting on flower shows every week for the Womens Weekly.

[hot potato]

It appears Martin Blake has written an article without doing any accurate research on what Nico has posted re Jude, he has just concocted some thing he thinks is like what Nico would say... which is very poor for an actual article in a published journal.

[Mogg0]

You guys are a bunch of dickheads sometimes. The exaggerated negativity often displayed on these forums leaves us wide open for taunting and belittling, and its all we deserve. It's fantastic to see the Egos defending themselves and spewing forth @@@@e analogies in an attempt to be funny. All you're doing is reinforcing the stigma that we're BIG INTERNET TOUGHGUYS.

Embarrassing.

Marty has a point.

[smasher]

I was pleased to see the Swannies getting some good publicity although I don't know how many people read "4 Quarters".
The story on Jude Bolton gave great insight as to what he goes through to play our great game at the highest level.I thought it was a good read.

[Big Al]

For sure
But I accept Martin has his opinion as does Jim Main but I reckon I am equally as intelligent as them so I reckon I am right as often as they are. I wonder if they thought as we did as a collective at Princes Park one day watching the 2's, that one Brett Kirk had not a hope in the world of making it.

Great post Nico, certainly shows a lot more class than Blake does.

[ROK Lobster]

You guys are a bunch of dickheads sometimes. The exaggerated negativity often displayed on these forums leaves us wide open for taunting and belittling, and its all we deserve. It's fantastic to see the Egos defending themselves and spewing forth @@@@e analogies in an attempt to be funny. All you're doing is reinforcing the stigma that we're BIG INTERNET TOUGHGUYS.

Embarrassing.

Marty has a point.It's a forum for opinions, conversations and humour good and bad. All that differentiates this from a conversation at the pub is that the words hang around for longer and the dickheads in the corner that would not otherwise hear you (or you hear them) get an earful of every word you say - each thread generally has about 4 conversations at once going on (with a 100 or so? regular posters you will never get consensus of opinion, a set sense of humour, a standard of impropriety or general evenness in cognitive abilities).

Who cares if we are taunted or belittled or seen as big internet toughguys - whatever that means? Martin Blake's opinion is as valid as anyone else's, except that he is clearly very subjective in his point of view and seems incapable of entering into a rational dialogue, relying on the "not a real fan" argument for anyone critical of the catalogue man. People that worry about other people's egos on here must have some sort of inferiority complex imo. Granted, it's probably warranted, but there is no need to make it public.

[CureTheSane]

You guys are a bunch of dickheads sometimes. The exaggerated negativity often displayed on these forums leaves us wide open for taunting and belittling, and its all we deserve. It's fantastic to see the Egos defending themselves and spewing forth @@@@e analogies in an attempt to be funny. All you're doing is reinforcing the stigma that we're BIG INTERNET TOUGHGUYS.

Embarrassing.

Marty has a point.

That post was written just as a big internet tough guy would write a post - slamming us all down :(
You internet bully, you.

Uh-oh, I think I am using humor :eek:
I appologise for my attempted humor.
I didn't mean to try and be tough......

:confused:

[stellation]

Martin Blake's opinion is as valid as anyone else's
I think you've hit the nail on the head there to some degree, albeit from a different angle. I honestly think the traditional sporting media must be concerned about the growth in fan sites and discussion forums, primarily because they give someone the opportunity to view the opinions of a number of different people in a central spot- and it is quite likely they will come up with the view that the opinions of a number of those people are just as valid as some guy writing for the paper. With a fan site it is more often than not interactive, so obviously lends itself to being more enjoyable to some (most?) people.

With sports reporting in Australia articles seem to fall into the categories of match preview, match review, opinion pieces, interviews and rumours (Scoops! Young men drink and do stupid things!); I think it is fair to say that the first 3 of those categories are the bulk of media articles written, and they also happen to be the ones that match closest to the content provided by fan sites (ignoring the fan site forum's ability to provide such rumour scoops as "my mate knows the strapper and he reckons Toohey likes a bit too much of his namesake's product"). Traditional sporting media will always have its place, and I assume will always have greater access to players, coaches, medical staff, front office people, board members and agents associated with a given sport to be able to do interviews or get an inside word. A really quick scan over Martin's listed work (http://www.realfooty.com.au/experts/martin-blake/) suggests the bulk of it falls most definitely into the opinion piece category.

Traditional sporting media writes for a larger audience, whereas a contributor to a fan site knows there will always be nerd interested in debating how many contests Nick Davis let his opponent win in a specific quarter of a game. Traditional sporting media outlets will always have a market there, they are much closer to the "passing interest" end of the spectrum where as RWO is closer to the "crazed obsession". When was the last time we saw a write up of the magoos in the SMH that was equivalent to the fine work produced for RWO?

What I find a tad offensive is Martin's suggestion that someone on a fan forum that is critical of a Swans player is not a real fan; by the simple act of contributing to this site, and in Nico's case it has been a consistent contribution over a long period of time, I'd argue that someone is perhaps more likely to be a passionate fan than the bulk of Martin's regular audience as they've sought out another avenue to further discuss their team; obviously the argument could also be made for them being a passionate whinger as they've sought out another avenue to complain ( ;) ), but I know that most certainly is not the case with the majority of posts I've read from Nico over the years.

The people writing on this site, regardless of whether they fall in Davo or Bevo camp ;) , are doing it because they are passionate about the Swans and/or footy in general. Martin writes about the Swans and expects to receive payment. Whilst I'm sure he is passionate and proud of his nephew's endeavours (which he should be), if I was to take the broad "don't know him but I'll choose to make blah judgement" approach, that Martin has taken himself, I know who I'd think is the "real fan".

[CureTheSane]

Anyone else get a bit pissed off when these media blokes come out and rag on pissy little internet message boards?

And I say that in the context of them having a wide audience through the media and are happy to be as critical of, say, footballers as they like, and then log onto Google, do a search, find a message board which contains 'no-bodies' airing their opinions, which may be different to theirs.

Then they get upset and write about those posters as if their opinions are unfair and unwarranted and not worth reading.

However they have given those opinions credence by writing about them, thereby perpetuating the cycle.

Fools.

[Legs Akimbo]

You guys are a bunch of dickheads sometimes. The exaggerated negativity often displayed on these forums leaves us wide open for taunting and belittling, and its all we deserve. It's fantastic to see the Egos defending themselves and spewing forth @@@@e analogies in an attempt to be funny. All you're doing is reinforcing the stigma that we're BIG INTERNET TOUGHGUYS.

Embarrassing.

Marty has a point.

Curious that you say 'you' for dickheads and 'us' for RWO.

Why does 'Marty' (interesting level of familiarity there), have a point? 'Marty' has insinuated lots of things about Nico based on his dislike of what Nico has written about his nephew on this site (which he continues to read anyway, unlike most on this site who don't read his rag). Nico has corrected 'Marty'. Several others, myself included, appreciated the quality of Nico's post, which I think is at least as good as 'Marty's opinion piece, and at the least does not include fictions about 'Marty'.

Some made a bit of a joke of it all -fair enough. Whilst hardly sparkling repartee (apologies ROK and Connelly), their posts were more amusing than 'Marty' threatening physical violence against Nico (if that was indeed an attempt at humour rather than simply the bellicose threat of a vicariously aggrieved uncle).

I was quite irritated by the superior tone of your post. Then again, within bounds, anyone can post anything they like here, and that's the beauty of it. Maybe 'Marty' should have posted here because it is probably a better forum for such vitriol than his rag. Embarrassing.

[satchmopugdog]

Talk about proud uncles....there would be some very pleased English teachers out there at the moment(for youse lot). No matter what the opinion the arguments are being provided at an excellent level. Interesting reading.

[Robbo]

This Martin Blake bloke obviously has no @@@@ing idea.

I wouldn't worry Nico.

And no Blake's opinion on Jude Bolton is not as valid as anyone else's.

[Mogg0]

Curious that you say 'you' for dickheads and 'us' for RWO.

I tend to steer clear from being overly critical, and I pride myself on maintaining perspective, something which a few of the posters have a problem with. I criticise, whine and get frustrated like anyone else on here, but I don't post knee-jerk reactions and you'll never see me start up threads to specifically criticise a certain player. It is both narrow-minded and useless. For those reasons, I think I sit outside the dickhead category.

On the topic of Marty Blake, I simply see where he is coming from with his opinions of this board. We are probably among the Swans most hardcore fans, and because we have the vehicle to discuss the Swans and their every move, it is easy to lose perspective. What frustrates me is the fact alot of us completely remove emotion and fail to see the motives behind people's opinions. OF COURSE Marty is going to defend his son from wayward criticism. Why is his choice to publicly defend Jude him a license for us to undermine and question his opinion?

[Legs Akimbo]

OF COURSE Marty is going to defend his son from wayward criticism.

I think Marty owes his brother an explanation!

[liz]

I think Marty owes his brother an explanation!

I'm guessing his sister (or brother-in-law).

[Legs Akimbo]

I'm guessing his sister.

That's even worse

[satchmopugdog]

That's even worse

Why????????????

[Legs Akimbo]

Why????????????

Nephew and Son????????????

[Tempted to add line about Tasmanian's but will refrain]

[Captain]

I think Blake is absolutely spot on.

It's one thing to criticise players, however it's the intense and passionate dislike shown by a couple of posters on here that I think Blake is referring too.

I have thought for several years that Nico's posting shows a dislike of players like Bolton and Crouch. Obviously this is my interpretation only, but as has been mentioned several times everyone interprets things differently and has a different opinion.

Most people on here wouldn't appreciate members of their family being constantly bagged by anonymous posters, you can't blame Blake for taking offence.

[AnnieH]

Blake should take a chillax pill. I'm sure I have one spare I can lend him.

[Mogg0]

I'm guessing his sister (or brother-in-law).

:rolleyes:

Nice to know that not even the moderators are immune to the ol 'undermine detractor's reputation' tactic. I've nothing to do with Marty Blake, if any of you had a clue you'd have seen me signature, recognised that Schaefer is quite a decorated name in Swans history and has no connection to Blake or Bolton.

[ROK Lobster]

Oops, I think you misread it.

[ScottH]

:rolleyes:

Nice to know that not even the moderators are immune to the ol 'undermine detractor's reputation' tactic. Hardly. I think if you have another read , you'll see liz was just pointing out an obvious flaw in Legs comment, about being a brother, which would mean that both Jude and Martin, would have the same surname.

[Mogg0]

ROK: You'll probably get an infraction for that. I so happened to question your intent last night and recieved one. Ah well.

Still, my point stands. I've long been of the opinion that we go hammer and tongs with it in here and leave ourselves open for casual observers to label us as a bit mental.

Edit: If so, I apologise.

[satchmopugdog]

:rolleyes:

Nice to know that not even the moderators are immune to the ol 'undermine detractor's reputation' tactic. I've nothing to do with Marty Blake, if any of you had a clue you'd have seen me signature, recognised that Schaefer is quite a decorated name in Swans history and has no connection to Blake or Bolton.

Jeepers you misread that big time. You said Blake's son when it was nephew and then there was aplay on the relationship stuff meaning Blake had upset his sister!!!!!!!!!!!!Duh

[ROK Lobster]

ROK: You'll probably get an infraction for that. I so happened to question your intent last night and recieved one. Ah well.

Still, my point stands. I've long been of the opinion that we go hammer and tongs with it in here and leave ourselves open for casual observers to label us as a bit mental.

Edit: If so, I apologise.Me and the moderators are thick as thieves, don't worry about me.

[Nico]

Jim Main's book has one Keith Schaefer who played for the Swans in 1947-53 for 103 games and 22 goals. The chap that took me to the footy as a kid said that he was a handy centreman. Played one for Vic and was B&F in
1952.

I have a recollection of a Schaefer playing in the 60's but could have been in the 2's. Could be more as I am quoting from the Jim Main Swiss Cheese.

[Mogg0]

Jim Main's book has one Keith Schaefer who played for the Swans in 1947-53 for 103 games and 22 goals. The chap that took me to the footy as a kid said that he was a handy centreman. Played one for Vic and was B&F in
1952.

I have a recollection of a Schaefer playing in the 60's but could have been in the 2's. Could be more as I am quoting from the Jim Main Swiss Cheese.

Yeah, that's the one. He was nominated for Team of The Century but didn't make the final team. In 52' I think, he was favourite for the Brownlow but didn't get a single vote. Dad said he never really got over it. He retired in his prime to coach a local Melbourne team after '53 and lived a quiet life in Glen Waverley until dying in the mid 70's from bowel cancer. I wasn't born until 86 so I never got to meet him, but I've heard all the stories. Me and Dad were invited to the Team of the Century dinner. One of the best nights of my life, that one.

Speaking of Main, he still has all the memorabilia we donated the club from the book given away on Team Of The Century night. Bastard.

[Nico]

Yeah, that's the one. He was nominated for Team of The Century but didn't make the final team. In 52' I think, he was favourite for the Brownlow but didn't get a single vote. Dad said he never really got over it. He retired in his prime to coach a local Melbourne team after '53 and lived a quiet life in Glen Waverley until dying in the mid 70's from bowel cancer. I wasn't born until 86 so I never got to meet him, but I've heard all the stories. Me and Dad were invited to the Team of the Century dinner. One of the best nights of my life, that one.

Speaking of Main, he still has all the memorabilia we donated the club from the book given away on Team Of The Century night. Bastard.

How did he end up with the stuff?

Jim Main - 0 games, 0 goals

[bedford]

Yeah, that's the one. He was nominated for Team of The Century but didn't make the final team. In 52' I think, he was favourite for the Brownlow but didn't get a single vote. Dad said he never really got over it. He retired in his prime to coach a local Melbourne team after '53 and lived a quiet life in Glen Waverley until dying in the mid 70's from bowel cancer. I wasn't born until 86 so I never got to meet him, but I've heard all the stories. Me and Dad were invited to the Team of the Century dinner. One of the best nights of my life, that one.

Speaking of Main, he still has all the memorabilia we donated the club from the book given away on Team Of The Century night. Bastard.
Main does think hes the only south/sydney fan to ever live,would use his media pass to get into games,probly never brought a membership

[liz]

Hardly. I think if you have another read , you'll see liz was just pointing out an obvious flaw in Legs comment, about being a brother, which would mean that both Jude and Martin, would have the same surname.


Jeepers you misread that big time. You said Blake's son when it was nephew and then there was aplay on the relationship stuff meaning Blake had upset his sister!!!!!!!!!!!!Duh

Hopefully these two observations have addressed Moggo's concerns. They are both spot on in explaining my comment.

[Mogg0]

Yeah, I apologised for it.

I don't mind Main, he's a nice bloke and 'Plugger and The Mighty Swans' was a good read. Tends to cop it because he dares to have a loud opinion and sometimes sways in his objectivity.

[stellation]

Yeah, I apologised for it.

I don't mind Main, he's a nice bloke and 'Plugger and The Mighty Swans' was a good read. Tends to cop it because he dares to have a loud opinion and sometimes sways in his objectivity.
And the difference between that and people who post on this site is?

[swantastic]

I've had hard ball gets - and I have the grass stains to prove it.The grass stains aren't from the hard ball gets.

[Industrial Fan]

The grass stains aren't from the hard ball gets.I would argue the opposite Mr Humphreys!

[Doctor J.]

What a hypocrite this bloke is...he bemoans the fact that Nico calls Bolton names but proceeds to call Nico a name that would most probably get him banned if he posted it on RWO. :mad:

Big big difference, Big Al, which I am surprised you can't see.

Martin Blake puts his name to it and goes further by declaring a personal interest. Nico can contact him and speak to him directly about it if he has an issue with his comments. Could even challenge him in the court system, if he felt so inclined.

On the other hand, who the @@@@ is Nico? Nico can, and does spew his opinion based vitriol under a heavily guarded sheild of anonimity. If you dare attack Nico personally, (as Nico does Jude) I'm certain one of the mods will protect his precious feelings by deleting the post. Been done before, so I can assume it will happen again.

Jude Bolton, or anyone else for that matter doesn't have that luxury when Nico launches his attacks.

[Triple B]

You should have been a carpenter, not a doctor.

Another nail hit perfectly flush on the head. Well said.

[Doctor J.]

I find it amazing that these people who bag our people for critisizing players, have obviously never spent much time sitting in the outer, or in a pub, or discussed footy around the water cooler on a Monday morning.



That Scott is one massive assumption you have just made.

[ScottH]

That Scott is one massive assumption you have just made.

Yes, but my point is sitting amongst the faithful for which ever club you follow, there are those that hurl all sorts of abuse at their own players, even the Swans. Not everyone falls into that category, usually they are venting at the 3 M&M's on the ground.

[CJK]

Precious.

As precious as most of the responses here.

Delicious irony.

[SimonH]

Big big difference, Big Al, which I am surprised you can't see.

Martin Blake puts his name to it and goes further by declaring a personal interest. Nico can contact him and speak to him directly about it if he has an issue with his comments. Could even challenge him in the court system, if he felt so inclined.

On the other hand, who the @@@@ is Nico? Nico can, and does spew his opinion based vitriol under a heavily guarded sheild of anonimity. If you dare attack Nico personally, (as Nico does Jude) I'm certain one of the mods will protect his precious feelings by deleting the post. Been done before, so I can assume it will happen again.

Jude Bolton, or anyone else for that matter doesn't have that luxury when Nico launches his attacks.The anonymity issue tends to be rather overstated. (And I'm sure that you're well aware of the irony of you writing under a nom de plume to get across your point that a guy shouldn't make attacks without revealing his real name.) I think by consistent style of writing and themes, we can be satisfied that there is one guy who uses the nom de plume 'Nico'-- it's not a whole Weather Underground-style team. Suppose we were to get the missing information that you and Blake apparently crave: his name is Steve Parrish. Or Wie Xian. Or Ricardo Montalban. The conclusion from this pulling-away of the mask: so what? He's not famous. One name is as good as another to those who don't know him. It would make absolutely no difference to anyone's assessment of the accuracy of his opinions. The 'no legal recourse' argument is specious, as litigation always goes after the largest liable target: the publisher in the case of newspapers/magazines/books, or the organisers/publishers of online forums in the case of anonymous comments made on them. As is the 'you can't abuse him' argument: your complaint is that you can't use RWO as your soapbox to broadcast abuse of him. If you want to abuse him personally: just send him a PM. If you want to abuse him to the world: you can set up a 'Nico is a w***er' blog with appropriate links to make out your case, in 5 minutes flat. If no-one knows what the real name of Nico is, your blog couldn't even be defamatory.

Equally and oppositely, Martin Blake puts a name on his articles because that's what professional journalists do. Not because he's a warm and welcoming guy who wants the world to be able to speak directly to him. Nico is able to respond through the publisher because it's an accepted part of running newspapers/periodicals that you accept and respond to complaints about your articles, and/or publish letters. That is an institutional responsibility-- not a personal one. Martin Blake might feel like writing something directly in response to Nico, if Nico wrote to him, but he's not obliged by his profession to do so. (And Nico did write something, in a tone more moderate than many journos use when they're attacked, in response to Blake's attack on him.) Nico is neither invited nor probably welcome to track down Martin Blake at his home or in his personal life to remonstrate with him about what he's written. Anything personal about Martin Blake's life that we know, is because he voluntarily told us. Apart from those tidbits of information, that I and most other readers have no way of verifying the accuracy of, beyond just taking his word for it, 'Martin Blake' is just another handle for me.

The only actual difference between the two is the internal psychological effect that anonymous posting can have on people. That's a complex and interesting area, but it boils down to the proposition: 'people will behave worse if they think they're not accountable to anyone for their actions'. This is sometimes true. But:
a) only sometimes, and only for some people; and
b) where people have invested something of themselves in a particular online community, the threat of exclusion from that community is a real incentive; and so the fear of being either harshly judged or excluded from the community entirely (by moderators) does introduce an element of accountability. Regardless of the fact that the moderators also don't know the person's real name.

[Young Blood]

I've just read the Blake article for myself.

I have to agree that Nico's abuse of Jude has been among the ugliest I've read on RWO. But I think it's off the mark to criticise Nico as a coward for making the comments under an 'alias' - that's just the way that these forums work.

[stellation]

Actually, Nico- has Martin Blake ever attempted to contact you through the site to discuss your views about Jude?

Reading the message given to non registered folks it clearly states they can easily join and send a message to someone who posts on the site, surely Martin could actually attempt to PM a poster?


By joining our free community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM),

[ScottH]

I've just read the Blake article for myself.

I have to agree that Nico's abuse of Jude has been among the ugliest I've read on RWO. But I think it's off the mark to criticise Nico as a coward for making the comments under an 'alias' - that's just the way that these forums work.

I wouldn't call it abuse, but it is criticism, and not all of it is unwarranted.
Jude has been a favourite of mine since he started, I had him pegged as a future captain in the early years, but he has failed to live up to my high hopes in recent years. Still no one is above criticism.

[ScottH]

Actually, Nico- has Martin Blake ever attempted to contact you through the site to discuss your views about Jude?

Reading the message given to non registered folks it clearly states they can easily join and send a message to someone who posts on the site, surely Martin could actually attempt to PM a poster?

That may require some of Judes courage to do that.

[Doctor J.]

I wouldn't call it abuse, but it is criticism, and not all of it is unwarranted.


So labelling someone as a "hack choker" is not abuse. Just criticism

Interesting values you have Scott.

[AnnieH]

So labelling someone as a "hack choker" is not abuse. Just criticism

Interesting values you have Scott.

When you're calling a footballer who is playing football a "hack choker", I'm pretty sure you're talking about the way that person is playing football. You are not insinuating that the person is a "hack choker" off the football field.

[hammo]

I've never forgiven Jude for missing two set shots in the grand final in '06 and he's consistently missed them since. It was a fair enough statement from Nico that he got lucky against West Coast, based on Jude's track record with set shots.

Blake can be a supportive uncle but in doing so he probably only sees the good qualities and skims over the bad. I'm sure I've read interviews with Jude where he admits himself that he's missed more crucial goals than he should have.

[Young Blood]

I wouldn't call it abuse, but it is criticism, and not all of it is unwarranted.

Jude has certainly warranted criticism, but IMO Nico (and others - but in the case of Jude, particularly Nico) has often been abusive.

I'd like to add that on most other topics I've found Nico to be a good contributor to RWO.

[ScottH]

So labelling someone as a "hack choker" is not abuse. Just criticism

Interesting values you have Scott.

OK, I'll sound like a polly (or coach)
I don't recall that being said.

Not a pleasant term, I agree. Neither is McHack, and all the other names that have been used over the years. I personally don't like a lot of things said on this board, but then to edit them would be censorship. I don't like a lot of the angst about other clubs that is said, here either, but I let it slide and ignore it.

Trust me I do have values, and if Nico has said that I would've cringed and ignored it, like I do a lot of things said here. I don't like everything that Nico writes, or many other things that other posters write, but I'm not censoring it all either.

[Industrial Fan]

I don't like a lot of the angst about other clubs that is said, here either, but I let it slide and ignore it.

Trust me I do have values..Not a real fan.

[ScottH]

Not a real fan.

No, Sorry. :o

[goswannie14]

OK, I'll sound like a polly (or coach)
I don't recall that being said.

Not a pleasant term, I agree. Neither is McHack, and all the other names that have been used over the years. I personally don't like a lot of things said on this board, but then to edit them would be censorship. I don't like a lot of the angst about other clubs that is said, here either, but I let it slide and ignore it.

Trust me I do have values, and if Nico has said that I would've cringed and ignored it, like I do a lot of things said here. I don't like everything that Nico writes, or many other things that other posters write, but I'm not censoring it all either.

Nico once called him a "hack and choker", I believe that both terms referred to his football as Nico (and many others) saw it. Not of Jude as a person.

Read post 35. (http://www.redandwhiteonline.com/forum/showthread.php?t=20421&page=2&highlight=hack+choker)

[CureTheSane]

He is a skilled footballer, who has contributed to the team over his time there.
Of late he is missing heaps of easy set shots (=choker)
He is also not regarded as the best kick in the land(=possibly a hack in that area)
He does put his body in and on the line, and tackles and chases and handballs well generally.

It does appear that we can well say what the hell we like about Bolton though, as his uncle had the balls to slam RWO in the media, but not enough balls to back it up here.
So who is stopping us?
If you don't like it, do something about it.
If you just sit and complain about what is being said here and don't become active, it will never change.
So by that line of reasoning, to a degree we have his blessing in whatever we say :D

[voodooguru]

Earlier, I was commenting on the "situation" at second ruck. In deference to Peter Everitt's (reported :)) sensibilities, instead of referring to him as Petered Out, I thought Petered Out? was much fairer.

I also chose not to refer to another "suspect" at second ruck as Lurch, because of the way he (kinda) Lurches around.

Okay. I admit it - it's because he looks like Lurch, but if he called me Jabba the Gut, with the Double Bubble Trouble Butt - I'd just laugh until I had a heart attack.:D :D :eek:

I think things do get out of hand sometimes, especially when it comes to players who been in the service of the club for a long time. Call for them to be dropped. Call for them to be dropped off a cliff if you want, but do it with good humour and respect for them as servants of the club.

I remember last season when Ernie The K and others were calling for the head of Young McHack. I called him Triple M, Much-Maligned McVeigh.

Just one man/boobs opinion, and he lurches around too.

[reigning premier]

The only thing that @@@@s me about Jude's game today is that this smug @@@@ will think he was right..... :rolleyes:

Perhaps someone could right an article about how hard a time Playfair cops on RWO?? It seemed to work for Jude.

[Gary]

Notice reference to Playfair. Haven't been around RWO much lately. I like his enthusiasm but his disposal is Brennan like..which suggests he will not make the most of his ops up forward. What justifies his extended stay in the team? Interested in opinions.

[ScottH]

Notice reference to Playfair. Haven't been around RWO much lately. I like his enthusiasm but his disposal is Brennan like..which suggests he will not make the most of his ops up forward. What justifies his extended stay in the team? Interested in opinions.

Who knows? But he has been doing a good job of it.

I noted yesterday, that he seems more comfortable kicking to a leading player than taking a set shot.

[AnnieH]

Who knows? But he has been doing a good job of it.

I noted yesterday, that he seems more comfortable kicking to a leading player than taking a set shot.

I think Hank has slotted in pretty well this year.
Same for Marty.

[reigning premier]

I think Hank has slotted in pretty well this year.


Great mark..... Can't fault his enthusiasm.....

But oh my lord that set shot kicking..... :rolleyes:

[AnnieH]

Great mark..... Can't fault his enthusiasm.....

But oh my lord that set shot kicking..... :rolleyes:


He's not the only one RP - Jude Bolton ring a bell??

[DST]

Notice reference to Playfair. Haven't been around RWO much lately. I like his enthusiasm but his disposal is Brennan like..which suggests he will not make the most of his ops up forward. What justifies his extended stay in the team? Interested in opinions.

Is actually a very smart footballer, knows when to lead and to where, which makes him critical to our structure at present without Hall and probably MOL in the next couple of weeks.

Only thing holding himself back is his kicking for goal (field kicking is nothing special but at AFL standard).

It's always had to break kicking for goal habits, but as long as they can find work out a routine that he is comfortable with he should be able to improve his kicking for goal.

DST
:D

[NMWBloods]

Only thing holding himself back is his kicking for goal (field kicking is nothing special but at AFL standard).

It's always had to break kicking for goal habits, but as long as they can find work out a routine that he is comfortable with he should be able to improve his kicking for goal.
I can't think of a single player who has improved his kicking at goal well into his AFL career. This is his sixth season. I think it is unlikely we will see much improvement in his goalkicking.

However, it's interesting that, as ScottH noted, his field kicking is reasonably accurate so he is a prime candidate for focussing on passing to someone in the crowd when shooting for goal.

[voodooguru]

He's not the only one RP - Jude Bolton ring a bell??
Robert Harvey is worse. B1 won one off his boot so thats a bonus. Just one manboob's opinion.

EDIT: Henry Kickfair is looking better in front of the sticks lately and all.

[ScottH]

However, it's interesting that, as ScottH noted, his field kicking is reasonably accurate so he is a prime candidate for focussing on passing to someone in the crowd when shooting for goal.:D

[liz]

I can't think of a single player who has improved his kicking at goal well into his AFL career. This is his sixth season. I think it is unlikely we will see much improvement in his goalkicking.



Cressa did.

[bedford]

Would much prefer White in the team after watching Playbad close up on Sunday,Carton were just running off him and Micky o.
Apart from his kicking which is not up to league standard he looks slow when the opposition has the footy.