There will be a Sydney Swans AFLW team in the 2022-23 season

[Thunder Shaker]

Expansion talks, potential club compo on cards at next Commission meeting (https://womens.afl/news/71024/expansion-talks-potential-club-compo-pushes-back-trade-period)
AFL Commission will meet on May 12, with AFLW expansion clubs being one of two items on the AFLW agenda. There won't be expansion in 2022, but a 2023 expansion is possible.

Sydney Swans do not have an AFLW side yet, but has an Academy for girls. Watch our Swans Academy girls in action (https://www.sydneyswans.com.au/news/902607/watch-our-swans-academy-girls-in-action)

Port Adelaide are the other club without an AFLW side that may be well placed to enter the competition, due to the strength of the Adelaide AFLW side.

Are the Sydney Swans ready to add an AFLW side?

[bloodspirit]

All depends on whether we sort out the Royal Hall of Industries and get that back on track.

[aardvark]

While there is no facilities for them it's unlikely we'll be included in the next intake. It's a shame really as our best u/19 girls will probably get picked up by GWS. Jess Doyle, Maddy Hendrie and Issy McLeay all had excellent games in the U/19 Championships this week.

[Captain]

I would prefer we wait longer. At the moment AFLW would be a loss maker for us and there would be poor crowds.

Having the academy is a fantastic start and gives us the best foundation for when we eventually get a team. It also means the quality of the overall competition should have improved by the time we play.

[barry]

can Sydney (the city) supply enough quality players for 2 teams?

[giant]

can Sydney (the city) supply enough quality players for 2 teams?

Well, there are 6 million people so I figure probably. Swans badly missed the boat on this and it's quite likely there won't be further expansion for some time. A real shame.

[dejavoodoo44]

AFL has just announced that all 18 teams will have an AFLW side by the end of 2023. So, the most likely scenario is that we field our first side in the competition that starts in December 2022.

Pleased that we will have a team, less enthused by the December start. Let's just hope it's played as a night competition, otherwise heat stress could be a real problem.

[bloodspirit]

Why, o, why, do we have a separate forum for women's footy? And, mods, since we do have a separate forum for women's footy, why is this thread permitted to stay here. My vote is to merge the women's footy into the main footy chat, especially in so far as it relates to the club having an AFLW team.

Great news that the AFLW is not going to overlap with the AFL season any more (and will make the off-season more bearable) and will give the women clear air. Tough for the players though, playing in summer! Especially in Qld!

[stevoswan]

Deleted......missed the point.

[aardvark]

My vote is to merge the women's footy into the main footy chat, especially in so far as it relates to the club having an AFLW team.

+1 If our friends over on the Big Footy board can cope with Women's footy on their main page surely the much more civilized participants on RWO can cope.

[barry]

The mods have a strong tradition of using other sparsely populated boards to bury topics they don't like.

Surprised they have done that with woman's footy, but old habits die hard I guess.

[Thunder Shaker]

Sydney Swans set sights on 2022 entry into AFLW (https://www.sydneyswans.com.au/news/935142/sydney-swans-set-sights-on-2022-entry-into-aflw)

[Mark26]

I'm stoked we are going to have another Swans' team to cheer for. Bring it on. Let's hope our academy feeds it too.

[stevoswan]

The mods have a strong tradition of using other sparsely populated boards to bury topics they don't like.

Surprised they have done that with woman's footy, but old habits die hard I guess.

Give them a chance Barry:smile:....as it becomes more relevant to Swans fans, ie: we actually have a team to talk about, the mod's may (and should) move it onto the main board.

[barry]

I wonder where the Swans AFLW team will play. SCG will be used for cricket

[aardvark]

Hopefully the AFL might allow us to retain our best Academy players from this year to keep GWS from getting their grubby hands on them.

[aardvark]

Jess Doyle makes history with VFLW selection (https://www.sydneyswans.com.au/video/935574/jess-doyle-makes-history-with-vflw-selection?videoId=935574&modal=true&type=video&publishFrom=1620972054001)

Won't be happy if she ends up at GWS!

[aardvark]

Jess Doyle and Maddie Hendry invited to Draft Combine. Good luck girls!

[Thunder Shaker]

Final four clubs to join AFLW (https://www.afl.com.au/news/662907/historic-decision-made-final-four-clubs-to-join-aflw)

AFLW will expand to 18 teams from the 2022/23 season (https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-08-12/aflw-will-expand-to-all-18-teams/100371016)

[Jimitron5000]

Hooray! Great news, looking forward to being able to cheer the Swans on for the whole year!

[TheBloods]

This is good

[Meg]

“The jewel in the crown of rugby league grounds is poised to become a permanent refuge for a rival code, as the Sydney Swans zero in on a new-look Henson Park as the likely home of their new AFLW team.”

Article in SMH this evening.

[Mel_C]

Great news, I will finally have a team to support 🙂.

Is the development of our new facilities going ahead?

[Meg]

Great news, I will finally have a team to support [emoji846].

Is the development of our new facilities going ahead?

Mel, I didn’t post the link to the SMH article (cos I was nervous re link issues) but do a search for:

“Swans set to use rugby league’s inner west ‘jewel’ as AFLW home ground”

There is a hint in the article that the new facility might get resurrected. The issue was financial following the collapse of funding in 2020 due to Covid. I would think the financial issue has got worse this year but perhaps they have found a very generous donor?

[mcs]

Mel, I didn’t post the link to the SMH article (cos I was nervous re link issues) but do a search for:

“Swans set to use rugby league’s inner west ‘jewel’ as AFLW home ground”

There is a hint in the article that the new facility might get resurrected. The issue was financial following the collapse of funding in 2020 due to Covid. I would think the financial issue has got worse this year but perhaps they have found a very generous donor?

Will be really interesting to see where it lands. In a lot of ways, it makes potentially a lot of sense as a home for the AFLW team - because it could very nicely align season wise (in broad terms - would be some crossover probably) with the Jets use of the ground.

[Ruck'n'Roll]

No Ludwig no!
The decision to play AFL is a decision that can only be made by the individual - regardless of gender. It cannot be made for that individual by anyone else.
During the first season of ALFW I wondered what would happen when the first woman left the ground with a a badly broken leg or bloody facial gash.
Having watched my goddaughter and niece both play, I've come to the belated realisation of what an idiot I was being. The decision to play is just as much their decision as it was mine when I was younger. In them I saw the same determination, same fears and same willingness as I witnessed with my own peers. Their bodies their choice - anything else is pure BS.

[Mel_C]

Mel, I didn’t post the link to the SMH article (cos I was nervous re link issues) but do a search for:

“Swans set to use rugby league’s inner west ‘jewel’ as AFLW home ground”

There is a hint in the article that the new facility might get resurrected. The issue was financial following the collapse of funding in 2020 due to Covid. I would think the financial issue has got worse this year but perhaps they have found a very generous donor?

Thanks Meg, I read the article in the Age this morning. I'm also curious how it will be funded.

[KTigers]

As long as they don't touch the outside of the grandstand. Fix up the rooms underneath, sure, but don't touch the outside.

[joeykanga]

As long as they don't touch the outside of the grandstand. Fix up the rooms underneath, sure, but don't touch the outside.

If you type this in it should pull up a story with the artist’s impression of what they’re planning to do ..it seems like the grandstand is staying intact which is great
Type this and search
Swans set to use rugby league’s inner west ‘jewel’ as AFLW home ground

Ps by the way just out of lucky accident last time I was there stumbled upon the tennis club and Portuguese social club right by Henson Park ..lovely food

[liz]

'I fell into it': Footy a family affair for Bronwyn Gulden (https://womens.afl/news/73620)

Here's a feature piece on one of the girls' academy assistant coaches (and Swans VIP in a broader sense).

[joeykanga]

'I fell into it': Footy a family affair for Bronwyn Gulden (https://womens.afl/news/73620)

Here's a feature piece on one of the girls' academy assistant coaches (and Swans VIP in a broader sense).

Great article …I wonder if she has an interest in the AFLW side coaching role
I imagine the Swans will hopefully give an opportunity to a female coach

[Meg]

'I fell into it': Footy a family affair for Bronwyn Gulden (https://womens.afl/news/73620)

Here's a feature piece on one of the girls' academy assistant coaches (and Swans VIP in a broader sense).

No wonder the Gulden junior family members are an impressive lot with a role-model mother like this - what a woman!

I love that she fulfilled one of her dreams by making her footy playing debut this year - she surely is at least 40yo (noting Adam and Errol’s ages)?

This also made me laugh:

"It's been a bit tricky watching him (Errol) on tv, but he's living his best life down there (Melbourne) and he assures us he misses us, but I'm not entirely sure.”

Lol, I’ve suspected that lockdown ‘bubble’ footy both last year and this has been tough on the older players (particularly those with families and home commitments) - and a ball of fun for the young guys!

[neilfws]

No wonder the Gulden junior family members are an impressive lot with a role-model mother like this - what a woman!

I love that she fulfilled one of her dreams by making her footy playing debut this year - she surely is at least 40yo (noting Adam and Errol’s ages)?

I believe she is 55. What an inspiration! Never too late.

Bron's childhood dream realised (https://www.sydneyswans.com.au/news/975402/brons-childhood-dream-realised)

[Meg]

I believe she is 55. What an inspiration! Never too late.

Bron's childhood dream realised (https://www.sydneyswans.com.au/news/975402/brons-childhood-dream-realised)

You’re right - from that article: ‘She proved age is all but a number when last month she made her football debut at 55-years of age for the UNSW Bulldogs reserves side in the AFL Sydney league.’

Truly amazing!

[mcs]

Further good news for both the Swans teams with the announcement today that the Swans HQ project is back on :) Sydney Swans HQ at the Royal Hall of Industries (https://www.sydneyswans.com.au/news/1009032/sydney-swans-hq-at-the-royal-hall-of-industries)

[Ludwig]

I find it upsetting how medical evidence of the dangers of women playing football have been ignored. Women are physiologically much more vulnerable to getting concussion than men are, and the damage caused by concussion in women is also worse. There are other health risks which are greater for women playing contact sports. Women should be discouraged from playing sports with a high incidence of concussion.

For those who an interested in this subject, I suggest listening to this podcast from Nature Magazine

Audio long-read: why sports concussions are worse for women (https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-021-02299-8)

[bloodspirit]

I find it upsetting how medical evidence of the dangers of women playing football have been ignored. Women are physiologically much more vulnerable to getting concussion than men are, and the damage caused by concussion in women is also worse. There are other health risks which are greater for women playing contact sports. Women should be discouraged from playing sports with a high incidence of concussion.

For those who an interested in this subject, I suggest listening to this podcast from Nature Magazine

Audio long-read: why sports concussions are worse for women (https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-021-02299-8)

Thanks for sharing this informative article, Ludwig.

I don't agree that "Women should be discouraged from playing sports with a high incidence of concussion." To me that feels paternalistic. I think the key is to provide the best available information and let everyone make informed choices. Life is full of risk and it is important to think about the costs and risks and also the benefits. However, I do agree that there should be more research, education, and more concerted efforts given to managing the incidence and treatment of these injuries.

[Ludwig]

Thanks for sharing this informative article, Ludwig.

I don't agree that "Women should be discouraged from playing sports with a high incidence of concussion." To me that feels paternalistic. I think the key is to provide the best available information and let everyone make informed choices. Life is full of risk and it is important to think about the costs and risks and also the benefits. However, I do agree that there should be more research, education, and more concerted efforts given to managing the incidence and treatment of these injuries.

It's easy to be tricked into labeling any denial of equality to women as sexist or paternalistic, but we have to recognize that there are real physiological differences between men and women that can end in a lack of consideration of women's health and safety. So what may seem as equality is really discriminatory. This is such a case. The science has shown that women are more vulnerable to any number of injuries when high impact sports.

IMO, women's professional football is a commercial exploitation of women in disregard of their safety. Why don't we just follow the science? That's what we tell the anti-vaxxers when it comes to Covid.

[Ruck'n'Roll]

I don't agree and I've made my POV clear above - but don't you think the real physiological differences should be a factor to be considered by the woman in question?

[Ludwig]

I don't agree and I've made my POV clear above - but don't you think the real physiological differences should be a factor to be considered by the woman in question?Yes, of course. I'm all for freedom to choose. But I don't feel that enough has been done by the sporting authorities to make women aware of the risks associated by playing football. If they know they have twice the risk of getting concussion than men do and the effects of brain trauma are even worse, and they still want to play, then go for it.

[goswannies]

ACLs a definite higher incidence (and that’s without playing AFL into the equation). The concern I have for concussion and ACLs is that male players have been involved with litigation relating to previous concussion. If there is a population that innately has an increased risk, does this pose a litigious risk in future? Not a reason not to play, but just a point of interest.

[Ludwig]

ACLs a definite higher incidence (and that’s without playing AFL into the equation). The concern I have for concussion and ACLs is that male players have been involved with litigation relating to previous concussion. If there is a population that innately has an increased risk, does this pose a litigious risk in future? Not a reason not to play, but just a point of interest.You can hear the claimants' lawyers arguing that the AFL knew there was an inherent higher risk of injury, but did nothing about it. I like the payout chances of the brain damaged women. Solid case.

[Ruck'n'Roll]

Yes, of course. I'm all for freedom to choose. But I don't feel that enough has been done by the sporting authorities to make women aware of the risks associated by playing football. If they know they have twice the risk of getting concussion than men do and the effects of brain trauma are even worse, and they still want to play, then go for it.
We are in agreement in this issue - if a situation is made clear (to me that's always THE issue), then on their head be it.


You can hear the claimants' lawyers arguing that the AFL knew there was an inherent higher risk of injury, but did nothing about it. I like the payout chances of the brain damaged women. Solid case.
I've always regarded Dicks comment in Henry VI, Part 2, Act IV, Scene 2 as lacking in ambition.

[Ludwig]

I've always regarded Dicks comment in Henry VI, Part 2, Act IV, Scene 2 as lacking in ambition.About killing the lawyers?

[dejavoodoo44]

About killing the lawyers?
It would make an interesting court case.

[bloodspirit]

We've advertised for a Senior Coach and Head of Footy for our AFLW teams: Sydney commences search for AFLW Senior Coach and Head of AFLW (sydneyswans.com.au) (https://www.sydneyswans.com.au/news/1019414/sydney-commences-search-for-aflw-senior-coach-and-head-of-aflw).

Good to see they're preferring a Head of Footy that comes from a women's sport (rather than necessarily AFL) background. I would hope (even more so than with the Senior Coach position) that the person appointed is a woman. Ultimately it would be great to see a woman appointed as Senior Coach too but I suspect there will be many, better qualified male candidates for that role.

[Ruck'n'Roll]

I hope the Swans manage to find a female head coach, the way the senior AFLW coaching ranks turned into a boys club looked terrible.
Not arguing qualifications, just the optics.
That and the fact Bec Goddard could win a flag then sit on the scrap heap for three seasons, until appointed Hawthorn - looks more than optics though.

[aardvark]

I've got mine! https://membership.sydneyswans.com.au/membership/aflw-foundation/

[mcs]

I've got mine! https://membership.sydneyswans.com.au/membership/aflw-foundation/

Me too! I like how they've set it up so it can be just added into your existing membership. Makes life easy and will see a lot of people I suspect that may be 50/50 about joining up just do it :)

[Mel_C]

I will be joining too 🙂

[Meg]

I will be joining too [emoji846]

Done [emoji3581] [emoji122][emoji122]

[monopoly19]

Does it cost money? Can’t seem to find that info anywhere.

[Ruck'n'Roll]

Only $50 - but as it says when you follow the link provided by aardvaak - "This membership does not include entry to games."
\

[bloodspirit]

I was eager to join until I realised it was just forking over $50 to say you are a foundation member and basically nothing else except a certificate to that effect. It's gotta include games and/or access to the players/staff to interest me.

[Meg]

I was eager to join until I realised it was just forking over $50 to say you are a foundation member and basically nothing else except a certificate to that effect. It's gotta include games and/or access to the players/staff to interest me.

Personally I didn’t think of it as ‘forking over’, I was delighted to support my club’s inaugural women’s team. And a bit chuffed to be a foundation member.

Ticket price this year was $10. How many tickets did you expect to get for $50?

[monopoly19]

Personally I didn’t think of it as ‘forking over’, I was delighted to support my club’s inaugural women’s team. And a bit chuffed to be a foundation member.

Ticket price this year was $10. How many tickets did you expect to get for $50?

They should have made it free for existing members. I mean, what do you actually get for the $50? A warm and fuzzy feeling?

I’m happy to support the club. I’ve spent hundreds over the last two years on memberships that have barely been used. I’ll happily pay to attend the AFLW games, but I’m not sure why I throw another $50 at the club for nothing.

[Meg]

They should have made it free for existing members. I mean, what do you actually get for the $50? A warm and fuzzy feeling?

Perhaps it might have been merely a ‘warm and fuzzy feeling’ for you, had you purchased a foundation membership. For me it is a feeling of pride.

[liz]

They should have made it free for existing members. I mean, what do you actually get for the $50? A warm and fuzzy feeling?

I’m happy to support the club. I’ve spent hundreds over the last two years on memberships that have barely been used. I’ll happily pay to attend the AFLW games, but I’m not sure why I throw another $50 at the club for nothing.

There wouldn't be much point in it for the club if it were free. I get that lots of people have chosen to keep paying their memberships for the last two seasons with very little tangible benefit. No doubt the club is very grateful for that and understands they're relying on a lot of goodwill. But they still have a big hole in their finances, and now have to find the money to set up the AFLW infrastructure. So this is really a means to try and persuade existing members - even if just a few - to make a further financial contribution for which they will also get little tangible benefit. But it is entirely optional.

[Sandridge]

I've got mine! https://membership.sydneyswans.com.au/membership/aflw-foundation/

Me too! :five:

[aardvark]

AFLW Foundation Membership now available (https://www.sydneyswans.com.au/news/1024745/aflw-foundation-membership-now-available)

If you're wondering where the money is being used check out the video on this page.

[sprite]

Perhaps it might have been merely a ‘warm and fuzzy feeling’ for you, had you purchased a foundation membership. For me it is a feeling of pride.

I'm with you Meg. It's great opportunity, looking forward to when we get to supporting them in Melbourne.

[bloodspirit]

Personally I didn’t think of it as ‘forking over’, I was delighted to support my club’s inaugural women’s team. And a bit chuffed to be a foundation member.

Ticket price this year was $10. How many tickets did you expect to get for $50?

I'm really torn and disappointed by this offering from the club. I am very excited to have our own AFLW team, and I intend to support it passionately. I would like to be involved from the outset - but to be asked to pay $50 for a certificate saying I was one of the first supporters just seems like a gimmick with no substance. And I'm sorry because I would like to be on board from the beginning but I don't want to just feel used or taken advantage of.

It's not I was expecting more games (in fact I think that's a bit of a cheap shot) - but there aren't actually any games included. I have no problem with paying to attend games, and I have no problems with paying for a membership that covers attendance at games. If this is just an opportunity to make a donation then I wish they'd be a bit clearer about that, and possibly also explain how the money will be used. Not even the video aardvark has posted makes it clear how the money will be spent - it just talks about the journey towards entering the competition and how exciting it will be to have our own team (which I agree with). Still, it's easy to imagine that the money will be used to support the AFLW program (you would hope!).

Maybe if I can just think of it as an opportunity to make a donation to the cause and show my support from the beginning (rather than as if they are treating me like someone really superficial and selling me something gimmicky) I will be able to talk myself into signing up.

[aardvark]

I'm guessing we will be asked to pay again for the 22-23 season which will include games. You could just imagine you are paying half your membership now and half in 22-23 maybe?

[mcs]

I'm really torn and disappointed by this offering from the club. I am very excited to have our own AFLW team, and I intend to support it passionately. I would like to be involved from the outset - but to be asked to pay $50 for a certificate saying I was one of the first supporters just seems like a gimmick with no substance. And I'm sorry because I would like to be on board from the beginning but I don't want to just feel used or taken advantage of.

It's not I was expecting more games (in fact I think that's a bit of a cheap shot) - but there aren't actually any games included. I have no problem with paying to attend games, and I have no problems with paying for a membership that covers attendance at games. If this is just an opportunity to make a donation then I wish they'd be a bit clearer about that, and possibly also explain how the money will be used. Not even the video aardvark has posted makes it clear how the money will be spent - it just talks about the journey towards entering the competition and how exciting it will be to have our own team (which I agree with). Still, it's easy to imagine that the money will be used to support the AFLW program (you would hope!).

Maybe if I can just think of it as an opportunity to make a donation to the cause and show my support from the beginning (rather than as if they are treating me like someone really superficial and selling me something gimmicky) I will be able to talk myself into signing up.

I think the club has been fairly open and upfront about the nature of the foundation membership. Fact is we are 18 months (or thereabouts) off the AFLW team playing their first match - that in itself given memberships are annual deals usually (noting the Swans did have that 5 year option for some members earlier this year) should really highlight to some degree the nature of what the 'foundation membership' is about.

I suspect they didn't go down the 'donation' talk sort of route on the basis that I expect the Swans Foundation is probably likely to launch a much larger and broader donation drive to help fund the training facility development.

But yes, agree they could of said a bit more about what they intend to spend the money on.

[aardvark]

Sydney has the most members despite not joining AFLW until 2022/23.
“To reach record AFLW Club membership figures ahead of the first bounce of the 2022 NAB AFLW season is an outstanding achievement, and we’re excited to see this energy for women’s football continue in the lead up to the opening round on January 7.”

Seems over 3500 people have signed up. Well done people!

[Sandridge]

Sydney has the most members despite not joining AFLW until 2022/23.
“To reach record AFLW Club membership figures ahead of the first bounce of the 2022 NAB AFLW season is an outstanding achievement, and we’re excited to see this energy for women’s football continue in the lead up to the opening round on January 7.”

Seems over 3500 people have signed up. Well done people!

Fantastic support for our AFLW team from Swans fans! To be the club with the most AFLW members when we're still a year off entering the competition is magnificent. My son and I are proud to be Foundation Members! GO BLOODS!!

[Auntie.Gerald]

Wonderful news re swans AFLW

[AB Swannie]

I'm not sure if this is the right thread or area to put this but I think it deserves mentioning that we have our first AFLW signing - Ruby Sargent-Wilson. Wollongong girl who has come through the academy. Super athlete.

It’s game on: Sydney Swans sign first AFLW player (https://www.sydneyswans.com.au/news/1077526/it-s-game-on-sydney-swans-sign-first-aflw-player)

[aardvark]

Winter series kicks off on Sunday at 1.15. Live feed at 2022 Winter Series - Sydney Swans v GWS Giants - YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vghNQbxAiwo)

Player list with numbers so you can get to know the girls at Aspiring Swans to kick off Female Winter Series against Giants (https://www.sydneyswans.com.au/news/1124441/aspiring-swans-to-kick-off-female-winter-series-against-giants)

A few of the recruits are playing so it could be worth a look!

[Thunder Shaker]

What picks does your club have? Indicative AFLW Draft Order revealed (https://www.womens.afl/news/94642/what-picks-does-your-club-have-indicative-draft-order-revealed)
The four expansion sides share the first 13 picks between them. In the first 13 picks, the Sydney Swans AFLW side has picks 1, 5, 11, 12 and 13.

Pick 1 isn't quite as good as it sounds because the draft isn't an open draft, but is run as a series of state-based drafts. It means that the Swans will pick 5 times in NSW before the Giants have their first pick.

[aardvark]

Pick 1 isn't quite as good as it sounds because the draft isn't an open draft, but is run as a series of state-based drafts. It means that the Swans will pick 5 times in NSW before the Giants have their first pick.

Players can nominate any state they like so we can offer Tier 1 or 2 contracts / jobs to the best players in the draft and get them to nominate NSW the same as Gold Coast did with Rowbottom last year.

[stevoswan]

Official training begins for the women......go Swans!

AFLW team begin pre-season training (https://www.sydneyswans.com.au/news/1148974/aflw-team-begin-pre-season-training)

https://www.instagram.com/reel/CevwC-hhWI7/?utm_source=ig_embed&ig_rid=6259c847-0258-4111-abe8-30c482673422

[Nico]

A group of us are taking bets on when we will pick up our first Mother/Daughter pick in a draft.

[liz]

A group of us are taking bets on when we will pick up our first Mother/Daughter pick in a draft.

Almost certainly after we pick up a Father/Daughter.

Micky O's daughter, at least one of Kirk's twin daughters and Nicky D's daughter (step daughter??) have all been in the academy and are probably closing in on draft age.

[dejavoodoo44]

Sarah Black from the AFL site, thinks that it's fairly clear cut, who we'll be taking in the upcoming draft.

Sarah Black's 2022 Phantom Draft: Who goes where, your club's whispers (https://www.womens.afl/news/95216/sarah-black-s-2022-phantom-draft-who-goes-where-your-club-s-whispers)

[Mark26]

The draft's on tonight. We should pick up some gems and hopefully our list will be competitive from the outset. It's weird to be gifted the first pick of the draft. Looks like we'll pick Ham as she's nominated she'll come to NSW.

[707]

The Phantom Draft read like the selections for us were fairly clear cut.

A couple are over-agers but we couldn't pre list them so have to burn draft picks on them?

I haven't bothered to watch much AFLW in the past but will be watching the Swans this season. I'm all for the option of tacking on an AFLW membership to your AFL membership rather than them being seperate. I want to support anything Swans :-)

[Meg]

Montana x 2 + Sofia, Cynthia & Alice.

Or H x 3 + B & M.

Sydney Swans 2022 AFLW draftees

Pick 1 - Montana Ham
DOB: 29-03-2004
Height: 179cm
Club/State: Victoria - Western Jets
Position: Midfield

Pick 5 - Sofia Hurley
Club/State: Victoria - Sandringham Dragons
Height: 166cm
DOB: 30-01-2004
Position: Midfield

Pick 11 - Cynthia Hamilton
DOB: 02/04/2004
Height: 170cm
State/Club: NSW - Queanbeyan Tigers
Position: Midfield/ Forward

Pick 12 - Montana Beruldsen
Height: 169cm
DOB: 25/2/1999
State/ Club: South Australia/ Hawthorn VFLW

Pick 13 - Alice Mitchell
Height: 180cm
DOB: 8/8/2001
State/Club: NSW - Gunnedah & District Bulldogs
Position: Defender

[bloodspirit]

I was initially a bit disappointed that we might have burned first round picks drafting Beruldsen and Mitchell due to our stuffing up the paperwork but I think we weren't going to draft anyone else anyway (although, strangely, I note we're foreshadowing already that we're going to put Mitchell on the long term injury list and pick up someone else in her spot).

Obviously we've done really well to persuade Ham and Hurley to come to us from Victoria. I wonder how hard that was and what we offered. Anyway, it means that our tokenistic pick one turned into something meaningful.

I've found only one equivalent of the phantom form guides that are published for the AFLM drafts (as opposed to phantom drafts, of which there were a few) - on Mongrel Punt. According to their ratings we got the equivalents of picks 3 (Ham), 8 (Hurley) and 18 (Hamilton) in an open draft. It's only one person's ratings, but that's pretty good going and looks like we're building a team to last a bit more than for the right now. I think we can afford not to succeed immediately because (a) we are just starting out; and (b) there is such a huge groundswell of support for the team already.

Anyway, I'm super excited. Can't wait for the season to come!

[aardvark]

Glad we got Hams. She’s the best female footballer I’ve ever seen by a country mile. You guys will enjoy watching her ply her trade.

[bloodspirit]

Glad we got Hams. She’s the best female footballer I’ve ever seen by a country mile. You guys will enjoy watching her ply her trade.

How many have you seen? Have you ever had the chance to watch, say, Erin Phillips?

A small thing that made me happy: I was slightly worrying that Cynthia Hamilton might have divided allegiances, being a graduate of the Giants Academy... but then I watched her interview of the Swans website and she said she has supported the Swans all her life and all her family are diehard Swans supporters - then I stopped worrying.

[aardvark]

Hey BS I have watched every single game of AFLW since it began. Admittedly I may have dozed off during a few. I also coached Vic Country U/16 girls basketball the year Erin played for SA. FYI they beat us in the GF by 4 and Erin was sensational. I have also watched the AFLW u/ 16 @18 champs for the last 3 years. My interest is that quite a few of the girls I coached had a love for footy too and a few have made it to AFLW level. Montana stands head and shoulders above anything I’ve seen in that time. She has great skills, size, and most importantly a footy brain. She can play anywhere as she demonstrated at this years Nats. Reminds me of Bontempelli. Barring injury she’ll be a ripper.

[Mark26]

Hey BS I have watched every single game of AFLW since it began. Admittedly I may have dozed off during a few. I also coached Vic Country U/16 girls basketball the year Erin played for SA. FYI they beat us in the GF by 4 and Erin was sensational. I have also watched the AFLW u/ 16 @18 champs for the last 3 years. My interest is that quite a few of the girls I coached had a love for footy too and a few have made it to AFLW level. Montana stands head and shoulders above anything I’ve seen in that time. She has great skills, size, and most importantly a footy brain. She can play anywhere as she demonstrated at this years Nats. Reminds me of Bontempelli. Barring injury she’ll be a ripper.

What an exciting endorsement! Can't wait to watch her play for us. Go Swans.

[bloodspirit]

Hey BS I have watched every single game of AFLW since it began. Admittedly I may have dozed off during a few. I also coached Vic Country U/16 girls basketball the year Erin played for SA. FYI they beat us in the GF by 4 and Erin was sensational. I have also watched the AFLW u/ 16 @18 champs for the last 3 years. My interest is that quite a few of the girls I coached had a love for footy too and a few have made it to AFLW level. Montana stands head and shoulders above anything I’ve seen in that time. She has great skills, size, and most importantly a footy brain. She can play anywhere as she demonstrated at this years Nats. Reminds me of Bontempelli. Barring injury she’ll be a ripper.

Well, first, watching every AFLW match is an incredible effort! Well done! I certainly haven't.

Second, my comment was probably a bit dismissive - which I regret in view of your impressive reply - but I that's also because you were a bit loose and over-egged your comment.

Lastly, and most importantly, it is super exciting to hear your raps on Mon Ham! I think you've gone the early crow but I hope you're right!!

[aardvark]

Must admit it’s certainly the early crow. Mon has something only super talented players have and that’s time. She’s never rushed. I hope I’m not wearing the 🥚

[neilfws]

Nice photos and videos of AFLW training at the SCG, at the club website and on social media:

Sydney Swans AFLW train on SCG (11.07.2022) (https://www.sydneyswans.com.au/albums/1170637/sydney-swans-aflw-train-on-scg-11-07-2022-?modal=true&type=gallery&playlistId=1170637&playlistSize=26)

Looks like most of the boys turned out (can't see Paddy though?)

[liz]

Nice photos and videos of AFLW training at the SCG, at the club website and on social media:

Sydney Swans AFLW train on SCG (11.07.2022) (https://www.sydneyswans.com.au/albums/1170637/sydney-swans-aflw-train-on-scg-11-07-2022-?modal=true&type=gallery&playlistId=1170637&playlistSize=26)

Looks like most of the boys turned out (can't see Paddy though?)

You can see Paddy in photo five - distinctive red beanie.

I looked at the big picture (with both squads together) and decided the men’s squad looked about six players short. (Couldn’t see Paddy in that one, nor Hickey, Ladhams, Ronke, Corey and Stevens. But most of them were probably there.)

One day (hopefully soon) the pictures of the women training will be captioned so we can start putting faces to names.

Edit: I can see Ronke in picture four, on the left hand side wearing white pants.

[TheBloods]

You can see Paddy in photo five - distinctive red beanie.

I looked at the big picture (with both squads together) and decided the men’s squad looked about six players short. (Couldn’t see Paddy in that one, nor Hickey, Ladhams, Ronke, Corey and Stevens. But most of them were probably there.)

One day (hopefully soon) the pictures of the women training will be captioned so we can start putting faces to names.

Edit: I can see Ronke in picture four, on the left hand side wearing white pants.

Poor if they didnt show up

[Hotpotato]

Isaac on 360 highlighted the SWANS W team
Exiting the race onto the SCG (for the first time?), Gosh we’re they beaming .
He called it a monumental moment .
Videod it onto my phone if anyone wants to see it.
Oops , I guess it’s copyrighted .
You’ll find it anyways.

[aardvark]

Poor if they didnt show up
There could be many reasons they weren’t there none of which involve lack of interest or effort on their part.
It would be great if for just this one thread you would keep your negativity to yourself for a change.

[neilfws]

Looks like most of the boys turned out (can't see Paddy though?)

I feel I should clarify that I only mentioned "missing" players out of concern for their availability, in case they might be ill or injured. Not questioning their commitment to supporting the AFLW team.

Greatly looking forward to supporting more Swans in the coming months!

[Maltopia]

Mum's the word: The Guldens join forces at Sydney (https://www.womens.afl/video/95797/mum-s-the-word-the-guldens-join-forces-at-sydney)

- - - Updated - - -

[liz]

I do wish people would stop referring to "the girls". Both Guldens do it in that video, and I think I've heard Harley do so too. They are women, not girls.

[Industrial Fan]

Is that not offset by the normal team being referred to as boys?

[Bloods05]

Is that not offset by the normal team being referred to as boys?
Which happens all the time, and nobody ever has a problem with it.

But it's the men's team, not the "normal" team.

[Industrial Fan]

🙄

Was deliberately avoiding using the term mens to make my point.

[liz]

I acknowledge that players sometimes refer to each other as "the boys". But in that clip, Errol never uses the term "boys". He refers to the "men's team" a couple of times. And then the "girls". I guess I just find it a little patronising.

[Meg]

I acknowledge that players sometimes refer to each other as "the boys". But in that clip, Errol never uses the term "boys". He refers to the "men's team" a couple of times. And then the "girls". I guess I just find it a little patronising.

+1

(though I would delete ‘a little’).

[Goal Sneak]

I noticed Bronwyn refers to them as the girls throughout the interview. People more often than not refer to the boys and the girls when talking about them as a general collective.

It wasn't meant in a derogatory or patronising manner, I feel it's being a little over-sensitive to say otherwise.

[liz]

I noticed Bronwyn refers to them as the girls throughout the interview. People more often than not refer to the boys and the girls when talking about them as a general collective.

It wasn't meant in a derogatory or patronising manner, I feel it's being a little over-sensitive to say otherwise.

What I said was that I found the language a little patronising. I chose my words carefully. I didn't accuse the speakers of being patronising (subtle distinction) and I qualified my adjective in the knowledge that there was likely no intent. I didn't express outrage, or lay out my plans to take the dog and march down Driver Avenue in protest.

Bronwyn has just transitioned from coaching actual girls in the academy, and all the players she is working with now are young enough to be her daughters. So the language doesn't feel so awkward coming from her. It seems more incongruous coming from Errol, given he's a just-turned-twenty-year old who refers to his own team as men. But yes, I get that he is picking up the language from those around him, including his mother.

I merely expressed a hope that we (the football community) can find a way to start referring to the players more often as women. Language does have (sometimes subtle) impacts and I think there's room for pointing that out. It's not being "over-sensitive".

[Maltopia]

I noticed Bronwyn refers to them as the girls throughout the interview. People more often than not refer to the boys and the girls when talking about them as a general collective.

It wasn't meant in a derogatory or patronising manner, I feel it's being a little over-sensitive to say otherwise.

In today's culture, it is overwhelmingly more and more up to the recipient to decide whether a comment is racist, ableist, sexist, patronising etc., and it is worse for the speaker or others to deny the intent/impact of the statement, as you are then gaslighting or invalidating their experience. Women, or any other marginalised group should not have to defend their perception/experience.

If in this case, a woman says they find a comment to be patronising to their gender, then then men ought to listen to that statement and acknowledge the impact, as the men have not had decades and centuries of marginalisation and you just can't compare our experience with theirs.

As a man, I found the references to the girls jarring.

Women have been told forever that they are not as good as men in sport etc, so being referenced as the girls is 100% not equivalent to the men being referenced as the boys.

[Goal Sneak]

What I said was that I found the language a little patronising. I chose my words carefully. I didn't accuse the speakers of being patronising (subtle distinction) and I qualified my adjective in the knowledge that there was likely no intent. I didn't express outrage, or lay out my plans to take the dog and march down Driver Avenue in protest.

Bronwyn has just transitioned from coaching actual girls in the academy, and all the players she is working with now are young enough to be her daughters. So the language doesn't feel so awkward coming from her. It seems more incongruous coming from Errol, given he's a just-turned-twenty-year old who refers to his own team as men. But yes, I get that he is picking up the language from those around him, including his mother.

I merely expressed a hope that we (the football community) can find a way to start referring to the players more often as women. Language does have (sometimes subtle) impacts and I think there's room for pointing that out. It's not being "over-sensitive".

I agree about the subtle impacts attached to language. Different people will invariably interpret the same words in different ways. Personally, I have no issue when the men are referred to as "the boys" or the women as "the girls". It's quite common these days for language to be scrutinised beyond the intent of what has been said (seemingly something I may be a little over-sensitive about). For what it's worth, I can see you were not trying to go beyond the intent in this case.

In this case, for me, the context of the statement should be enough to settle any misgivings in how it was said. I do however agree that there is room to point these types of issues out without being labeled by the likes of myself!

I will admit that "over-sensitive" was not the best choice of language on my behalf.

[Ruck'n'Roll]

I dislike the use of the term "boys" to describe a team of senior AFL players, if only because it seems so often to condone infantile behavior. So I was already strongly predisposed to disliking the term "girls."

[stevoswan]

I noticed Bronwyn refers to them as the girls throughout the interview. People more often than not refer to the boys and the girls when talking about them as a general collective.

It wasn't meant in a derogatory or patronising manner, I feel it's being a little over-sensitive to say otherwise.

+1

I came on here to put up the article about Mrs Gulden coaching....and all I find is people complaining that she used the term 'girls' (and even one complaining about the men being called boys :hmmmm2:)! Are some just looking for something to whinge about ? Girls/women, boys/men....who gives a @@@@? Let's just be happy that there is a 'womens' team at all.....and yes, it's about time. :five:

Men are occasionally called boys and so too will women occasionally be called girls. Get used to it....there's nothing 'sinister' in it! Let's all move on and just enjoy the footy!

Oh and apologies if some choose to jump on this as 'mansplaining'! It's not....it's just my opinion.

[chalbilto]

+1

I came on here to put up the article about Mrs Gulden coaching....and all I find is people complaining that she used the term 'girls' (and even one complaining about the men being called boys :hmmmm2:)! Are some just looking for something to whinge about ? Girls/women, boys/men....who gives a @@@@? Let's just be happy that there is a 'womens' team at all.....and yes, it's about time. :five:

Men are occasionally called boys and so too will women occasionally be called girls. Get used to it....there's nothing 'sinister' in it! Let's all move on and just enjoy the footy!

Oh and apologies if some choose to jump on this as 'mansplaining'! It's not....it's just my opinion.


+1 Well said. More important things to whinge about than the use of “boys” & “girls”.

[Maltopia]

+1 Well said. More important things to whinge about than the use of “boys” & “girls”.

It is totally for the women to decide if the use of girls is appropriate or not, regardless of how the men’s team is described.

[Faunac8]

I openly profess to not being qualified to judge as to what may cause offence to others and I understand that what offends others might not offend me but I am curious as to why some team theme songs reference girls if it is seen by some as patronising ?
I also seem to recall an advert where the female footy team sing the such and such girls after a victory.
Surely if the use of the term girls causes concern to a significant sector of the population then that would be a good place to start.

[Maltopia]

I openly profess to not being qualified to judge as to what may cause offence to others and I understand that what offends others might not offend me but I am curious as to why some team theme songs reference girls if it is seen by some as patronising ?
I also seem to recall an advert where the female footy team sing the such and such girls after a victory.
Surely if the use of the term girls causes concern to a significant sector of the population then that would be a good place to start.

Times change and some take longer to move with the times than others. Not every woman is going to be put off by the use of the term girls. But if some do, we ought to acknowledge that this their experience.

If you disagree with it, you are free to do so, but telling the women to suck it up or that they are being precious or too sensitive is more (possibly ignorant) sexism.

Re times changing…

At my kids’s school, one of the houses is called the MacKillip Monkeys. Innocent naming a couple of decades ago, but would be considered racist nowadays and unwelcoming for any kids from South Africa, India etc as there is understanding now that monkey is used as a racist insult for some groups. Remember how upsetting it was for Goodes for Eddie MaGuire to suggest he play King Kong in a promotion? Or how Eddie Betts felt when people threw bananas at him? Some thought it was funny as he was a master of the banana kick, but to him it was ignorant racism.

The Washington Redskins - the management has acknowledged in recent years the naming, the caricature of an American Indian Chief and their tomahawk celebrations are insulting to American Indians. However for decades fans were doing the tomahawk motion and many argue that it is PC gone too far etc.

The key thing is, if you or I are not in the group that has been marginalised for decades/centuries, the best thing we can do is listen when someone from that group talks about their experience, instead of minimising what they are saying.

Ask open questions if you want to learn about their perspective, but not prejudiced questions like “aren’t you being too sensitive given the men’s team are often labelled the boys?”

Instead, “what does it mean for you when the women’s team is labelled as the girls by a male player?”

Disclosure - I have a social work background and have experience with people with disability, identify as LGBTIQA+, with mental health issues etc.

[Faunac8]

Times change and some take longer to move with the times than others. Not every woman is going to be put off by the use of the term girls. But if some do, we ought to acknowledge that this their experience.

If you disagree with it, you are free to do so, but telling the women to suck it up or that they are being precious or too sensitive is more (possibly ignorant) sexism.

Re times changing…

At my kids’s school, one of the houses is called the MacKillip Monkeys. Innocent naming a couple of decades ago, but would be considered racist nowadays and unwelcoming for any kids from South Africa, India etc as there is understanding now that monkey is used as a racist insult for some groups. Remember how upsetting it was for Goodes for Eddie MaGuire to suggest he play King Kong in a promotion? Or how Eddie Betts felt when people threw bananas at him? Some thought it was funny as he was a master of the banana kick, but to him it was ignorant racism.

The Washington Redskins - the management has acknowledged in recent years the naming, the caricature of an American Indian Chief and their tomahawk celebrations are insulting to American Indians. However for decades fans were doing the tomahawk motion and many argue that it is PC gone too far etc.

The key thing is, if you or I are not in the group that has been marginalised for decades/centuries, the best thing we can do is listen when someone from that group talks about their experience, instead of minimising what they are saying.

Ask open questions if you want to learn about their perspective, but not prejudiced questions like “aren’t you being too sensitive given the men’s team are often labelled the boys?”

Instead, “what does it mean for you when the women’s team is labelled as the girls by a male player?”

Disclosure - I have a social work background and have experience with people with disability, identify as LGBTIQA+, with mental health issues etc.

I simply asked the question if removing the reference to girls from within the actual organisation itself might be a good starting point.
If you felt I was suggesting that they should just suck it up then I probably need to revisit and edit my post that you responded to in such detail as that was 360 degrees away from the intent of my post.

[Maltopia]

I simply asked the question if removing the reference to girls from within the actual organisation itself might be a good starting point.
If you felt I was suggesting that they should just suck it up then I probably need to revisit and edit my post that you responded to in such detail as that was 360 degrees away from the intent of my post.

Hey Faunac8, the reply was to all/others. The “you” was not YOU. Sorry I didn’t use the “one” pronoun to make it clear I wasn’t saying YOU were suggesting a suck it up approach.

[Faunac8]

Hey Faunac8, the reply was to all/others. The “you” was not YOU. Sorry I didn’t use the “one” pronoun to make it clear I wasn’t saying YOU were suggesting a suck it up approach.
All good I thought maybe I had not been clear where my thoughts lay.

[stevoswan]

It is totally for the women to decide if the use of girls is appropriate or not, regardless of how the men’s team is described.

....and I'm sure most of them don't give a rats. They're playing in a team where they'll all have each others back and if someone calls them a girl in a positive fashion, I'm sure they'll be fine. You know at our club it won't be said in a way that has negative connotations. Unless we have Liz Cambage in our squad! There is basically nothing 'to suck up' in the first place.

However, if the womens team actually come out and say "we don't want to be referred to as girls", I would respect that.....but I'm not sure this issue is even on their radar. Time will tell I guess but as none of us know what they're actually thinking, I reckon we should maybe just let them speak for themselves, eh? If it's an actual issue, they'll probably let us know. In the meantime, let's just talk about their footy.

[Faunac8]

w
....and I'm sure most of them don't give a rats. They're playing in a team where they'll all have each others back and if someone calls them a girl in a positive fashion, I'm sure they'll be fine. You know at our club it won't be said in a way that has negative connotations. Unless we have Liz Cambage in our squad! There is basically nothing 'to suck up' in the first place.

However, if the womens team actually come out and say "we don't want to be referred to as girls", I would respect that.....but I'm not sure this issue is even on their radar. Time will tell I guess but as none of us know what they're actually thinking, I reckon we should maybe just let them speak for themselves, eh? If it's an actual issue, they'll probably let us know. In the meantime, let's just talk about their footy.

Why are you so sure they don’t give a rats have you asked them? has a survey been conducted ? Have players been interviewed by media ? Are they on social media saying the use of the pronoun girls is not offensive and it’s all part of footy etc ?
I don’t want to be confrontational but this comment is so close to a mansplain it’s borderline offensive to the players involved.

[Maltopia]

w

Why are you so sure they don’t give a rats have you asked them? has a survey been conducted ? Have players been interviewed by media ? Are they on social media saying the use of the pronoun girls is not offensive and it’s all part of footy etc ?
I don’t want to be confrontational but this comment is so close to a mansplain it’s borderline offensive to the players involved.

+1

And marginalised people often don’t speak out. The mainstream expect them to be happy for their opportunity. Smile and be happy, just play football etc.

Even a champion and beloved player like Eddie Betts has said that he was afraid to speak out about racism during his career. Look at what happened to Goodes.

[stevoswan]

w

Why are you so sure they don’t give a rats have you asked them? has a survey been conducted ? Have players been interviewed by media ? Are they on social media saying the use of the pronoun girls is not offensive and it’s all part of footy etc ?
I don’t want to be confrontational but this comment is so close to a mansplain it’s borderline offensive to the players involved.


+1

And marginalised people often don’t speak out. The mainstream expect them to be happy for their opportunity. Smile and be happy, just play football etc.

Even a champion and beloved player like Eddie Betts has said that he was afraid to speak out about racism during his career. Look at what happened to Goodes.

OK, you both seem to both know 'much more than me'.....so I'll just leave the pontificating on things that both you and I know nothing about to you two then. You seem to think you know how all women feel. Is this subject even as important as stamping out racism? Seriously?

Maybe you could do that survey....lest the ladies are too afraid to speak out. Just by implying that concept, you are effectively saying our club is NOT a supportive environment. Are you?

Also, how is saying we should just let the ladies speak for themselves 'mansplaining'? Isn't you speaking for them just that?

Sheese!

[Maltopia]

OK, you both seem to both know 'much more than me'.....so I'll just leave the pontificating on things I know nothing about to you two then. You seem to think you know how all women feel. Is this subject even as important as stamping out racism? Seriously?

Maybe you could do that survey....lest the ladies are too afraid to speak out. Just by implying that concept, you are effectively saying our club is NOT a supportive environment. Are you?

Sheese!

I said we should ask the women. I didn’t say how all women feel, you almost did by declaring that most of them don’t give a rat’s.

Also it is not a war between racism or sexism etc.

To anyone who is treated with bias, it is critically important to them.

[stevoswan]

I said we should ask the women. I didn’t say how all women feel, you almost did by declaring that most of them don’t give a rat’s.

Also it is not a war between racism or sexism etc.

To anyone who is treated with bias, it is critically important to them.

.....and it's their fight to fight....no one else's. We should support them by all means.....but not speak for them or think we know what they're thinking. We are all guilty of that here. It is just my guess that they don't give a rats.....and just your guess that they actually do.

Just a little end note....it is my opinion that stamping out racism is far more important than this 'gender terminology' fight. Just sayin'....and I think Adam and Eddie would agree with me....and maybe the female players would too. Of course I can't be sure of that until I actually ask them.:smile:

Until then, it remains an 'opinion'. You are welcome to disagree with that opinion......and I'm sure you'll try to find a way to do just that.

[Faunac8]

.....and it's their fight to fight....no one else's. We should support them by all means.....but not speak for them or think we know what they're thinking. We are all guilty of that here. It is just my guess that they don't give a rats.....and just your guess that they actually do.

Just a little end note....it is my opinion that stamping out racism is far more important than this 'gender terminology' fight. Just sayin'....and I think Adam and Eddie would agree with me....and maybe the female players would too. Of course I can't be sure of that until I actually ask them.:smile:

Until then, it remains an 'opinion'. You are welcome to disagree with that opinion......and I'm sure you'll try to find a way to do just that.

Then maybe instead of repeatedly saying I’m sure try using I think or I feel
I also never said that I was speaking for anybody and how you interpreted my opinion as such is a mystery to me.
You do know that some posts on this actual subject thread saying they don’t appreciate that terminology have been made by what appear to be female supporters.
It sort of removes the guesswork that you imply is involved in my comments.
And I for one do not profess to “ know much more than you “ and never suggested I did.

[stevoswan]

Then maybe instead of repeatedly saying I’m sure try using I think or I feel
I also never said that I was speaking for anybody and how you interpreted my opinion as such is a mystery to me.
You do know that some posts on this actual subject thread saying they don’t appreciate that terminology have been made by what appear to be female supporters.
It sort of removes the guesswork that you imply is involved in my comments.
And I for one do not profess to “ know much more than you “ and never suggested I did.

I saw that.....so now same gender fans can speak for the players? Have they actually spoken to the female players?

All I am saying is that it's not for us to decide what these women players think and feel, it is up to them. Wouldn't you agree?

BTW, I am sure.....but as I said in an earlier post, I guess time will tell....just don't create and draw these players into a situation/dispute that may indeed not even exist.

[KTigers]

I would have thought that male members of mens sporting teams have been referring to their teammates as "boys",
and female members of womens sporting teams have referring to their teammates as "girls" since the dawn of time.
I don't think there is anything sinister or untoward about it. I think it's almost a term of affection between teammates.
And not meant to mean they think their teammates are children.
I suppose if the womens league is called the AFLW then maybe the mens league could become the AFLM.
It wouldn't bother me. But it's hard to see it happening anytime soon.

[Maltopia]

I would have thought that male members of mens sporting teams have been referring to their teammates as "boys",
and female members of womens sporting teams have referring to their teammates as "girls" since the dawn of time.
I don't think there is anything sinister or untoward about it. I think it's almost a term of affection between teammates.
And not meant to mean they think their teammates are children.
I suppose if the womens league is called the AFLW then maybe the mens league could become the AFLM.
It wouldn't bother me. But it's hard to see it happening anytime soon.

The concern that was voiced was primarily around Errol Gulden, a man referring to the players as girls. A man meaning well I am sure, without any sinister intent, and maybe under the pressure of an unscripted media session.

Meaning well does not mean it doesn’t have an impact. Language and marginalisation can happen through subconscious unintended prejudice and norms. It doesn’t have to be through malicious intent.

I refer to racism as a parallel, not to make it a culture war and say it is just as bad. The Collingwood players who called H Lumumba a chimp a decade ago thought it was harmless fun and a term of affection for super talented player. It took him and Indigenous team mates a decade to speak up about it.

If teammates want to refer to each other as girls that is one thing.

Supporters and staff who are male referring to the players is different.

Using your argument KTigers, it is the AFLW, not the AFLG.

And there were plenty who raised concerns at the time that the AFLW name was sexist as they were also AFL players and the men’s completion was not being renamed AFLM.

Tennis handle it a bit better with a men’s tour under the ATP (and Challenger) and the women’s tour under the WTA and ITF.

[KTigers]

Clearly the Collingwood club effectively condoning calling Lumumba a chimp is just appalling. Even Buckley making light of it shows he
is so stupid he doesn't even know how stupid he is. It's like the other night we watched "The Final Quarter" and in it there is Garry Lyon
saying one moronic thing after another. His only plus was that he was not "as bad" as Sam Newman. Football is full of these types of
people. They have reached middle age and then some and have learnt nothing about the world. There is no hope for them.
Errol is what? 20, right. He is a kid basically. He is not a man. I'd give him a free pass for now. If he is smart enough he'll learn. If he's
not, he won't.
Re the name of the womens league. Yeah sure maybe they should change it to something without the "W". Call it NAR (National Australian
Rules) or FAR (Federation of Australian Rules). People will figure it out. Hopefully.

[Maltopia]

I think our club can do better.

AFL and AFLW players come together at MCG in celebration of historic milestone (https://www.afl.com.au/news/803213/afl-and-aflw-players-come-together-at-mcg-in-celebration-of-historic-milestone)

For the men, some teams sent captains, high draft picks, stars or exciting talent. Eg the Bont, Selwood etc.

We sent an injured player who had a brain snap and punched a down player on the ground.

Yes Paddy Ryder is also injured, but at least he is not a lesser light like Ladhams.

[Goal Sneak]

I think our club can do better.

AFL and AFLW players come together at MCG in celebration of historic milestone (https://www.afl.com.au/news/803213/afl-and-aflw-players-come-together-at-mcg-in-celebration-of-historic-milestone)

For the men, some teams sent captains, high draft picks, stars or exciting talent. Eg the Bont, Selwood etc.

We sent an injured player who had a brain snap and punched a down player on the ground.

Yes Paddy Ryder is also injured, but at least he is not a lesser light like Ladhams.

Now this just seems as if you're actively looking to create issues to complain about and push the line that the whole Club is sexist.

[stevoswan]

The concern that was voiced was primarily around Errol Gulden, a man referring to the players as girls. A man meaning well I am sure, without any sinister intent, and maybe under the pressure of an unscripted media session.

Meaning well does not mean it doesn’t have an impact. Language and marginalisation can happen through subconscious unintended prejudice and norms. It doesn’t have to be through malicious intent.

I refer to racism as a parallel, not to make it a culture war and say it is just as bad. The Collingwood players who called H Lumumba a chimp a decade ago thought it was harmless fun and a term of affection for super talented player. It took him and Indigenous team mates a decade to speak up about it.

If teammates want to refer to each other as girls that is one thing.

Supporters and staff who are male referring to the players is different.

Using your argument KTigers, it is the AFLW, not the AFLG.

And there were plenty who raised concerns at the time that the AFLW name was sexist as they were also AFL players and the men’s completion was not being renamed AFLM.

Tennis handle it a bit better with a men’s tour under the ATP (and Challenger) and the women’s tour under the WTA and ITF.

Look I'm sure you mean well.....but that just sounds preachy and superior.....as if others can't see what you see. Like you underestimate everyone else. I think we all get it and don't need to be told. Sorry.

Again, I'll wait for the women to say something.....if they deem it worthy.....but I don't think I'll be holding my breath for it. Of course, if they do, I'll respect their wishes.....because they want it.
.

- - - Updated - - -


Now this just seems as if you're actively looking to create issues to complain about and push the line that the whole Club is sexist.

+1

[TheBloods]

Christ , i came in here hoping to find some info on when the girls start , instead its just back and forths . Why ?

Liz said she felt bothered by using the word girls . I would use the word girls as some of them are the same age as my granddaughters who i still remember dropping off at kindergarten ! But thats me . Not my place or anyone elses place to tell Liz how she should feel about it . Instead everyone gets cranky . If you disagree fine . Give your opinion and move on , dont bludgeon someone over the head fod having a different opinion to you !

Now when the F do the games start , i want to get to some ,

[stevoswan]

Christ , i came in here hoping to find some info on when the girls start , instead its just back and forths . Why ?

Liz said she felt bothered by using the word girls . I would use the word girls as some of them are the same age as my granddaughters who i still remember dropping off at kindergarten ! But thats me . Not my place or anyone elses place to tell Liz how she should feel about it . Instead everyone gets cranky . If you disagree fine . Give your opinion and move on , dont bludgeon someone over the head fod having a different opinion to you !

Now when the F do the games start , i want to get to some ,

It hasn't been Liz doing the pontificating.

PS: I have highlighted the words that may also apply to you......re: RB. Always look within.....

[Maltopia]

Now this just seems as if you're actively looking to create issues to complain about and push the line that the whole Club is sexist.

Not my intent, but I fully own that if that is how it has come across, that is my fault.

I like to comment on stuff.

I don’t at all think the whole club is sexist. I just think we could have sent someone of higher standing.

Then again it may also be a personal development thing for Ladhams too.

[Ruck'n'Roll]

Give your opinion and move on , dont bludgeon someone over the head fod having a different opinion to you !
If only you'd taken that bit of advice youself sometime in the last two years.

[liz]

Not my intent, but I fully own that if that is how it has come across, that is my fault.

I like to comment on stuff.

I don’t at all think the whole club is sexist. I just think we could have sent someone of higher standing.

Then again it may also be a personal development thing for Ladhams too.

You haven't been pontificating. You have been patiently responding to what people have actually said. I've thought about jumping in on occasions but figured you were likely being more dispassionate than I might be, and drawing on your professional expertise.

It is clear (to me) that despite protestations to the contrary, some people don't remotely "get it".

But it is nice to know that we girls don't have to make this journey all on our own.

Re Ladhams, I initially had a similar reflex response to you when I read that article. But to be fair to the club, most of the players from non-Victorian sides are injured players. Certainly the two from Perth and King from Gold Coast. I'm wasn't aware that Ryan Lester, Brodie Smith or Lachie Jones were injured but I just checked the teams from the weekend. Lester and Jones didn't play, Smith did (against us, so I maybe should have known that). Like it or not, Ladhams is probably the most high profile of our injured players at the moment (O'Riordan, Naismith and Sheather being the only others - I think).

Maybe it wouldn't have been that big a deal in normal times for one of the experienced, high-profile players to take a day off training to represent the club. But I imagine they don't want to unnecessarily expose anyone to commercial airline travel right now. It's not the only COVID-risk situation, but it is an avoidable one.

[Mel_C]

I think our club can do better.

AFL and AFLW players come together at MCG in celebration of historic milestone (https://www.afl.com.au/news/803213/afl-and-aflw-players-come-together-at-mcg-in-celebration-of-historic-milestone)

For the men, some teams sent captains, high draft picks, stars or exciting talent. Eg the Bont, Selwood etc.

We sent an injured player who had a brain snap and punched a down player on the ground.

Yes Paddy Ryder is also injured, but at least he is not a lesser light like Ladhams.

I understand where you're coming from but Bont and Selwood live in Victoria. They don't have to miss training/meetings etc like one of our captains/stars would have. Ladhams was a senior player who was injured so was available to travel. I noticed Melbourne sent Ben Brown who is also injured and they train just down the road.

[TheBloods]

Good that ALL the boys showed up to support the girls getting their jumpers tonight !

[Maltopia]

You haven't been pontificating. You have been patiently responding to what people have actually said. I've thought about jumping in on occasions but figured you were likely being more dispassionate than I might be, and drawing on your professional expertise.

It is clear (to me) that despite protestations to the contrary, some people don't remotely "get it".

But it is nice to know that we girls don't have to make this journey all on our own.

Re Ladhams, I initially had a similar reflex response to you when I read that article. But to be fair to the club, most of the players from non-Victorian sides are injured players. Certainly the two from Perth and King from Gold Coast. I'm wasn't aware that Ryan Lester, Brodie Smith or Lachie Jones were injured but I just checked the teams from the weekend. Lester and Jones didn't play, Smith did (against us, so I maybe should have known that). Like it or not, Ladhams is probably the most high profile of our injured players at the moment (O'Riordan, Naismith and Sheather being the only others - I think).

Maybe it wouldn't have been that big a deal in normal times for one of the experienced, high-profile players to take a day off training to represent the club. But I imagine they don't want to unnecessarily expose anyone to commercial airline travel right now. It's not the only COVID-risk situation, but it is an avoidable one.

Thanks for your post Liz. Glad that at least in your eyes, I am not overstepping in my posts about gender equality.

Good point re the travel to Melbourne for the photo. I did think there were some injured players, but didn't note that was a common theme for the non-Victorian teams. I would have considered sending JPK, former captain and future Swans Legend/HOF member as he isn't a lock to be in the team this week, but it isn't my call to make.

[Mark26]

Apologies for my late arrival into this forum. There's never a need to apologise for highlighting any form of inequality or subjugation. Thanks to Liz and Malt for doing so. I'm going to sound "preachy" and I don't care.

Gender inequality has always existed. Gender inequality still exists in our schools, workplaces and in our football club. Gender inequality is typically watered down by the patriarchy.

Women (as a result of said inequality) are by far the most evolved of our species. Women have been reinventing themselves through several waves of feminism. The patriarchy (on the other hand) is still stuck in a form of toxic masculinity.

End of sermon... I'll step down from the pulpit.

[liz]

Thanks for your post Liz. Glad that at least in your eyes, I am not overstepping in my posts about gender equality.



I don't think gender equality is the most important aspect of this conversation. It's more, as you've highlighted in several of your posts, people being aware of the language they use, and the effects it has on others (sometimes intended; sometimes not). It's about how people use language to establish power over others and control of a discourse (lots of examples in this thread). It's about appreciating how the words themselves are just a small part of language, and how their meaning changes - subtly or bluntly - depending on their context and on who uses them.

And I'd hoped it would be about listening and understanding, but I'm not so sure about that now.

[stevoswan]

It is clear (to me) that despite protestations to the contrary, some people don't remotely "get it".

But it is nice to know that we girls don't have to make this journey all on our own.



Liz, I'm confused.....apparently believing that women players would not be too concerned about the term 'girls' being used means that we don't support women/girls? That we don't 'get it'? :hmmmm2:

Nothing could be further from the truth.

I'm sorry but if that's how you and others interpreted those particular posts.....the future of these gender issues is bleak indeed.:frown

BTW, I have always said that if the women's team came forward as a collective and said that they don't want to be referred to as 'girls', I would totally support that. At least it came from them....the people we are all talking for here, you included.

[stevoswan]

I don't think gender equality is the most important aspect of this conversation. It's more, as you've highlighted in several of your posts, people being aware of the language they use, and the effects it has on others (sometimes intended; sometimes not). It's about how people use language to establish power over others and control of a discourse (lots of examples in this thread). It's about appreciating how the words themselves are just a small part of language, and how their meaning changes - subtly or bluntly - depending on their context and on who uses them.

And I'd hoped it would be about listening and understanding, but I'm not so sure about that now.

I listen when there's something to hear......as in the womens team actually confirming your views and stating that the term girls hurts or offends them. Until then, I'll take your views on board (heck, I agree with most of them on this issue)......oh, and not be offended when the men are called boys.

[liz]

The AFL site has published what it projects to be our best side at the start of the season. I don't know if anyone on here knows enough about AFLW and the Swans' squad to comment on whether they've got this right, or to form a view on how competitive we might be. Even if not, the commentary following this "best 22" will start to educate us a little on our players and what to expect.

Your club's best 21: Sydney (https://www.womens.afl/news/96016?_ga=2.95536412.1845888458.1656828158-1792414675.1595492719)

[TheBloods]

The AFL site has published what it projects to be our best side at the start of the season. I don't know if anyone on here knows enough about AFLW and the Swans' squad to comment on whether they've got this right, or to form a view on how competitive we might be. Even if not, the commentary following this "best 22" will start to educate us a little on our players and what to expect.

Your club's best 21: Sydney (https://www.womens.afl/news/96016?_ga=2.95536412.1845888458.1656828158-1792414675.1595492719)

Why is it 21 ?

[sprite]

Why is it 21 ?

The have 16 on the field al la VFA days, they have a 5-6-5 set up for the bounce.

[stevoswan]

I have seen a bit of Academy training footage and I reckon we will be well served over the years by some of the recruits from this source. The women looked like they actually have a clue, had good skills and were quite impressive in their drills. Of course, I realise that training and game pressure are vastly different but am hoping this apparent cohesion transmits to the field on game days. Really looking forward to the AFLW season this year.


Why is it 21 ?

Only three on the interchange bench in AFLW? That's a guess.

PS: Oh, I see sprite has answered that.

[bloodspirit]

My excitement for the season is growing hugely. I'm getting my head around the list. Now that membership comes with games I have signed up to be a member.

I would love to go and watch some training - does anyone know when they train? Friday evenings? Saturday mornings? (Seems odd they would do both so close to each other.) Lots of great stories among the playing group. It's a pity Alice Mitchell won't play this season but hopefully someone else steps up and takes their chance.

I'm tipping Lochland and Dargan to be named as captains (perhaps captain and vice captain) and I reckon there's a fair chance Woodward will be in the leadership group too.

Our list seems to have good midfield depth but be a little bit leaner with the key position types. We don't have a pure ruck and Ally Morphett, who will presumably be our main ruck, is one of our youngest players (still only 18 years old). I've got butterflies thinking about the season opener. I can only imagine how the players feel!

[bloodspirit]

I've just found an analysis of our list which backs up some of the observations I made in my last post: Season 7 Expansion Side list analysis: Sydney - Aussie Rules Rookie Me Central (https://central.rookieme.com/afl/2022/07/29/season-7-expansion-side-list-analysis-sydney/).

Less comprehensive, but more interesting, is this interview with Scott Gowans: Credit to the Girls - Sydney's Scott Gowans - Credit to the Girls - an AFLW podcast - Omny.fm (https://omny.fm/shows/credit-to-the-girls-an-aflw-podcast/credit-to-the-girls-sydneys-scott-gowans).

[joeykanga]

I've just found an analysis of our list which backs up some of the observations I made in my last post: Season 7 Expansion Side list analysis: Sydney - Aussie Rules Rookie Me Central (https://central.rookieme.com/afl/2022/07/29/season-7-expansion-side-list-analysis-sydney/).

Less comprehensive, but more interesting, is this interview with Scott Gowans: Credit to the Girls - Sydney's Scott Gowans - Credit to the Girls - an AFLW podcast - Omny.fm (https://omny.fm/shows/credit-to-the-girls-an-aflw-podcast/credit-to-the-girls-sydneys-scott-gowans).
Kiara Beesley is impressive...I think she was interviewed by Adam Spencer during the AFLW jumper presentation night.
Her answers were very impressive so I looked her up and she has quite the educational pedigree and I noticed that she also did really well in the combine testing.. an early favourite for me already

[monopoly19]

The interview with Sam Mostyn on the Swans new AFLW podcast is worth a listen. We’re really lucky to have her as part of this club. Our AFLW podcast is here (https://www.sydneyswans.com.au/news/1187790/our-aflw-podcast-is-here)

[bloodspirit]

The interview with Sam Mostyn on the Swans new AFLW podcast is worth a listen. We’re really lucky to have her as part of this club. Our AFLW podcast is here (https://www.sydneyswans.com.au/news/1187790/our-aflw-podcast-is-here)

Thanks for the heads up. Not the most dazzling listen but gave me an appreciation of her role in making the AFLW happen. We're lucky to have her in our camp.

Sam Mostyn recommends reading Play On: The Hidden History of Women's Australian Rules Football: Play on! The Hidden History of Women's Australian Rules Football by Brunette Lenkić (goodreads.com) (https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/31430751-play-on-the-hidden-history-of-women-s-australian-rules-football#:~:text=Play%20On!%20is%20the%20first,%E2 %80%93%20sidelined%2C%20ignored%20or%20forgotten.) .

- - - Updated - - -

Also, there's gonna be a match sim against the Giants AFLW team at Tramway Oval 6 pm this Friday: AFLW Match Simulation begins (sydneyswans.com.au) (https://www.sydneyswans.com.au/news/1187349/aflw-match-simulation-begins).

[bloodspirit]

Just read that Bella Smith has done her ACL! But turns out that the Brisbane Lions have their own Bella Smith and it's her that has sustained the injury not our own Bella Smith. Hope Bella#2 has a good recovery. And that Bella#1 has a ripper of a season!

[bloodspirit]

Here's a good interview with Scott Gowans: LISTEN: How the Swans pulled off a draft coup (womens.afl) (https://www.womens.afl/news/95899/listen-how-the-swans-pulled-off-a-draft-coup?_ga=2.43200549.1459373536.1659596159-649733569.1624324026).

[Maltopia]

First full practice match vs Collingwood on Saturday at Blacktown. Game will be livestreamed on Sydney Swans website.

[aardvark]

Doing well. Level at qtr time.

[aardvark]

Girls going great. 9 pts up at half time.

[joeykanga]

Girls going great. 9 pts up at half time.

Our ruck is in impressive number 7 and the energy and team spirit seem very switched on.

There's no commentary so it's hard to pick the players but there was a really impressive handball passage leading up to our set @@@@ from in front in the second last goal of the quarter

[Maltopia]

Our ruck is in impressive number 7 and the energy and team spirit seem very switched on.

There's no commentary so it's hard to pick the players but there was a really impressive handball passage leading up to our set @@@@ from in front in the second last goal of the quarter

Alley Morphett, 188cm and recruited from GWS.

Yeah I noticed her just shoving their ruck over easily.

We kept kicking it to the other team for a while and they were also marking a lot of their own kicks for a while but great to see us get the lead.

[joeykanga]

Alley Morphett, 188cm and recruited from GWS.

Yeah I noticed her just shoving their ruck over easily.

We kept kicking it to the other team for a while and they were also marking a lot of their own kicks for a while but great to see us get the lead.

She was a standout...very impressive and I'm glad I know the name now rather than just a number. Thank you.
I thought our ground level contests were good but their kicking skills and contested marks got then the game. We found it hard to take a contested mark lowing the ball to quickly go back the other way.
It was good to see and it's just the first game. How many of our high profile draftees were out there?

- - - Updated - - -


Alley Morphett, 188cm and recruited from GWS.

Yeah I noticed her just shoving their ruck over easily.

We kept kicking it to the other team for a while and they were also marking a lot of their own kicks for a while but great to see us get the lead.

She was a standout...very impressive and I'm glad I know the name now rather than just a number. Thank you.
I thought our ground level contests were good but their kicking skills and contested marks got them the game. We found it hard to take a contested mark allowing the ball to quickly go back the other way.
It was good to see them for the first time for me. How many of our high profile draftees were out there?

[Maltopia]

She was a standout...very impressive and I'm glad I know the name now rather than just a number. Thank you.
I thought our ground level contests were good but their kicking skills and contested marks got them the game. We found it hard to take a contested mark allowing the ball to quickly go back the other way.
It was good to see them for the first time for me. How many of our high profile draftees were out there?

At 188cm, she isn't that tall, but when so many players are around the 165cm mark, she looked like a giant on the field. Hope she continues to monster her opponents!

[Maltopia]

"No.1 selection in the 2022 NAB AFL Women's Draft, Montana Ham (Sydney Swans), was overwhelmingly selected by seven captains to claim the NAB AFLW Rising Star award in her debut season."

The tips are in: Captains pick best team, B&F, Rising Star, more (https://www.womens.afl/news/99011?_ga=2.15436720.746117019.1660722068-1716973200.1652691028)

[bloodspirit]

Interestingly Maddy Collier attended the event as our 'captain'. No captain has been formally appointed yet, only a 6 woman leadership group of whom Collier is one.

I'll be slightly surprised if she is named sole captain - so I'm bracing myself for mild surprise.

[Maltopia]

Our FIRST captains announced (https://www.sydneyswans.com.au/news/1206856/our-first-captains-announced)

[Goal Sneak]

Does anyone know if there is a Father/Daughter rule and does it work the other way with a Mother/Son rule?

[liz]

Does anyone know if there is a Father/Daughter rule and does it work the other way with a Mother/Son rule?

There is a Father/Daughter rule. A player only needs to have played a single game for the men's team for the daughter to be eligible.

I don't suppose there are any eligible sons (or daughters) of AFLW players yet. I guess there will be such a rule but I don't know if they've yet set any thresholds.

[Meg]

Does anyone know if there is a Father/Daughter rule and does it work the other way with a Mother/Son rule?

Yes there is a father/daughter rule, but a father has had to play only one match for a club to have priority draft access to a daughter.

When AFLW commenced in 2017 the AFL said it would investigate a mother/son rule (see attached article). As far as I am aware no decision has yet been announced.

I guess it is likely to be at least another 10 years before any eligible sons are of draft age, so there is plenty of time to work out the appropriate number of matches for qualification.


https://heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/aflw/afl-investigating-introduction-of-motherson-rule-to-allow-sons-of-aflw-players-to-play-for-their-clubs/news-story/5cc47d8778149292ac70ebf3ac87836a

[Goal Sneak]

Thanks liz & Meg, much appreciated

[Meg]

There have already been quite a few father/daughter priority draft selections. This is probably not comprehensive but I’ve listed some below. Most fathers had long AFL careers but two of those I’ve shown were only very short.


. Abbie McKay (Carlton) daughter of Andrew, 244 games from 1993 to 2003, was the first;

. Isabella Grant (Bulldogs) daughter of Chris Grant, 341 games between 1990 and 2007);

. Millie Brown (Geelong) daughter of Paul Brown, 84 games from 1990 to 1998;

. Tarni Brown (Collingwood) daughter of Gavin Brown, 254 games between 1987 and 2000;

. Alice Burke (St Kilda) daughter of Nathan Burke, 323 games between 1987 and 2003;

. Georgia Campbell (who chose Melbourne) daughter of Adrian Campbell who played 30 games for the Western Bulldogs between 1988 and 1992, and two matches for Melbourne in 1993;

. Amy Smith (North Melbourne) daughter of Shaun Smith, 47 games between 1987 and 1992;

. Caitlin Matthews (St Kilda) daughter of Dean Matthews, one senior game for the Saints in 1995.


Alice Burke/Nathan Burke has the added quirk that Alice is playing for St Kilda where Nathan had an illustrious career. But Nathan is now the coach of the Bulldogs AfLW team. Must make for interesting dinner table conversations!

Also of interest this year Erin Phillips, daughter of Port legend Greg Phillips, will play and captain Port in their inaugural AFLW season after transferring across from the Crows. This is not a father/daughter selection as Erin already has an elite AFLW career. But it is a very emotional selection for Port supporters (and for Greg from the photos I saw of Greg in tears) who see this as Erin ‘coming home’.

[Goal Sneak]

There have already been quite a few father/daughter priority draft selections. This is probably not comprehensive but I’ve listed some below. Most fathers had long AFL careers but two of those I’ve shown were only very short.


. Abbie McKay (Carlton) daughter of Andrew, 244 games from 1993 to 2003, was the first;

. Isabella Grant (Bulldogs) daughter of Chris Grant, 341 games between 1990 and 2007);

. Millie Brown (Geelong) daughter of Paul Brown, 84 games from 1990 to 1998;

. Tarni Brown (Collingwood) daughter of Gavin Brown, 254 games between 1987 and 2000;

. Alice Burke (St Kilda) daughter of Nathan Burke, 323 games between 1987 and 2003;

. Georgia Campbell (who chose Melbourne) daughter of Adrian Campbell who played 30 games for the Western Bulldogs between 1988 and 1992, and two matches for Melbourne in 1993;

. Amy Smith (North Melbourne) daughter of Shaun Smith, 47 games between 1987 and 1992;

. Caitlin Matthews (St Kilda) daughter of Dean Matthews, one senior game for the Saints in 1995.


Alice Burke/Nathan Burke has the added quirk that Alice is playing for St Kilda where Nathan had an illustrious career. But Nathan is now the coach of the Bulldogs AfLW team. Must make for interesting dinner table conversations!

Also of interest this year Erin Phillips, daughter of Port legend Greg Phillips, will play and captain Port in their inaugural AFLW season after transferring across from the Crows. This is not a father/daughter selection as Erin already has an elite AFLW career. But it is a very emotional selection for Port supporters (and for Greg from the photos I saw of Greg in tears) who see this as Erin ‘coming home’.

Wow, very interesting! It must've been bittersweet for Greg to see Erin playing for the Crows, makes it even sweeter now that she's able to play for the Power.

Love your work Meg :clap:

[Meg]

Re Erin & Greg Phillips, watch the tears flow in the embedded video in the article linked below!


‘(Erin) Phillips was the first player signed to the Power’s AFLW team, and is widely regarded as the best player in the competition.

The 36-year-old won three premierships with the Crows, along with three All Australian honours. Phillips was also named best on ground in two of those three grand final victories.

“As a kid growing up, all I wanted was to be like Dad and play football for the Port Adelaide Football Club,” she said when she signed in April.’

https://www.foxsports.com.au/afl/womens-afl/phillips-famous-dad-left-in-tears-as-star-named-ports-inaugural-aflw-captain/news-story/2f84d459af7bdb0ac4c0c2cad07d2093


Our Swans team play Port (both clubs in their first AFLW season) in Round 4 at the atmospheric suburban oval at Alberton. Would be a good game to attend for SA Swans supporters.