Young Players

[tombomb83]

In the next few weeks I would really like to see the following positional moves.

Doyle - more time in the forward line than in the ruck. I think he is pretty useless around the ground and his main strength is his marking.

Ablett - more time deep in the forward line behind hall. The best game he has played for us was against the lions last year when he took a couple of strong marks inside the 50. Everytime he is near the ball he seems to be deep in the flanks and has zero time to do anything other than handball it.

Kirk - Less time tagging players, I think he could really surprise some teams if he goes out as purely and attacking player, especially around the stoppages. I think he is probably the best decision maker in the team and rarely waists a disposal.

Schneider - More time in the midfield, he is probably the best kick (with nick davis) in the team. He is also very quick over the first 5 or 10 metres.

LRT - More time in the ruck, every time i see him play in the ruck he plays well, he isnt so strong in the tap outs, but his strength appears to be his fitness and he has quite good hands.

Thats just a couple of things I've been thinking about today, Im also a little worried Maxfield, his disposals lately haven't been good enough and I don't think he should be carried purely because he is captain. Further, I don't think the swans can afford to carry him during ythe middle of the year with the hope that he will improve and then be forced to drop him at the end of the year. I guess the solution is to play him off the bench.

[floppinab]

Originally posted by tombomb83
In the next few weeks I would really like to see the following positional moves.

Doyle - more time in the forward line than in the ruck. I think he is pretty useless around the ground and his main strength is his marking.

Ablett - more time deep in the forward line behind hall. The best game he has played for us was against the lions last year when he took a couple of strong marks inside the 50.
Kirk - Less time tagging players, I think he could really surprise some teams if he goes out as purely and attacking player, especially around the stoppages.

Schneider - More time in the midfield, he is probably the best kick (with nick davis) in the team. He is also very quick over the first 5 or 10 metres.

LRT - More time in the ruck, every time i see him play in the ruck he plays well, he isnt so strong in the tap outs, but his strength appears to be his fitness and he has quite good hands.

Thats just a couple of things I've been thinking about today, Im also a little worried Maxfield, his disposals lately haven't been good enough and I don't think he should be carried purely because he is captain. Further, I don't think the swans can afford to carry him during ythe middle of the year with the hope that he will improve and then be forced to drop him at the end of the year. I guess the solution is to play him off the bench.

It was Doyles influence and tap work in the ruck IMO that had a large impact in getting us back in the game in the first q. last week. I'd like to see him in there a bit more.

Agreed on Ablett but given that Saddo is now God's gift to the Swans forward line, hard to see Ablett fitting in up there. sarcasm intentional, that was just one game kids

Kirk agreed, he's been doing that the last few games anyway. Maxfield has been a bit hot and cold but not that bad. And don't underestimate his leadership influence, he has really grown with this since being made captain and this influence in this area is very significant IMO, certainly worth "carrying" for if we really are carrying him in anyway.

Bottom line for me is flexibility and it seems we have got plenty of that these days. If something isn't working there are other blokes that can bob up in other positions to find the winning combination.

[liz]

Originally posted by tombomb83
In the next few weeks I would really like to see the following positional moves.

Doyle - more time in the forward line than in the ruck. I think he is pretty useless around the ground and his main strength is his marking.

Couldn't agree less. What are ypu basing this assessment on?



Ablett - more time deep in the forward line behind hall. The best game he has played for us was against the lions last year when he took a couple of strong marks inside the 50. Everytime he is near the ball he seems to be deep in the flanks and has zero time to do anything other than handball it. [/B]

This one I agree with but would need O'Keefe to move out to a wing or the midfield. This might also be of benefit - he's not the fastest going around but he has good skills off the deck.



Kirk - Less time tagging players, I think he could really surprise some teams if he goes out as purely and attacking player, especially around the stoppages. I think he is probably the best decision maker in the team and rarely waists a disposal.

Yup - and I think we're starting to see this happen already. Unfortunately, neither B1 nor Fozzie seem to have very good defensive/run-with skills so we are still likely to see Kirk given an important opponent to mind. He's just so good at it. Hopefully he will be given a bit more licence to look for the ball himself but we have to accept there will be some trade-off with the amount of ball his opponent gets.




Schneider - More time in the midfield, he is probably the best kick (with nick davis) in the team. He is also very quick over the first 5 or 10 metres.

When he's fit enough he will.




LRT - More time in the ruck, every time i see him play in the ruck he plays well, he isnt so strong in the tap outs, but his strength appears to be his fitness and he has quite good hands.

He's only really played one game in the ruck - admittedly he did fine but it doesn't appear to be his natural position. I guess this view might have some logic given your views on Doyle but since I disagree with those I don't think we'll be seeing much of LRT in the ruck unless injuries strike.

I have a suspicion that my view in this respect is closer to that of the Swans coaching panel.




Thats just a couple of things I've been thinking about today, Im also a little worried Maxfield, his disposals lately haven't been good enough and I don't think he should be carried purely because he is captain. Further, I don't think the swans can afford to carry him during ythe middle of the year with the hope that he will improve and then be forced to drop him at the end of the year. I guess the solution is to play him off the bench.

He's not hit top form yet but is still clearly in our best team. Some of his disposals this year have been magnificent.

[dendol]

Saddo is now back in form after one game, so we have to stop picking on him. Maxfield's disposals havent been great in the first few games, so lets drop this passenger for a youngen. We dont need ageing club captains on the park when we are still rebuilding this club. Lets blood all the youngsters at the same time.

[undy]

Come on tombomb get a grip on yourself. Maxie had a crappy game against Geelong (when he sustained a neck injury) but apart a couple of misdirected kicks he's been fine. He's still the Swannies #2 at tackling, he's doing a great job as captain, he can still launch an attack from the defensive 50 with one of those booming kicks.

...still fuming...OK, here are his rankings in the club at the moment;

tackles: 2nd
kicks: 8th
marks: 13th
disposals: 12th

compared to... say b2:
10th, 12th, 4th, 11th

or tk (who has been more injured than maxie):
19th, 20th, 19th, 16th

(sarcasm on)
How can we afford to "carry" all three of them ?
(sarcasm off)

[Newbie]

Originally posted by dendol
Saddo is now back in form after one game, so we have to stop picking on him. Maxfield's disposals havent been great in the first few games, so lets drop this passenger for a youngen. We dont need ageing club captains on the park when we are still rebuilding this club. Lets blood all the youngsters at the same time.
Shshh, hard bunch to please ha, even after 50 points thrashing of the Kangaroos:cool: :cool: :cool: :cool: .

[dendol]

Originally posted by undy
(sarcasm on)
How can we afford to "carry" all three of them ?
(sarcasm off)

Its obvious that we cant. We should drop them and give Schmidt, Willoughby, and Matthew Davis a go.

While we're at it, Ball has the yips, so lets give Ericksen a run in the ruck.

[tombomb83]

i should probably clarify my comments

my comments on doyle are based on the fact that he is still relatively lean and and doesn't look like a person who is naturally suited to the heavy work that is associated with ruck work. He actually reminds me a bit of Paul Salmon, and he may be best suited to the ruck later in his career. Everytime i see him chasing a ball I hold my breath because I think his legs are going to snap in half.

as for maxfield, the fact is that when schauble, o'loughlin and davis (this week) come back, 3 players will have to be dropped, and do we want to get into a pattern of playing o'keefe, fosdike, schneider etc... off the bench and dropping players like mcveigh, bevan and LRT. Because if we are full strength that is what is going to happen, and I think all the above players deserve to be on the ground ahead of maxfield because I think he has lost a yard of pace and now always looks rushed when he kicks and as a result is making to many unforced errors. I'm not suggesting he should be dropped, just that his role should be reduced.

[stellation]

Originally posted by dendol
Its obvious that we cant. We should drop them and give Schmidt, Willoughby, and Matthew Davis a go.

While we're at it, Ball has the yips, so lets give Ericksen a run in the ruck.

I say bring in Matthew Davis. And I also agree that Maxie has lost a bit of stuff and stuff.

[liz]

Originally posted by tombomb83
i should probably clarify my comments

my comments on doyle are based on the fact that he is still relatively lean and and doesn't look like a person who is naturally suited to the heavy work that is associated with ruck work. He actually reminds me a bit of Paul Salmon, and he may be best suited to the ruck later in his career.

:confused: Doyle is actually a big solid unit know. One thing he does seem to have spent the last few years doing is putting on some bulk.

Salmon spent much of his career as a frustrated ruckman, forced to play up forward because that's where Sheedy wanted him. Wasn't aware of any suggestion he didn't play in the ruck because he was too skinny!

As for your comments on Maxfield - yes, at the moment I would pick him well ahead of Bevan, McVeigh, and LRT, not to mention ahead of Fosdike, Saddington, Kennelly, O'Keefe, Schneider, James, B2 and probably half a dozen others as well. That's not a slight on them but Maxfield is still of huge importance to the team.

[ScottH]

Originally posted by lizz
This one I agree with but would need O'Keefe to move out to a wing or the midfield. This might also be of benefit - he's not the fastest going around but he has good skills off the deck.


It seemed most of his possessions of Sunday were on the wing. and he has a wicked left hoof, to put the ball deep into attack!!

[dendol]

Fair enough he has lost a yard of pace and has kicked some clangers this year, but who hasnt?

We need a good balance of experience and youth. While we are rebuilding, its even more important that the older heads are there to settle things down when things dont go to plan. Stewie leads by example in his attitude towards training and preparation, and his toughness on the field, as shown when he got illegally KO'd in the Geelong game.

He also shows that what you do when you dont have the ball is just as important as what you do when you do have it. Tackling, pressure, all the one-percenters. To call for his head after 4 games this year - especially considering other players in the team have been given months of latitude - is premature and an insult to a 250+ gamer and captain.

For all I know, I might just be preaching to a 3-post troll, but comments made by others on this board have built up my frustration on this issue. As a coach, you cant realistically replace players at the slightest drop in form and expect the players to continue to want to play for you.

Just about every player in the team will mention Maxfield's professionalism if asked to comment. Even if that is the only thing which he is remembered for (which wont be the case), it is a legacy which will leave our club in great shape for years to come.

[TheHood]

There are several players that I have questioned this year only because I would love to see them do better but Maxy has never been one of them. Never given him a second thought because he's too important.

I am really disappointed and surprised to have seen his name come up twice this week on here as disappointing with his disposal and should be considered on the bench.

IMO, NO WAY! His experience is essential out there. Forget raw talent, forget youthful exhuberence, forget silky skills. Maxy's leadership is ESSENTIAL! How else do I put this to RAM it home? He is the heart and soul of the bluds now and his daisy cutters are still a joy to watch when they hit Baz on the chest.

The odd eratic kick I can cope with because the stuff we don't see... yeah, well that is unquantifiable - partly because there is no stats man to cope with his massive contribution week in week out. Make no mistake, he is as important as anybody out there for the Sydney Swans these days. He's our best leader.

[monopoly19]

Originally posted by TheHood
IMO, NO WAY! His experience is essential out there. Forget raw talent, forget youthful exhuberence, forget silky skills. Maxy's leadership is ESSENTIAL! How else do I put this to RAM it home? He is the heart and soul of the bluds now and his daisy cutters are still a joy to watch when they hit Baz on the chest.


Absolutely right. Maxfield is integral, whether he is in the best form of his career or not. I noticed a couple of bad kicks in the Brisbane game, but that game had more skill errors from both teams than usual (attributed to it being first game back) and there is no valid reason to drop him, and I can't see one appearing any time soon either. To me, he epitomises what this Swans team is all about, and they would be much the worse without him.

As for Doyle, tombomb - Doyle is not in the team to play forward. He is in the team to ruck, and from what we saw last week, and glimpses previously, he could soon become and integral part of our line up, playing in the ruck. I reckon our forward line is right as it is, but do think that he is very dangerous and capable as a resting forward, but only in rotation with Ball/Goodes.

I reckon of all the places LRT has played, ruck is not his best. If you think Doyle is lean, what does that make LRT? Agree with your points on Ablett, Kirk and Schneider though.

[liz]

Just further ramming home the points already made about Maxfield, did anyone notice one of the comments made by Bevan this week that Maxfield (and Crouch) have been sitting down with him each week and going through the tape of his game, pointing out what he's doing right and what he needs to work on? I'm sure there are some other captains who do this kind of thing as well but can you imagine someone like Carey - just to name one - spending time in this way (great player though Carey was, not denying that). I wonder whether this was even Kelly's "thing".

I think many of us spent a couple of years dreading what a vacuum would be left when PK decided to retire - the emergence of Stewie's role, on and off the field - has been a delight and a blessing.

[silent lurker]

I'd like to see Ben Fixter injury free and back to his 2002 form. Unfortunately he seems to have fallen to the perpetual 2 week curse.

[sharpie]

At the rate this place is going, we should have the full 22 players in the forward 45 at once, and maybe even bring back Dunks and stick him in a forward pocket.

Sheesh, not everyone can play there, some poor sods have to miss out and take up place in the rest of the ground.

:D

[stellation]

Originally posted by lizz
I'm sure there are some other captains who do this kind of thing as well but can you imagine someone like Carey - just to name one - spending time in this way (great player though Carey was, not denying that).

this made me think of how much I used to enjoy watching Carey play... I looked up some stats on him, take a look at just how dominant he was... carey (http://stats.rleague.com/afl/stats/players/W/Wayne_Carey.html)

have to hate him of course, yadda yadda yadda... but man he could play...