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Thread: Best XX11 for 2012

  1. #85
    Veterans List aardvark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wolftone57 View Post
    I will repeat myself in the risk of sounding boring. Rhyce will not play back.
    That's a fairly adventurous statement on your part wolfie. You giving odds on that by any chance ?????

  2. #86
    Veterans List wolftone57's Avatar
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    If he plays back it would be a mistake unless he plays on a mover. In other words a player with the lisence to rove like Stevie J at the Cats is now. Stevie J is more dangerous as a mobile forward so they let him go where he wants. Rhyce can play on this type because he has super endurance. But he can also alternate with another player like Nick Smith.

  3. #87
    Perhaps Rhyce is a more special HBF than some give him credit for here. He was an essential element to last year's game plan - a role that Kennelly proved previously- he'll be needed to rove defense in 2012 unless a player steps the role in 2012. There's possibilities but to this point their consistency is unproven.

  4. #88
    Quote Originally Posted by Bleed Red Blood View Post
    I disagree that you can have all four in the side. Too big, and also, too many defenders. How many times last year on here we're we saying, Longmire come on we can't kick any goals if half the side are defenders. Mattner provides cover for Richards. I don't think LRT should be used in the ruck again when we have Seaby and Pyke and White. If Grundy was having a shocker, I'd rather we move Reid back and have a smaller forward line, than have Johnson in the team just in case someones playing poorly. We need to back in the guys, and pick a balanced side.
    Wait, Mattner provides cover for Richards? Really? You'd like to see Mattner playing as a key defender? He's done it a couple of times in a pinch, but only when we've had absolutely no other options.

    Mattner is a HBF. According to you, Johnson and Mattner are similar players. On that basis, AJ wouldn't be a key defender, so LRT, Richards and Grundy won't affect AJ's place in the side.

    Picking an unbalanced side is the product of picking too many players of one type who aren't versatile. That's not a problem with AJ or Mattner. Both are versatile. AJ can play key defence or as a HBF/small defender (never mind the fact that he played forward in u18s). Mattner can play as a HBF/small defender or as a wingman/HFF. Both can slot into the side easily, especially when you consider that Malceski can play on the wing, and Shaw can play anywhere, depending on the job required of him (HBF/small defender, winger, tagger, defensive forward).

    The side could easily line up like this:

    B: Smith, Richards, LRT
    HB: Johnson, Grundy, Shaw
    C: Mattner, Kennedy, Malceski
    HF: McVeigh, Reid, O'Keefe
    F: Pyke, Walsh, Bolton
    R: Mumford, Goodes, Jack
    I/C: Hannebery, Armstrong, McGlynn, Rohan

    Smith and Johnson to take smalls.

    I'm a big fan of Bird, but can't fit him into our best 22 for balance reasons, as he's not versatile enough. Will get plenty of chances though, as injuries will inevitably hit. Jude could slow down as well, Armstrong might be a failure, Malceski may never recover (I doubt it, I'm expecting/hoping for great things), and so on.

    Point is, AJ is a versatile player, and even if he can't get a run as a key defender, he's good enough to get a go as a flanker, and that need not be at the expense of LRT, Richards, Grundy, Mattner or team balance.
    Officially on the Reid and Sumner bandwagon!

  5. #89
    Veterans List wolftone57's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BSA5 View Post
    Wait, Mattner provides cover for Richards? Really? You'd like to see Mattner playing as a key defender? He's done it a couple of times in a pinch, but only when we've had absolutely no other options.

    Mattner is a HBF. According to you, Johnson and Mattner are similar players. On that basis, AJ wouldn't be a key defender, so LRT, Richards and Grundy won't affect AJ's place in the side.

    Picking an unbalanced side is the product of picking too many players of one type who aren't versatile. That's not a problem with AJ or Mattner. Both are versatile. AJ can play key defence or as a HBF/small defender (never mind the fact that he played forward in u18s). Mattner can play as a HBF/small defender or as a wingman/HFF. Both can slot into the side easily, especially when you consider that Malceski can play on the wing, and Shaw can play anywhere, depending on the job required of him (HBF/small defender, winger, tagger, defensive forward).

    The side could easily line up like this:

    B: Smith, Richards, LRT
    HB: Johnson, Grundy, Shaw
    C: Mattner, Kennedy, Malceski
    HF: McVeigh, Reid, O'Keefe
    F: Pyke, Walsh, Bolton
    R: Mumford, Goodes, Jack
    I/C: Hannebery, Armstrong, McGlynn, Rohan

    Smith and Johnson to take smalls.

    I'm a big fan of Bird, but can't fit him into our best 22 for balance reasons, as he's not versatile enough. Will get plenty of chances though, as injuries will inevitably hit. Jude could slow down as well, Armstrong might be a failure, Malceski may never recover (I doubt it, I'm expecting/hoping for great things), and so on.

    Point is, AJ is a versatile player, and even if he can't get a run as a key defender, he's good enough to get a go as a flanker, and that need not be at the expense of LRT, Richards, Grundy, Mattner or team balance.
    I agree and I think you are right about Jude. He plays with no concern for his own safety and therefore gets knocked around quite a bit. As a player gets older this takes its toll. Geelong treated Milburn with kid gloves in the last few years. Pinch hitting off the bench and resting him for a couple of weeks to get his body right. As we get older the bumps hurt a lot more and it is more difficult to recover every week in time for a game. Like younger players , older players need to be managed to get the best out of them.

  6. #90
    Ego alta, ergo ictus Ruck'n'Roll's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BSA5 View Post
    The side could easily line up like this:

    B: Smith, Richards, LRT
    HB: Johnson, Grundy, Shaw
    C: Mattner, Kennedy, Malceski
    HF: McVeigh, Reid, O'Keefe
    F: Pyke, Walsh, Bolton
    R: Mumford, Goodes, Jack
    I/C: Hannebery, Armstrong, McGlynn, Rohan

    Smith and Johnson to take smalls.
    Backline
    AJ is a budding tall and while his first season was brilliant, totally above expectations. So he may drop back a bit, in any case he's still a kid and does need some more work, particularly on his kicking (while his accuracy isn't brilliant, it's the David Spriggs style floaters that worry me.
    While young keys often spend there formative years on a flank, it's usually more to avoid meeting key forward monsters rather than there suitability to match a small man. I don't think playing AJ on smalls is a very good starting option (a bit like playing Mattner on a tall really) at a pinch they can do that sort of role during a game. In any case unless predicated by our opponents I hope we don't see us playing 4 talls, it made us look slow and feeding LRT into the ruck did him or us no favours.

    Forward line
    It'll be interesting to see which 2 talls accompany Sam, I thought our best restults this year cam with Jessie and Spanky playing alongside Sam. Many people have very high expectations of Walsh, and the Footscray game suggested Pyke may be able to function up forward. Either way I just hope we retain that quota of 3 talls. Playing TDL at full forward was bonkers, and it certainly did him no favours.

    But as you say The side could easily line up like this
    Loose translation from the Latin is - I am tall, so I hit out.

  7. #91
    Proud Tragic Swan Primmy's Avatar
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    Well I started to laugh: Picture This. Horse attempting to keep Jude on the pine and nurse him into old age.....nah. All guns blazing at the OK Coral is my guess, and to the devil with the consequences.
    If you've never jumped from one couch to the other to save yourself from lava then you didn't have a childhood

  8. #92
    Quote Originally Posted by Primmy View Post
    Well I started to laugh: Picture This. Horse attempting to keep Jude on the pine and nurse him into old age.....nah. All guns blazing at the OK Coral is my guess, and to the devil with the consequences.
    Jude throwing his walking frame to one side "no coach I can still kick some whipper snapper butt"

  9. #93
    Veterans List aardvark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Primmy View Post
    All guns blazing at the OK Coral is my guess, and to the devil with the consequences.
    As it should be!! Pacing yourself is just another way of flirting with your form. It never works..... and I reckon Judes got a couple of good seasons left in him yet.

  10. #94
    Captain of the Side Captain's Avatar
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    Johnson ahead of LRT, you guys must be joking!! A few injuries and people write off a good player. This is the Ted situation all over again.

    I hope Johnson plays well this year, but am looking forward to these same posters calling for his head if he struggles (which I might add would be only natural for a 2nd year player, bit like Jetta).

  11. #95
    Veterans List wolftone57's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Primmy View Post
    Well I started to laugh: Picture This. Horse attempting to keep Jude on the pine and nurse him into old age.....nah. All guns blazing at the OK Coral is my guess, and to the devil with the consequences.
    Yes that could be a problem but sooner or later gonna have to be done to preserve his poor old frame. The way he hits the player and ball it is a wonder no great damage has been done already. I have learned not to cringe but I still get nervous. He is a very important element in our side and such a good example to the younger blokes.

  12. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by Captain View Post
    Johnson ahead of LRT, you guys must be joking!! A few injuries and people write off a good player. This is the Ted situation all over again.

    I hope Johnson plays well this year, but am looking forward to these same posters calling for his head if he struggles (which I might add would be only natural for a 2nd year player, bit like Jetta).
    Generally the position LRT would be vying for would be CHB or FB. When we meet teams who only take two tall forwards then he battles with Grundy & Richards for a place. Three or more in the forward line then he will be battling Reg, Teddy, AJ and young Lockyer (possibly) for a spot. AJ plays on the medium forward (around 6 foot) at the moment and Smithie or Marty etc get the smalls ei;Milne

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