I just got home....

[Charlie]

... from my sister's 21st and saw the scores....

DISASTER!!!!

[Charlie]

btw I'm in chat if anyone wants to join me.

[anniswan]

I suggest you go back to the party charlie, you will have a better time

Ann

[Charlie]

I asked.... but dad wouldn't come get me back!!!!

Lol..... I'm here to the end.

Charlie

[Charlie]

Positive signs
Schneider
J.Bolton
Goodes
Powell
Thewlis

:):) :)

[Dpw]

Thirty seconds left and were down by 32pts
One word SKILLS - we have none

[NMWBloods]

Goodes was okay, but we really need to have our ruckmen fit this year as he can't do both so well.

I think also Luke Ablett showed he might be able to play this year.

Some of the young guys, such as Schneider were promising.

I think Bolton was very ordinary with his disposal again.

Kennelly will have to do a lot to improve further on his previous years if tonight was any guide.

As usual our skill level was poor. Delivery into the forward line was very very ordinary. Back line work as rather average. Skill level around the ground was weak.

I think about an 11th place finish is what I expect.

We are too small to compete effectively, and we lack major key position players.

[Jimmy C]

Let's not feel too bad about this, eh folks? We fielded more kids than we ever have in recent years, against what still appears to be the best side in the comp. At least the kids got to play the awesome juggernaut that is the Brisbane Lions and (hopefully) went away with some invaluable experience that they were never going to get in the ACT comp.

CARNA BLOODS!

[Reggi]

It isn't a skill problem it simply is body strength, Sydney's younger players simply aren't strong enough to compete with Brisbane.

Positives

Goodes - wasted in the ruck
S Stevens - may well blossom as a floating forward
J Bolton - but still needs to improve
L Ablett - will play this season

Will debute this year but looked good for the future

Powell
Schneider
Dempster

[Dpw]

Originally posted by Reggi
It isn't a skill problem it simply is body strength, Sydney's younger players simply aren't strong enough to compete with Brisbane.

Positives

Goodes - wasted in the ruck
S Stevens - may well blossom as a floating forward
J Bolton - but still needs to improve
L Ablett - will play this season

Will debute this year but looked good for the future

Powell
Schneider
Dempster

mate, it was very much a skill problem you can't tell me there's not something wrong when player upon player trys to kick 20m plus passes of one step. Basics - I thought we were all tought that in little league

[gloveski]

I didn't see the game but it is all about giving the youngsters a taste this time of year.

It's good to see from reports that Ablett looked o.k

[CureTheSane]

I didn't see the game, but 30 odd points is by no means a disaster against thge reigning premiers.

I refuse to read anything into a pre season game, especially after reading how Roos was treating it....

[SWANSBEST]

I think Reggi did a very good summary. I was very impressed with Stevens , he played well all over the park.. . I think that Goddes could be a great ruck rover or centreman but not a straight ruckman. Some of the very young players did some good things but only in patches. The hit out will do them the world of good.
Brisbane must be favourites for the Flag again . All players seem physically strong while our players lack strength. But given time the younger players will fill out and most showed enough for supporters to be reasonably confident for the long term. AT LEAST WE DID NOT BUY WASHED UP HAS BEENS THIS YEAR.

[Reggi]

Originally posted by Dpw
mate, it was very much a skill problem you can't tell me there's not something wrong when player upon player trys to kick 20m plus passes of one step. Basics - I thought we were all tought that in little league

All clubs have turnovers - constantly being under physical pressure exacerbates it, you wouldn't call players like Mal Michael well skilled but they are composed because they they have the bodystrength to hold their ground and get rid of the ball. Players who suffer under physical pressure always look less skilled because they have to get rid of the ball faster.

Exceptions are Mathews and Warfe who seem to have brain explosions constantly.

[TheMase]

Josh Thewlis.

I really like the look of this kid. He should play a bit of senior footy this year. Impressed me a lot.

In fact all of the youngsters impressed me really.
Still have reservations about McVeigh, but that tap to Goodes was good vision.

[Foreign Legion]

My take on the game tonight:

Brisbane were very professional - had a good side in and beat us by what they should have.

Swans:
We are going to have trouble in the back line - yeah I know Saddo didn't play but still...This is going to be our weak spot this year.

Good players:
Stewie - tried his guts out - just why his is our captain

Stevens - will make the step up this year and looks to be taller as well. He was doing well against Leppitsch until moved.

Ablett - I saw a lot of him at Port Melbourne but I reckon he played better tonight than any game at Port - great gutsy effort.

Goodes - tried very hard in the ruck and ran out of steam but will be a key player

Powell - stats don't tell the story - I thought he really put his body on the line after 1/2 time and did some great stuff.

Schneider - could have kicked 4 or 5 - reminds me of Amon - will be a battle for these two for a spot.

Other things I noted:
McVeigh - well he does have a footy brain - his brilliant tap was worth 4 kicks

Malceski - didn't do much but I reckon there is something about him - he looks like he can "cut the mustard"! I would like to be the first member of this board on his bandwagon!

All in all - not too bad - where do we play next week?

Cheers

[LondonSwan]

Originally posted by CureTheSane
I didn't see the game, but 30 odd points is by no means a disaster against thge reigning premiers.

I refuse to read anything into a pre season game, especially after reading how Roos was treating it....

For once I agree with you, noone can read too much into this, we cant expect them to go up against a near full strength Brisbane and expect to win. If we feel bad imagine how Sheedy feels. 2 losses in just over a week.

Goodes playing in the ruck seems to be showing up as an early error - he is quite clearly needed elsewhere. Maybe we should have persevered with Mott and where is Ball.

The strength of the players should have been addressed before this if the quote above is correct. Injuries and fitness are now of concern.

Colin saw the match and said Maxfield worked hard all day but is not the player of last year before injury took him out.

[Reggi]

Schneider has a really good touch of arrogance doesn't he, persisted which was good to see.

Has a lot to do to cut it though, I think he'll easily get ahead of Buchanan who I expect will spend the year in ths SFL


Powell has intent and a bit of courage, he's surprisingly agile, he's light but could have a future, did fair on Voss

[Foreign Legion]

G'day Reggi,

I think the Schneider/Buchanan battle will be interesting. I have stood next to both guys (at Port Melbourne) and I think Adam has about 1 inch on Amon. I think though, that Amon is a more skilled player - he would have kicked probably all those goals tonight.

It is good to see two 'crumbers' of some ability playing - we certainly need 'em.

Takes me back to Silvio Foschini (showing my age).

Cheers.

[Reggi]

Yeah

Skill level is pretty similar Schneider went for a couple of 9 pointers.

Buchanan is a lazy footballer, doesn't chase, doesn't run hard - hardly runs at all.

Simply doesn't have the work ethic for AFL footy.

Schneider may have that - Schneider is a genuine midfielder who can push forward.

Buchanan is just a small forward who can sit on the bench.

[Jimmy C]

Originally posted by Foreign Legion
Takes me back to Silvio Foschini (showing my age).


Don't worry, you're in good company.

[NMWBloods]

Originally posted by Foreign Legion
Malceski - didn't do much but I reckon there is something about him - he looks like he can "cut the mustard"! I would like to be the first member of this board on his bandwagon!


Haha - I was going to put Malceski in for a mention too. Loved his little turn on the boundary line - pity he kicked it out on the full straight after.

[NMWBloods]

Originally posted by CureTheSane
I didn't see the game, but 30 odd points is by no means a disaster against thge reigning premiers.

I refuse to read anything into a pre season game, especially after reading how Roos was treating it....

We were down by over 50 at half time and I think they eased up a bit after that.

Last year I commented that there were a lot of worrying signs I noticed during the pre-season comp and everyone thought you couldn't take notice of it. However, those signs proved to be true.

I don't think it was a disaster, however I think you can take away some insights. I think we will struggle against good sides and big sides. It will be a big test for Roos to keep them motivated and confident through the season. Will be interesting to see how it goes.

[Foreign Legion]

Yeah Jimmy C - I go back to when the Swans (South) were down the bottom of the ladder. I reckon G. Teasdale was solely behind our entry to the finals in '77.

In fact (big statement coming up) I reckon Teaser played the best 1 season of football I have ever seen. I probably saw 18 games that year and he destroyed every side we played. Ruck, Full Forward, CHF etc he killed 'em.

Reggi, I reckon you're underating Amon - have you seen him at Port Melbourne? I reckon he is in a different class from most players. I admit he is slow, not desperate, not a good tackler etc but I have seen him destroy Dean Rice (Carlton 200+ games) when Amon kicked 6 goals.

I would not write him off just yet. By the same token, I hope Adam Schneider does well - I like his style.

Cheers

[liz]

Just got home from the game - and agree with much of what's been said.

Goodes may not have been brilliant but he shouldered an enormous workload. Only ruckman in the team - and he's not even really a ruckman himself.

Thought Willo showed a few touches of brilliance, especially in the 2nd half. Maxfield was busy and effective all night without being great. Stevens was good, and while Bazza seemed to have left his marking hands at home, I was impressed by his chasing.

Skills did look ordinary on the surface, but I agree with previous comments that lack of body strength was a big factor here. Brisbane really are a very very physical group of players - hardly a stick among them. Not only were our boys under immense physical pressure but, unsurprisingly, the younger ones looked very nervous, especially in the first half. Felt a bit for Schneider who let two marks literally fall through his hands. It was great to see him come back in the second half - he seemed to have regained confidence and, for such a little fella, he sure can kick the ball.

I also thought they looked very heavy legged right from the start. Whether that's the result of some hard training sessions, the soft ground or merely because they weren't applying themselves, who knows.

Pleasing signs for me were that while none of the newbies did a huge amount, none really looked out of place. They all look to have the raw ability to play - just have to get the bodies to match. Ablett's performance was also very encouraging. He was probably in Sydney's best handful over the whole game and worked much harder than I've seen him do before.

Disappointments were probably the performances of O'Keefe and Kennelly. Both looked out of sorts tonight - not really running or chasing.

And while the better team clearly won on the night, I'd love for someone to tell me how Lynch managed to snare 3 goals in about as many minutes in the second quarter - all with ample assistance from the umpires. That first one - he whacks Goodes around the head, Goodes still hangs on to the mark, yet Lynch comes up with a free? Please explain. Hardly surprising after that one that he was able to get away with two blatant pushes against Schauble for his next two.

[Foreign Legion]

Yeah NMWBloods - I reckon Malceski looks alright - reminds me of a young Leon Cameron - well we can dream can't we!

Cheers.

[Reggi]

Lizz Roos said earlier he would train them in preparation for the season reagrdless of Wizard cup as he is focussed on the main season.

He was on Melb radio on Tues he said he would rest all players with small injuries during the pre-season as it is a long season and Sydney cannot afford to have any of its top players missing.

He's probably being wise, hopefully this will pay off later.

[Foreign Legion]

G'day Lizz,

Those frees to Lynch were very doubtful - I reckon they got 6 or 7 in a row - most in front of goal. Schaubs was scared of touching Lynch after that I reckon.

BTW what was the crowd figure, and do you know where the Swans play next week?

Cheers.

[liz]

Crowd was tiny - if there were as many as 5,000 there I'd be amazed.

[liz]

Though I've just looked at the report on AFL.com.au and it reckons there were 8 odd thou

[Foreign Legion]

Well, it looked as if there was quite a few on the wings - but I haven't been to Olympic Stadium (TELsss stadium) but I reckon 8 - 10 thousands at tops.

Still, good to see a few Swans guernseys though!

Cheers

[Jimmy C]

Originally posted by Foreign Legion
I reckon G. Teasdale was solely behind our entry to the finals in '77.

In fact (big statement coming up) I reckon Teaser played the best 1 season of football I have ever seen. I probably saw 18 games that year and he destroyed every side we played. Ruck, Full Forward, CHF etc he killed 'em.


He was all class. I felt disgusted last year when Sheedy said that Teaser was an example of a player who didn't really deserve a Brownlow medal (just 'cos he doesn't have one-dirty besstid). Teaser was another great example of a champion player who combined footy talent with being able to get on the turps. I loved him then (as we all did). Sorry, this is somewhat off topic, but I've imbibed lots of Wild Turkey (for THAT, I make no apologies).

[treespirit]

Well, it's mostly been said before but -
- too small
- too slow
- too short
- too young
- too dumb
to beat a champion team. Is there anyone else with the vision and ability to deliver like Voss? Unbelievable.

I thought the established players had listened too much to Roos and weren't taking the game seriously. Only the youngsters who are trying to prove their worth seemed to be trying hard.

There were multiple times where a Brisbane player outsprinted 2 or more Swans to get to the ball. Ben Matthews' brain is too slow for AFL. He takes a week to make a decision and routinely gets run down. Even apart from the umpires, Lynch was too big for Schauble to handle.

Delivery was appalling, especially into the 50 - surprise, surpirse. Haven't we been here before. What the hell have they been doing at training? This has been a problem for years and doesn't appear to have improved. Even Maxfield kicked it straight to the defenders. Expect another BBBH brain explosion if the delivery doesn't improve significantly. J. Bolton, hang up your boots because they should NEVER be allowed near a football.

I know it's pre-season, but my expectations for the season are not good. Let's hope Carlton has another shocker to keep us off the bottom.

[treespirit]

...and don't let the score fool you. The Lions backed right off in the second half, resting Akermanis, Voss, etc. If they'd been serious, we would have been beaten by 70+.

[vagary]

with what everyones saying it sounds like the game was not worth seeing.
QUESTION: comparing the swans performance from the last 2 weeks, could anyone notice any differece between this week and last week?

[Reggi]

Brisbane may have had a few Premiership players missing from last year, but let me say that they still had 3 Brownlow medalists in pretty good form, as well as players like Copeland, Charman, Bradshaw and Shattock who have played a fair bit of AFL even though they weren't in the premiership team last year. Add Caracella to the list as a new player.

We on the other hand had almost half a side.

It should not be news to anyone that seeing as we had half the playing list missing, and we have a heap of very skinny youngsters, we struggled.

I expected it, they were way to strong for our guys, simple.'

But there is only one Brisbane Lions side out there (and they are probably the best side I have seen)

Of their guns they were only missing Lappin, Brown, Scott and White.

We on the other hand were missing Ruckman, half of our defence etc.

Don't panic.

That said they didn't seem focussed.

[TheMase]

Originally posted by Reggi

Don't panic.


Exactly my thoughts. The results should not be taken into consideration tonight. The only thing that should be looked at is the form of our younger players.

This I thought was extremely good. We may have scored in the latest draft, as each of the new players seems to have a touch of class.

Thewlis looks like he could play quite a bit of football this season as he has the build. Seems to have great skills to, and that will only get better.

Malceski is a bit light on, but really has a footy brain (from what I saw). A couple of very quick handballs in there, did quite well.

Dempster had limited opportunities, but was in the thick of it at times.

McVeigh didn't do too much, although that tap to Goodes was excellent vision and peace of mind.

Stevens was sensational at times, and given that he was thrown down back, and seems to be able to play there, we will have some versitility with him, either dominating up forward or down back. Looks like he will have a big year.


On the other hand, Boltons endeavour was great. Got in there got the ball etc. But unfortunately what he did after that was abysmal. Needs to work on that, and very quickly. I think I can kick straighter than him.

[treespirit]

Don't panic.

That's what we said last year (and the year before (and the one before that (etc.))) and we were wrong each time. They're crap and I'm going to consider them crap until they prove otherwise. I've spent too much energy trying to see the positives over the last few years.

[Diego]

I agree with you treespirit. Yes it was the pre season but we are seeing the same monumental head explosions from the same guys year in year out.

We really do have a list who are all style and no substance. Harsh but true IMHO. :)

[liz]

This year is a bit different though. Last year we were led to believe that we were a serious premiership contender. Lockett had rejoined in the belief that he and Hall could form an unstoppable force up forward, we still had Schwass, Kelly and Dunkley who, based on the previous season's form, still seemed likely to have enough good footy in them.

This year we know that we're not. We have a rookie coach, a smattering of quality senior players (especially Willo, Cressa and Maxfield), a middle age group who are OK but not stars (with exception of Magic, who could be a star) and lots of undernourished kids who look like they can play footy but have almost no experience and are going to struggle physically.

This year is all about seeing what they've got up top. Can they learn the composure required to hold their own against bigger, more experienced teams? Can they execute skills under pressure? Can they collectively put together a game plan where speed and mobility counter physical force?

We already know that sometimes they are going to be made to look very ordinary, especially by teams who are not only as good as the Lions but also as supremely confident. In these cases its going to be what they learn from the experiences that counts, not the score. Hopefully against other teams it will click and we'll be delighted with the result.

If anyone is looking to support a premiership team this season, I suggest you get off the Swans and start supporting the Lions. But if you're interested in watching first hand the development of a new squad into something that might - next year or the year after that - become very good, hold on tight. It could be fun!

[treespirit]

I've been going to most of the Lions Melbourne games for 3 years (including last year's GF) and it is great to support a winning team. My mate and I go to each other's teams games. I think it took over a year for him to see a Swans win. We had to hunt down one of the few pubs that can afford Fox Footy to watch last night's game (without commentary). I am seriously considering dual memberships this year.

I agree with all you said Lizz, but right now they are still crap. I will be extremely happy to follow a burgeoning force over the next few years, but so far there are very few signs that will happen.

[robbieando]

I'll harp on this point until I'm blue in the face - our midfield HAS to improve 10 fold on what it is now and was last season. There are good signs about it depth wise but we lack 2 top line midfielders who can rip open a game. McVeigh is seen to be one of these midfielders the other is not known.

If we can get a top line midfield it would relieve the pressure on our defence and thus trying to find a FB won't be as important. We are 2 midfielders (and I mean 2 in the Voss/Black mold) away from even challenging for a flag. I doubt we'll make the finals this season and most likely as well in 2004, but come 2005-2007 I expect to be up there pushing for a flag, IF we can get hold of the 2 midfielders we need.

[Nico]

A few observations.

1. Didn't seem to have that flow on style of the second half of 2002. Too stop start alah Eade. Lets hope Roos is leaving his game plan for the real stuff. Looked like that to me.
2. Disposal skills when not under pressure were shocking. Warfe is Shouse.
3. Most importantly we lacked intensity and the 'hard at it' factor. Some of those young players as pointed out earlier were happy to get the easy options, but few really hit their opponents hard.
4.. Malceski, as in the GF last year has continued his appalling disposal. No good having twinkle toes if you kick it out on the full. Ditto for Frosty.
5. Strewth someone was a bit tough on Maxfield, as he had the most disposals on the night. I only remember about 3 poor kicks to the forward line, and besides he is entitled to be rusty. Looked good to me and led by example.
6. Too often we kicked to contests and had few players running to position or space.
7. Roos threw players all over the park, so it just looked like a conditioning hitout more than anything else.
8. Stevens was impressive, but please leave Barry Hall at full forward and don't try to plug holes with him. His is our only option at FF.
9. Cresswell was in for the run.
10. Noticed Akermanis tagged Williams all game. Is this going to be the norm all season.
11. Give Jude a break. Didn't anyone noticed how ferocious he was at centre bounces and the number of times he was first to the ball and at the bottom of centre bounce packs.

By the way Barry Hall is a very underrated player. While he is our spearhead we will be a danger to any team, as it looks like he will take 3 players every week which leaves plenty for the rest of the forwards.

Wayne Schwass is a very competent, knowledgeable and articulate commentator.

[Nico]

Robbie,

Agree on the midfielders, but I reckon we have one in Fixter who is simply wasted in the back half. Runs all day, finds the footy, reads the play and would give us heaps of direct run though the centre.

We also need a Merv Neagle type. That is, tough, wiry, poised and balanced with plenty of disposal time.

[robbieando]

We need a ball winning type of midfielder who can change the game just like Voss can. At the moment we really don't have that player, sure we have players who would play the role, but none who are really good enough to do it. The other midfielder we need is a runner type which we have in McVeigh. So if we can get the ball winning the draft at seasons end we should be OK come 2005 and beyond but before then we must build our side up.