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Thread: Perris Joins The Rookie List

  1. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Auntie.Gerald View Post
    can we carry Llyod and Perris in 2014 on our list ?
    Can we call him Nova?

  2. #14
    Veterans List wolftone57's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Meg View Post
    I don't know much about this topic but does the fact that Perris is a Swans scholarship holder make a difference? I've copied the words below from a post in a previous thread about Perris. What I infer from these words and the reports about Roos' interest is that someone has suggested to Perris that he decline a rookie listing (see second point below) because Melbourne would draft him. This I assume means that to be assured of holding Perris the Swans would need to apply to put him on the senior list under the first point below. I assume this could be the reason for some of the anger displayed towards Roos.

    "Inclusion onto an AFL List

    > If the scholarship listed player is of eligible draft age, a club may apply to transfer the player from the scholarship list to the main list on the day the main list is lodged (off-season) with the AFL prior to the National Draft (normal list numbers must be maintained).
    > If the scholarship listed player is of eligible draft age, a club may apply to transfer the player from the scholarship list to the rookie list on the day the main list is lodged (off-season) with the AFL prior to the National Draft and the player consents (i.e. if the player believes he will be taken in the National Draft by another club he may choose to forgo being rookie listed).
    > If the scholarship player is not chosen to be listed on either the main or rookie list, he may nominate for the National Draft at the expiration of his contract ? if the player nominates himself and is not selected his club may include him on their rookie list prior to the Rookie draft."
    Meg I hate to delude you but scholarship players do not exist any-more. They are now Academy players. The rules are slightly different.

  3. #15
    Go Swannies! Site Admin Meg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wolftone57 View Post
    Meg I hate to delude you but scholarship players do not exist any-more. They are now Academy players. The rules are slightly different.
    Wolfing I understand that the scholarship program doesn't exist anymore but Perris was a scholarship recipient. Are you saying that with the demise of the program the rules no longer apply to someone who came from that program?

  4. #16
    On the Rookie List BillyRayCypress's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jono2707 View Post
    Can we call him Nova?
    Considering he is making so many calls on his own future, maybe he should be called the " Bossa Nova"

    He already has his own song performed by Elvis.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0GD7o0tqUxw
    Last edited by BillyRayCypress; 26th September 2013 at 10:32 PM.
    Nothing like a good light bulb moment.

  5. #17
    Go Swannies! Site Admin Meg's Avatar
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    This article by our Tanya + interview gives some insights into Perris including (at least at that time) his hope that he would play for the Swans.

    Perris impresses at National Champs - M.afl.com.au

  6. #18
    Veterans List Ludwig's Avatar
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    I believe you are correct Meg; Perris I think is the last of the players that come under the scholarship rules.

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    There isn't really any ambiguity. Perris is not allowed to refuse a spot on the Swans' senior list if it is offered to him. Or at least, he can, but he can't then nominate for the draft with a view to being picked up by someone else. He can go and apply for a plumbing apprenticeship instead, though.

    He can also accept an offer from the Swans to go onto the rookie list and bypass the National Draft. However, he is not contractually obliged to.

    Whether Perris has any obligation to accept the Swans' rookie list offer is a personal thing for Perris himself - ie it is an ethical question, not a contractual one. The reality is that he has received scholarship money from them for the past three years and enjoyed the benefits of the coaching staff, primarily via the Academy but he's almost certainly trained with the senior squad at times. While I don't know this for sure, I would expect he also received medical / rehab assistance from the club when he did his knee, something that wouldn't have been available to most 16/17 year olds playing with St George.

    And while I also don't know this for sure, he probably grew up as an ardent Swans fan. He's not just a NSW lad, he's a Sydneysider. I think he attended Sydney Boys school opposite the SCG, and if I'm correct about this, would almost certainly have snuck across the road at times to watch the Swans train on Bus Loop Oval. He's been an integral part of the reserves side this year when not on U18 duties and will already be friends with many of the squad. So how strong is his desire to play with the club he almost certainly barracks for?

    On the other hand, however strongly he might support the Swans, his first priority will almost certainly be to do what he can to have a successful AFL career. He is clearly talented and driven and must believe he stands a pretty good chance of a decent career. The fact that the Swans may only be willing to offer him a rookie spot probably reflects the current make up of the squad, and it would be understandable if he feels his opportunities might be limited at the Swans, especially in the next couple of seasons. He's played alongside Lloyd for the whole season, and watched him (Lloyd) put in one of the most consistently good seasons I've ever seen from a rookie listed player, and yet get bypassed by others with more standout physical attributes. Others have commented that Perris and Lloyd are quite similar players and I agree with that. You couldn't blame Perris for thinking he might get better opportunities at a club without such an even squad of young midfield talent.

    Someone asked earlier in this thread whether the club can carry both on its list. Of course they can, but the Swans staff need to take a holistic view of the list. They obviously have views on the developing players that will differ from those supporters have, and will have a pretty good idea of what type of player they need to target in the draft and who might be available.

    Something else to bear in mind when comparing Lloyd and Perris is the age difference. Lloyd is clearly more accomplished now, but he is also two years older than Perris. So you have to project forward how much more scope for improvement Perris might have compared to Lloyd. Their physical stature is relevant here. Both are currently quite slight. They might both remain slight, which would be an obstacle to succeeding at senior AFL level. (It's probably the thing most clearly holding JL back at the moment.) But given the age difference, Perris has more time on his side.

    I am sure the club won't take their final decision lightly. They know far more about Perris than any of us, and their views on the kind of player he might develop into are far more expert than ours. What I do know is that if Perris lands up at a different club and goes onto become a very handy senior AFL player, it will be as painful to watch him run around for another club as it is seeing Bruest carving it up at Hawthorn.

  8. #20
    On the Rookie List BillyRayCypress's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by liz View Post
    There isn't really any ambiguity. Perris is not allowed to refuse a spot on the Swans' senior list if it is offered to him. Or at least, he can, but he can't then nominate for the draft with a view to being picked up by someone else. He can go and apply for a plumbing apprenticeship instead, though.
    First it was Roos, and now are you saying Paul Kelly will grab him?

    Wait till Caroline Wilson reads this.

    What I do know is that if Perris lands up at a different club and goes onto become a very handy senior AFL player, it will be as painful to watch him run around for another club as it is seeing Bruest carving it up at Hawthorn.
    Don't forget Simpkin who took a longer route than Kirky to get to a Grand Final.
    Last edited by BillyRayCypress; 26th September 2013 at 11:05 PM.
    Nothing like a good light bulb moment.

  9. #21
    Veterans List Ludwig's Avatar
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    Thanks Liz for that comprehensive write-up on Perris.

    Given that Perris is a free pick, so to speak, wouldn't it make sense to try to trade someone like Lamb, who might fetch something like a pick 30, in order to make space for Perris on the senior list. Effectively it would be like trading Lamb for Perris and a second round pick, which seems like a good deal.

    It's a bit uncanny the similarities, especially physically, between the 2 Lloyds. But the lack of bulk doesn't seem to stop JL from being a ferocious tackler. I hope we find room to keep both of them.

  10. #22
    Go Swannies! Site Admin Meg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by liz View Post

    Whether Perris has any obligation to accept the Swans' rookie list offer is a personal thing for Perris himself - ie it is an ethical question, not a contractual one. The reality is that he has received scholarship money from them for the past three years and enjoyed the benefits of the coaching staff, primarily via the Academy but he's almost certainly trained with the senior squad at times. While I don't know this for sure, I would expect he also received medical / rehab assistance from the club when he did his knee, something that wouldn't have been available to most 16/17 year olds playing with St George.
    Thanks Liz, your whole post is really informative. While pure speculation on my part, I suspect that you have hit the mark with the para above. If the Swans were planning to rookie list Perris, and Roos/Demons have convinced Perris he can do better, then the basis for the Swans' anger becomes clearer for all of the above reasons.

  11. #23
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    At the most basic level, there is no need to free up a senior list spot for Perris. The club has to free up senior spots anyway so that it can add a minimum of three new players to the senior list. Perris can be one of those three players. The club may want to free up more than three spaces, especially if it wants / needs to elevate more than one current rookie listed player. (Rampe must be a certainty.) However, only one elevated rookie can count towards the minimum three new draftees, so either way, two new players need to be added.

    However, given how tight spots are on the list, they may feel the list can be better balanced by using its quota on different kinds of player, especially if they think it is unlikely Perris will seriously push for senior selection in his first season.

    Another slight complication is that the rookie list will also be pretty tight for spots and there is a case for retaining most, if not all, of the current crop. We get an extra three spots on the list for NSW players (whether from the Academy / scholarship or elsewhere). I am not entirely sure, but I think that second year retained rookies might be able to count towards that quota of three. We have four NSW lads on the current rookie list and I am not entirely sure which were the three designated NSW rookies last year. If I have to guess (plundering the depths of my memory) I think it was BJ, Robinson and Naismith, with Rampe classified as a normal rookie. Suppose they intend to promote BJ to the senior list and offer Naismith and Robinson a second year on the rookie list. That means there is one spare NSW spot. Perris can fill this spot. But if they are forced to put him on the senior list instead that NSW spot only gets used if there is another local player they want to offer the spot too. While there are a few reasonable candidates from the toppies we have seen this year in the reserves, maybe the club has decided none of them is quite worthy. Perris taking up a senior spot might cost one of the non-NSW rookies - Lloyd, X, Biggs - a spot on at least one of the lists for next season. There used to be a limit (3) on how many second year rookies you could retain but I am not sure if that still applies, so often have they fiddled with the rookie list rules.

  12. #24
    he might like to play for freeo and be the only midfielder under 90kg and 6 feet 3 inches
    "be tough, only when it gets tough"


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