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Thread: Mark Stone defects to the dockers...

  1. #25
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    Hmmm... can you really say that the bloke who was stoppage coach at West Coast through the mid 00s doesn't have an attacking mindset?

  2. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Big Cat View Post
    Let's not let the facts get in the way of a good sledge. Swans were the number 1 stoppage team in the league in terms of clearances.
    And lets not let the word "stoppages" confuse the issue. I have no problem with our work around the ground. It is our work at centre bounces where we lag badly and every opposition club knows that and plays to that weakness. We block and stand off opponents whereas they make a beeline for the footy. The number of scores opposing sides get against us from direct clearances drives me mad. We win back half of the centre clearances and our forwards get a lot more first use opportunities. As it is now we let the opposition get it into their forward line too easily and have to work bloody hard to get it out of there. Have a look at the semi final. The first half Hawthorn won the centre clearances hands down. We got it back in the third quarter, but the last quarter they flogged us. There are times when we get our hands on the footy at centre bounces but are unable to break free. Somethings have to change in how we set up, who have in there and how desperate we are to get first use.

    I hear coaches and special comments people on radio say so often how clean centre clearances are so valuable, and more so with presses etc these days, yet we continue to fail in this area.

  3. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by ugg View Post
    I'll post the stats later tonight but IIRC #1 in total stoppages (by a country mile) and about 9th or 10th in percentage won.
    Ugg, I don't know that I have ever seen stats where centre clearances are separated. All I know is that I watch the footy every week whether live or on TV, and our clean centre clearances are disproportionally low. Goodes is the exception but like most Swans supporters we are gobsmacked as to why he is not in the guts for centre clearances a lot more often.

  4. #28
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    Pro-stats have this stat but since they are a paying service I'm not going to post the exact numbers here, but we are in the bottom 3. Still you have to scale this to the number of centre bounces. We don't score that many goals in relation to the Top 8 sides and our defence is pretty miserly too so I would wager that the Swans average less centre bounces than the league average.

    In fact I might do that now.

  5. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vonsteinman View Post
    Hmmm... can you really say that the bloke who was stoppage coach at West Coast through the mid 00s doesn't have an attacking mindset?
    Stoppage tactics for West Coast in the mid 00s was rock, paper, scissors as to whether they tap it to Judd, Kerr or Cousens.

  6. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by ugg View Post
    Pro-stats have this stat but since they are a paying service I'm not going to post the exact numbers here, but we are in the bottom 3. Still you have to scale this to the number of centre bounces. We don't score that many goals in relation to the Top 8 sides and our defence is pretty miserly too so I would wager that the Swans average less centre bounces than the league average.

    In fact I might do that now.
    It turns out that Pro-stats do have 'Opposition Center Bounce Clearances' as a stat so I did a simple ratio of 'Center Bounce Clearances' : 'Opposition Center Bounce Clearances' as a metric and the Swans are ranked 7th. Surprisingly Fremantle are 16th despite having Sandilands.

  7. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Big Cat View Post
    Let's not let the facts get in the way of a good sledge.
    Why indeed TBC?

    [/QUOTE]Swans were the number 1 stoppage team in the league in terms of clearances.[/QUOTE]

    The facts further down the thread suggest we were far from no 1
    Last edited by caj23; 28th September 2011 at 03:26 PM. Reason: formatting

  8. #32
    Formerly 'BBB' Triple B's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vonsteinman View Post
    Hmmm... can you really say that the bloke who was stoppage coach at West Coast through the mid 00s doesn't have an attacking mindset?
    Stone obviously played to the strengths, as would any coach worth their salt. The Weagles had an elite attacking midfield and the Swans had a dour hard at it inside dominated midfield.

    Trouble is, we have had an elite ruckman for the best part of 2 seasons now, consistently winning the hitouts and generally terrorising opposition ruckman, yet at no stage did we appear to try and be more attacking from centre bounces unless Goodes was lined up at the back of the circle.

    We are regarded as being very dangerous from stoppages near our attacking goal, as we were when Jason Ball was plying his trade, rightly so. And we setup with an attacking mindset because we rightly thought we had an advantage in that area, as well as common sense in that area of the ground, yet after kicking the goal and the ball goes back to the middle for a centre bounce, we go back into defensive mode.

    Anyway, let's hope our young outside guys evolve in the next few years. The outlook is bright.
    Driver of the Dan Hannebery bandwagon....all aboard. 4th April 09

  9. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Triple B View Post
    Anyway, let's hope our young outside guys evolve in the next few years. The outlook is bright.
    Thanks for clarifying BBB and I agree with you, especially regarding the last bit, which I think will give the confidence to be more attacking in the guts.

    I know many people whinge about the fact that the Swans have tried to 'ruin' football by focussing on stopping goals before creating them, but it's led to more wins than losses in recent years with lists that punch above their weight.

    Here's hoping the young mid group stays together and the Swans do dominate midfield battles in a more positive fashion in the future...

  10. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by ugg View Post
    It turns out that Pro-stats do have 'Opposition Center Bounce Clearances' as a stat so I did a simple ratio of 'Center Bounce Clearances' : 'Opposition Center Bounce Clearances' as a metric and the Swans are ranked 7th. Surprisingly Fremantle are 16th despite having Sandilands.
    So the Swans are in the top half for centre clearance work, and number 1 for overall clearance work. Doesn't sound too shabby to me.
    Officially on the Reid and Sumner bandwagon!

  11. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by ugg View Post
    It turns out that Pro-stats do have 'Opposition Center Bounce Clearances' as a stat so I did a simple ratio of 'Center Bounce Clearances' : 'Opposition Center Bounce Clearances' as a metric and the Swans are ranked 7th. Surprisingly Fremantle are 16th despite having Sandilands.
    A belated thankyou for getting this information ugg. I'm not over impressed with 7th though. "Middle of the road" would seem a more accurate description of our efforts than "the number 1 stoppage team in the league in terms of clearances!"

    As we have a great ruckman and yet mediocre clearances, I think we can conclude that either the midfield isn't up to it or Mark Stone wasn't. Frankly his departure doesn't fill me with trepidation.
    Loose translation from the Latin is - I am tall, so I hit out.

  12. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ruck'n'Roll View Post
    A belated thankyou for getting this information ugg. I'm not over impressed with 7th though. "Middle of the road" would seem a more accurate description of our efforts than "the number 1 stoppage team in the league in terms of clearances!"

    As we have a great ruckman and yet mediocre clearances, I think we can conclude that either the midfield isn't up to it or Mark Stone wasn't. Frankly his departure doesn't fill me with trepidation.
    I agree Ruck'n, imagine if Mummy was the ruckman for either of the midfields on the weekend....

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