Aftermatch Thoughts: The Good, The Bad and The Ugly

[ugg]

Good:
O'Keefe - great performance, strong hands, super workrate. Forms a great partnership with Hall.
Hall - Worked hard again all day.
Bevan - so bloody hard at the ball, definitely an integral part of the side now.
Schneider - should be given more time in the midfield.
Leo Barry & Craig Bolton - did alright jobs on their respective opponents, although we missed Leo's run out of defence.

Bad:
Goodes - AWOL, M.Bolton outgunned him.
Saddington - touched up by Lucas and McPhee. I've come to realise he just gets continually outbodied. Rogers did way better than him on Lucas.
The bench - What was the point of having two talls sitting on the bench for the majority of the match.

Ugly:
Midfield & Clearances - Enough said.
Plan B - we need one.
Bloody umpires.

[hammo]

5 Essendon goals from free kicks tells a big story, however let's not get sidetracked with the umpires (who were useless).

Swans inability to win midfield ball is becoming very concerning. Other midfields are simply outgunning us.

Goodes had a bad game. When he actually got the ball his disposal was awful. Too often when the ball was only 5 or 10 metres away he seemed to be lumbering. I don't expect him to be in Brownlow form evrey game but his off games shouldn't be this bad.

Too many of our players did well in patches only.

Is Maxfield 100% fit??

[swans_premiers]

Originally posted by hammo
5 Essendon goals from free kicks tells a big story, however let's not get sidetracked with the umpires (who were useless).

Swans inability to win midfield ball is becoming very concerning. Other midfields are simply outgunning us.

Goodes had a bad game. When he actually got the ball his disposal was awful. Too often when the ball was only 5 or 10 metres away he seemed to be lumbering. I don't expect him to be in Brownlow form evrey game but his off games shouldn't be this bad.

Too many of our players did well in patches only.

Is Maxfield 100% fit??

Maxfield was great in the last quarter.

[hammo]

Originally posted by swans_premiers
Maxfield was great in the last quarter.

I agree. But why did he spend so much time off the field in the first and second quarters when the game had to be won??

[dendol]

Agree with Goodes' performances of late. Lets hope its just a phase and related to our inability to win any ball.

Dont agree with your opinion on Saddo's game. He played on the wing a fair bit today and looked alot more comfortable. Definately would prefer to see him there, where he can float forward to take a mark, or go back to help the defense like he did to cut off leading forwards today.

McVeigh was quiet again. Didnt get much game time though, but its clear that Bevan is out performing him so far.

[stellation]

purely emotional responses but...

Good.

Hall- fantastic.
Davis- was good when he had a run on the footy. Going to be a couple of games yet before he gets match fitness.
ROK- was great in the first half.
Bevan- was absolutley fantastic.

Bad.

Clearances- we are struggling.
Maxfield- obviously was not match fit and should not have played. He ended up with a few disposals but that number was bolstered by taking kickouts.
C.Bolton on Hird was not working. It took too long to figure this out.

Ugly.

We have no regular midfield at the moment. Some players do well when thrown in the midfield for a quick run but then are pulled back out.
Umpiring- J.Hird's comments on TFS are obviously ringing in the ears of umpires. They are scared, not angry.

And...

Why did we play Rogers and James together?
Whilst he didn't have a blinder, I don't understand fingering Saddo as having had a shocker.

[dendol]

Originally posted by hammo
I agree. But why did he spend so much time off the field in the first and second quarters when the game had to be won??

Commentators were saying that it was just our high rate of midfield rotation..

[Go Swannies]

Jeez, don't start singling Saddo out. If you put the players into Good, Bad and OKay then Saddo was towards the top of the list for Okay.

Stewie's and Adam's kicking accuracy continues to be shocking. I never realised how dependent we are on Adam getting the ball and the players miraculously parting in front of him - we haven't seen that for the past fortnight. On the other hand, Bazza can get up from a partial tackle and just bulldoze over the opposition - great to watch!

Anyone else as nervous as me when the Captain kicked for goal from 50 - and got it!

[NMWBloods]

Good:

- Hall - fantastic
- Bevan - really good, very useful find
- C Bolton - a reasonably okay job on Hird (had a lot of possessions but didn't dominate)
- L Barry - great effort on Lloyd
- Schneider in first and last quarters - lots of drive from the midfield
- O'Keefe (although some disappointing misses at goal) - good option in the forward line

Bad & Ugly:

- umpiring
- clearances
- midfield - some good cameos, but generally went missing
- poor execution, messing about with ball & fumbling
- what to do with Saddo - still not playing well and not doing a great deal - beaten by Lucas
- Goodes' form this year - really seemed very lazy today
- J Bolton's form this year, mainly the last two games - not getting a lot of the ball
- Schneider's miss from 40m out, directly in front, on his own after running through the square - this was a major turning point. Essendon were struggling at this stage, but then went on to kick the next 7 goals.
- our constant ability to go missing for critical parts of a game

Other:

- Rogers looks solid and reasonably mobile. Will be interesting to see if he can develop.
- James had little involvement in the game
- Maxfield still doesn't seem fully fit, but did a great job inthe last quarter to get us going

[SWANSBEST]

NMWBloods

A good summary of our players , although I think that you are too hard on Saddo. IMO he went OK and took some nice relieving marks and linked well with other players. . A reasonable performance by Saddo. I am not the only one who thinks so. Please see below.



Essendon: 5.6, 7.8, 12.10, 16.12 (108)
Sydney: 4.3, 4.6, 8.7, 15.8 (98)

GOALS: Essendon: Solomon, Lloyd 3, Peverill 2, Hird, J.Johnson, Lucas, Murphy, Stanton, Dyson, Lovett-Murray, Rioli 1
Sydney: Hall 4, Williams, O?Keefe, Schneider 2, Davis, C.Bolton, Maxfield, J.Bolton, Kirk 1
BEST: Essendon: Solomon, Hird, J.Johnson, Bolton, Hille, Murphy, McPhee
Sydney: Hall, Kirk, J.Bolton, O'Keefe, Fosdike, Saddington, Williams
INJURIES: Essendon: None
Sydney: Schneider (hamstring)
CHANGES: Essendon: Bullen (calf) replaced by Misiti
Sydney: Ablett (ill) replaced by McVeigh
REPORTS: None
UMPIRES: Meredith, Ellis, Goldspink
CROWD: 38,946 at the MCG

[Plugger46]

I'm with you NMWBloods, I thought Saddo was very average once again. There was one occasion, where I can't believe he didn't get a fist to the ball and it went through for a goal.

[barry]

I would say that Goodes has a dicky groin. The way he is kicking and his form point to something wrong in that department.

[NMWBloods]

Originally posted by SWANSBEST
NMWBloods

A good summary of our players , although I think that you are too hard on Saddo. IMO he went OK and took some nice relieving marks and linked well with other players. . A reasonable performance by Saddo. I am not the only one who thinks so. Please see below.

I saw that - I really couldn't fathom it.

I don't think Saddo was terrible and certainly not among our worst. However, what concerns me is that he is having little influence on the game wherever he plays. I watched him closely a few times today and he still has reasonable skills, but doesn't really seem to do much and he looked all at sea against Lucas most of the time. He did take a couple of good marks in defence, but didn't do much overall.


Originally posted by barry
I would say that Goodes has a dicky groin. The way he is kicking and his form point to something wrong in that department.

I think that is a possibility. His kicking was poor again and he really seemed to struggle to run or change direction.

Despite disparaging comment, it looks like my view that our injuries would be higher this year unfortunately seems to be happening.

[Nico]

Originally posted by dendol
Agree with Goodes' performances of late. Lets hope its just a phase and related to our inability to win any ball.

Dont agree with your opinion on Saddo's game. He played on the wing a fair bit today and looked alot more comfortable. Definately would prefer to see him there, where he can float forward to take a mark, or go back to help the defense like he did to cut off leading forwards today.

McVeigh was quiet again. Didnt get much game time though, but its clear that Bevan is out performing him so far.

Gee I must watch the replay, because I was at the game today and if Saddo went past the centre square line much I would be very surprised.

[Nico]

Originally posted by Go Swannies
Jeez, don't start singling Saddo out. If you put the players into Good, Bad and OKay then Saddo was towards the top of the list for Okay.

Stewie's and Adam's kicking accuracy continues to be shocking. I never realised how dependent we are on Adam getting the ball and the players miraculously parting in front of him - we haven't seen that for the past fortnight. On the other hand, Bazza can get up from a partial tackle and just bulldoze over the opposition - great to watch!

Anyone else as nervous as me when the Captain kicked for goal from 50 - and got it!

I assume you mean Maxfield. What about his disgraceful shot from 20 metres or less in the 3rdQ. Had some momentum then and he stuffed it good and proper.

[Nico]

Originally posted by SWANSBEST
NMWBloods

A good summary of our players , although I think that you are too hard on Saddo. IMO he went OK and took some nice relieving marks and linked well with other players. . A reasonable performance by Saddo. I am not the only one who thinks so. Please see below.



Essendon: 5.6, 7.8, 12.10, 16.12 (108)
Sydney: 4.3, 4.6, 8.7, 15.8 (98)

GOALS: Essendon: Solomon, Lloyd 3, Peverill 2, Hird, J.Johnson, Lucas, Murphy, Stanton, Dyson, Lovett-Murray, Rioli 1
Sydney: Hall 4, Williams, O?Keefe, Schneider 2, Davis, C.Bolton, Maxfield, J.Bolton, Kirk 1
BEST: Essendon: Solomon, Hird, J.Johnson, Bolton, Hille, Murphy, McPhee
Sydney: Hall, Kirk, J.Bolton, O'Keefe, Fosdike, Saddington, Williams
INJURIES: Essendon: None
Sydney: Schneider (hamstring)
CHANGES: Essendon: Bullen (calf) replaced by Misiti
Sydney: Ablett (ill) replaced by McVeigh
REPORTS: None
UMPIRES: Meredith, Ellis, Goldspink
CROWD: 38,946 at the MCG

Whoever put this together watched the game through the bottom of a glass in the pub round the corner as they surely were not at the game.

How in holy hell could they put Bolton and Fosdike in the best. Laughable.

I am staggered at my own astonishment.

[Nico]

Originally posted by barry
I would say that Goodes has a dicky groin. The way he is kicking and his form point to something wrong in that department.

Maybe that's why Roos is playing him more up front. We badly miss his run around the ground and midfield work. I believe he is the missing link in the midfield and why we are getting little drive from there.

[Nico]

The Good

Bevan - a real find. He hard at it. Put him in the midfield.
Leo Barry - great game on LLoyd. LLoyds stats were bloated by a couple of doubtful frees but Leo beat him on most one on ones.
Hall - now in top 10 in comp. As good as I have seen him play.
O'Keefe is becoming a genuine forward and maturing and more damaging with every game.

The bad

Kennelly - left his form in Ireland. Looks stiff and injured to me. Getting caught all the time and fumbling something shocking.
Bolton and Fosdike - enough is enough. I hate watching them they make so many errors.
Matthews - a real worry against good opposition. Works and kicks within too small a zone and creates no run through the midfield. Back to his mistake ridden days. Has plataued.
Why was Heath James on the ground for less than 10 minutes the whole game. At least he makes a contest.

The Worry

Goodes playing up forward just takes too much away fro our run and midfield go to options, that are about nil at the moment.

[chammond]

Originally posted by Nico

How in holy hell could they put Bolton and Fosdike in the best. Laughable.

I am staggered at my own astonishment.

The ABC commentators also mentioned Jude Bolton as among Sydney's best . . .

[ScottH]

Goodes would struggle to hit the side of a barn at the moment. Something is not right there.

And Hille was just fantastic, and we had no answer to him.

Mathews kicked to no one and out of bounds. There were a number of shockers in the 2nd Quarter. I was sitting right behind the goals and they looked ordinary. I guess that was why we kicked 0.3.

[ugg]

Just a few comments in reply

- Sure Saddo got a bit of the ball, but his main job was to stop Lucas and Lucas took some telling marks in their forward 50.
- Don't agree on Mathews, his role is to play as the sweeper, and I think he has done well earlier this season. But he is just a tad slow at times in disposing of the ball (mainly to hit the target) and he was just crunched today because of it.
- Leo did great, but we need him rebounding from halfback not playing from the goal square. The sooner Schauble returns the better our team will look.
- that best on ground list is laughable. No Bevan!

[BAM_BAM]

Good

Hall - and his bulldozing runs, my heart's in my throat each time, but he just gets away with it.
O'Keefe - his work rate didn't change much, but he was sought as an option in the first half and final quarter. Just disappointing goal kicking. Accurate shots at goal could have seen him with 5. (how big a factor is the construction work as Hall also missed some I thought he should have got?)
Bevan - This kid can play and he's got guts throwing himself into contests and backing into marks.
Barry - without the umps assistance, Lloyd would not have had much impact.
C Bolton - it's extremely difficult to nullify Hird and I wasn't expecting him to be taken out of the game, but Craig certainly got in his face. Particularly when Hird played forward.

Bad

The umpiring was shocking. There is no other word to describe it. I don't usually comment that much on the umps as usually what goes around comes around, but yesterday! But I've already wasted enough precious time on them.

Playing out to the wings most of the game. We just got lost out there. We needed to be more direct. As much as I can't stand the ten commentators, they had it right.

I was also miffed as to why Heath spent so much time on the bench.

Ugly

Pevrill. His side profile!!!!!

[Foreign Legion]

Originally posted by barry
I would say that Goodes has a dicky groin. The way he is kicking and his form point to something wrong in that department.

I reckon you're right Barry. A couple of times he was just at 3/4 pace when chasing players - one incident in the 3rd qtr I think had Goodesy jogging after a player who kicked a goal. He may have a bad corky or something like that. I asked a few "who should know" at the aftermatch and they were tight lipped about it.

It is very worrying. I also asked why we have some many BLOODY HAMMY injuries - blank looks were given!

[liz]

Originally posted by barry
I would say that Goodes has a dicky groin. The way he is kicking and his form point to something wrong in that department.

I've just forced myself to sit through the first 3 quarters of the game and have to agree that something isn't quite right with Goodes at the moment.

Just as one illustration, at the 10min 40s point of the second quarter (in case anyone else wants to check it out) he was heading for a contest and rarely got out of second gear. That meant he got to the ball much later than he should and wasn't able to control the ball. It is just one illustration of how slowly he is moving at the moment.

Has anyone seen him leap up for a mark recently. He was jumping at centre bounces but pretty half-heartedly compared to his normal style.

If he has a problem surely they need to rest him. Not just because he's becoming a liability out on the ground but because he should have another 8-10 years of top football ahead of him and playing him injured helps neither him nor the team.

[chammond]

Originally posted by lizz
I've just forced myself to sit through the first 3 quarters of the game and have to agree that something isn't quite right with Goodes at the moment.



I was so pissed off with yesterday's effort that I didn't even consider that Goodes was carrying an injury . . . but it does make sense.

All through the first half, I was consoling myself that Roos was keeping Goodes out of the game to save him for the second half . . . what other reason could there be for him constantly being 100 metres from the ball and hardly running at all?

I'm so used to seeing him find space at the MCG that it never occurred to me that he was injured . . . I just assumed he was doing it deliberately . . . how stupid is that.

Mind you, in my own defence, have a look who's on the ball when we made that final quarter surge . . .

Something certainly doesn't add up. But one thing's for sure . . . that's not the Adam Goodes I was watching last year!

[CureTheSane]

dicky groin

:D

[Bear]

Good

These guys can be really proud of their day - Hall, Schneider, Barry, O'Keefe

Bad

The Game Plan
The fact that Roos thinks we are playing well :confused:
Saddington was again badly beaten in most important marking contests
Schneider's hammy
Maxfield's diminishing impact as a midfielder and player, for what ever reason
Kennelly slipping over the first four or five times he went near the ball

Other

Mathews - over-rated by some, but not as bad as others suggest. Just an average footballer with some good strengths and BAD weaknesses. I would choose a fully fit Fixter any day. Much harder at the contest and more reliable IMO.

Bevan - has a real go and gets the ball but needs to improve his disposal skills and decision making. Also struggles at this stage in markeing contests. Naturally is still building the belief that he is a senior AFL player so has much room for improvement which is promising.

James - why didn't he take Lloyd?? We robbed Peter to pay Paul and therefore lost the drive of Barry.

C Bolton - Gave 100% all day and did fairly well.

Umpires- forget the umpires, we didn't deserve to win because we played stupid football for 3 quarters

[liz]

Originally posted by Bear

Bevan - has a real go and gets the ball but needs to improve his disposal skills and decision making. Also struggles at this stage in markeing contests. Naturally is still building the belief that he is a senior AFL player so has much room for improvement which is promising.



Gee you're a harsh critic on a weekend when there is so much to choose from. Bevan's kicking looks awkward but I can only recall one bad kick yesterday. I know his kicking has let him down in earlier games but it looked like he was really concentrating hard yesterday and almost all his disposals hit their target.

He also took a handful of very good, pressured marks where he had to stand his ground and keep his eye on the ball. I recall Lovett-M taking a couple of very clever marks on him early and Lucas taking one over the top late in the game but those things happen to even experienced players.

[Bear]

Originally posted by lizz
Gee you're a harsh critic on a weekend when there is so much to choose from.

So on that logic no-one should single ANYTHING out to comment on??

:confused: :rolleyes:

[liz]

Originally posted by Bear
So on that logic no-one should single ANYTHING out to comment on??

:confused: :rolleyes:

That was not what I was trying to imply, merely that IMHO, based on yesterday's game your criticisms of Bevan (re his disposal and marking ability) were harsh for a player who was arguably our BOG, certainly in the top 4.

[Rob-bloods]

How Bevan can be mentioned in a negative sense in this game mystifies me, Adam Goodes is back to running round like a headless chook, half the team slips over at crucial times, we are playing several unfit players, we are taking a long time to adjust to losing setups, it just goes on.

A few of my positives from this game....

Bevan's all round performance.

O'Keefe's performance.

Hall, the best forward in the league at present.

[jixygirl]

Bevan was definitely one of the positives from a whole load of negatives from the game. He has a bright future ahead of him. Hall was fantastic, especially when he shrugged off the Essendon players with ease. There is something terribly wrong with Goodes. You would have to think some form of injury because he just can't have lost confidence to the point that he can't play asnywhere near like he did last year.

[Bear]

Originally posted by lizz
That was not what I was trying to imply, merely that IMHO, based on yesterday's game your criticisms of Bevan (re his disposal and marking ability) were harsh for a player who was arguably our BOG, certainly in the top 4.

Well you've made your point then so move on.

It IS ok to make constructive critisism of even the best player (IMO Hall) you know!

Just because he was one of our better players does not mean he cannot improve. As a player with only a few games under his belt he will be the first to admit he has areas to improve on.

[JF_Bay22_SCG]

Originally posted by Go Swannies
On the other hand, Bazza can get up from a partial tackle and just bulldoze over the opposition - great to watch!

But watching him chuck an attack of the sooks that last for a fair few minutes just because Ryan O'Keefe snuck in front of him to take a mark on the half-forward line is definitely NOT great to watch.

I have seen this sort of stuff from Hall way too often over recent years. It really drives me nuts, as I think the team should come before any personal glory. No wonder the umpires give so many frees against him- he is often whinging at them when things haven't gone his way rather than chasing and trying to get the ball back.

And before you slag me off again about daring to be critical of Barry Hall, there is one advantage of sitting in the Cheer Squad behind the goals- I get to see the forwards at close range every week. So I see things like this. And they stay in my memory.

The annoying thing is that Pebbles missed the kick. And I'm pretty sure Baz would have nabbed it from there.

JF

[stellation]

Originally posted by JF_Bay22_SCG

It really drives me nuts, as I think the team should come before any personal glory.

Barry seems to have improved because he is willing to put the team before personal glory. I don't understand this. You are completely mad JF!

Oh I know I took that out of context, I am just bored :):)

He does throw a bit of a tanty doesn't he! I find it kind of cute when he frowns and kicks the dirt if a Swan marks in front of him/spoils him.

[BAM_BAM]

I told Hall him to shut up and get over it from the safety of my lounge when he did this. And then sunk a little into the cushions when Pebbles missed.