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Thread: 2018 trading, drafting and list management: players and personnel

  1. #1501
    Go Swannies! Site Admin Meg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by robamiee View Post
    Doesnt McGoven (adelaides) play forward
    McGovern to replace Tippett?

    Hehe, that would make Crows’ fans go berserk!

  2. #1502
    Quote Originally Posted by liz View Post
    He does. And so did Moore until this season.

    If there is any truth in the suggestion we are trying hard for both, my guess is that it would be with the expectation of getting just one.
    What about the Tom Jonás rumour. Two of our better talls (Melican and Reid) are pretty fragile. And not sure Aliir can play a lockdown role like Meli-can. Maybe hoping to find s player to be able to play both ends.

    I really, really hope our #1 priority in the offseason is the midfield.

  3. #1503
    Veterans List Ludwig's Avatar
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    State of Play - Part 2

    First a few notes on assumptions and categories:
    1. We will have to wait a few weeks to see how the trade period works out, but for now I will assume that Hannebery and Rohan will be traded and Lloyd will sign on with the Swans, so I've omitted the former 2 from calculations for next year.
    2. I am not counting on Naismith playing next year. There's too much uncertainty about his ability to keep off the injury list. If he makes it, its a bonus.
    3. Not including AJ in calculations.
    4. The Mature Four: McVeigh, Grundy, Jack and Smith. They are likely entering their final year of football, with perhaps Smith continuing on, depending on how things go for him. I am not including these 4 in first team calculations, but rather players that provide experienced depth to help our younger players make the transition to senior footy.


    For better or worse, the club is well down the track of changing to a quicker and more attacking game style. Since the Franklin trade we have gone to the draft to bring in the next generation of players. The large under 24 group listed in Part 1 makes it manifestly clear that there is no walking back from these past 5 years on the draft. It's simply too big to change enough to make a difference. If this group isn't good enough, then we are looking for a long ride into the doldrums.

    The problems we've had with our midfield group this year are not as serious as they appear. There are several reasons why we didn't perform as well as in past years, particularly in the contested possession and inside 50s benchmarks.
    1. The loss of Naismith forced us to change our stoppage setup to losing (rather than winning) the hitouts. Our on-ball midfield is relatively slow and performs better, as most midfields do, when getting first touch from the stoppage. It's possible to transition to another style and be successful, as Richmond have. But it's not easy to do it on the run and unprepared. Sinclair played well enough to support an outside running team, but not a team that depends on winning the ball in congestion. I'm surprised we didn't give Cameron more of chance this year as he seems to be a better tap ruckman than Sinclair. Perhaps Cameron didn't perform well in training with Sinclair as his opponent. Our ruck setup this year was particularly unsuited for Kennedy, who is best as a first possession player, as he invariably retains possession and gets the ball moving forward. He's less effective in a defensive setup when the opposition win first possession. Once the opposition run past the contest, Kennedy is left behind the play. Our options in this regard to be discussed later.
    2. By my count, we lost the benefit of 5 midfielders this year due to injury, form (perhaps related to injury) and injuries in the defensive group which kept players in defence instead of the midfield: Hannebery, Jack, Dawson, Mills and Jones. We also lost the opportunity to see how Matthew Ling would go, in a year when a number of 1st round drafted players held their spots (Stephenson, Richards, Higgins, Cerra to name a few).
    3. Structure in defence and forward lines impact the midfield structure. We didn't bring O'Riordan in early enough in the season and then dropped him in the end. This kept Jones committed to the defensive group this year, when his speed from the stoppage was sorely needed, especially given our impotence in the ruck contests.


    Team Structure 2019-2020

    The defensive structure establishes how the team will play. The primary change is to go to a 3 tall defender setup of 2 key defenders plus an intercept defender (Aliir). This structure has become fairly typical in the AFL:
    • Richmond have Rance, Astbury and Grimes, with McIntosh also over 190cm.
    • The Giants often play 4 tall defenders: Davis, Haynes, Tomlinson and Corr (or Finlayson).

    We should go into next year with a target of playing Melican, Maibaum and Aliir, with Grundy as our depth key defender. Add Colin O'Riordan, Rampe and Lloyd to make up the core back 6. This releases Mills and Jones to play elsewhere.

    Aliir is now our most important player. The offense generated from this kind of structure is centred on the intercept marker, as it is with WC (McGovern), GWS (Haynes/Davis), Hawthorn (Sicily), Richmond (Rance). It's important to control the air in one's defensive zone. Most teams have 2 key forward targets that need direct match-ups, allowing the interceptor to zone off. COR and Rampe are good a defending the goal square and the extra height allows them to drop back and guard the space over the top.

    Maibaum got the BOG from the coaches in the NEAFL match on Saturday, and I can't disagree with that. It was his best game that I can recall, and somewhat like Melican did 2 years ago, decided to leave it for the end of the season to show he can play a key defensive role. If fit, Melican is a walk up starter, and if he continues to develop through the pre-season, we should give Maibaum a go.

    We can use a bit more depth in this area. Internally, we should try Amartey as a key defender in the reserves next year and try to make him into a tall utility. He looks well suited to be a key defender. Nick Blakey is a serious prospect to play in defence. We probably would prefer to play him forward, but he could end up as a tall utility as well. Further down the line, 2019 Academy prospect Josh Raynor looks a likely top 30 - 40 draftee.

    We could use another Rampe type player at the club. There's a good chance that Harry Marsh will not get another contract and he's the only one that fits the job description, although he lacks the defensive ability to play in that role as a first team player. At least a few of our itinerant depth players will be cut or traded and Harry would be one of those on my list. There were rumours that we were interested in Tom Jonas, who would be perfect for the job, but I doubt Port will let him go.

    Port Adelaide has let it be known that Jasper Pittard and Jack Hombsch are available for trade and can look for a new club. Pittard has been good at times, but can make some horrendous mistakes. Hombsch, on the other hand, is a solid key defender who could well provide the depth we need in the post-Grundy era.

    We know Mills can play defence if he's not locked into a key defender role, but he's really needed in the midfield.

    Several players, including Ling, Stoddart and Florent, could move into defence as small defenders and rebound players. It would be nice to get a Neville Jetta type who can defend above his height, and generate offence as well.

    We go into 2019 with a young defensive group, hence a lot of mystery as to just how it will all turn out. But these are the players we've got and we have to give it a go. We haven't looked all that bad with Grundy and Aliir together, so a quicker Melican and Maibaum in lieu of Reg just might do fine. The inexperience of the defensive group should cool expectations for the Swans in 2019. It could be a revelation, but might just as well be a work in progress.

    More to come

  4. #1504
    Captain of the Side Captain's Avatar
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    McGovern would be fantastic.

    Buddy, Reid and McGovern would make a good forward line.

  5. #1505
    Quote Originally Posted by Markwebbos View Post
    What about the Tom Jonás rumour. Two of our better talls (Melican and Reid) are pretty fragile. And not sure Aliir can play a lockdown role like Meli-can. Maybe hoping to find s player to be able to play both ends.

    I really, really hope our #1 priority in the offseason is the midfield.
    I agree, we definately need a midfield gun. The trouble is that none of the good ones are free agents or at the end of their contracts. We'll have to pay overs if we are going to get a contracted player. Shiel would be nice but it sounds like he wants to go home.

  6. #1506
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    Quote Originally Posted by S.S. Bleeder View Post
    I agree, we definately need a midfield gun. The trouble is that none of the good ones are free agents or at the end of their contracts. We'll have to pay overs if we are going to get a contracted player. Shiel would be nice but it sounds like he wants to go home.
    Gaff is a free agent

  7. #1507
    Veterans List Ludwig's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Captain View Post
    McGovern would be fantastic.

    Buddy, Reid and McGovern would make a good forward line.
    What happened to Buddy, Reid and McCartin?

    The rumoured pursuit of Moore and McGovern is somewhat enigmatic since it's not overtly apparent that we are deficient in this area. Does it mean that the we've lost confidence in Reid's ability to stay free of injury? Buddy will be 32 next year, but is still likely to be the best forward in the comp if he's fit. Are we thinking of playing Buddy as a midfielder to give us more power to deliver the ball accurately into the forward line? I like that idea, if it is in our plans for next year.

    After playing most of the season and getting much praise, what happens to McCartin next year? Don't we just continue his development.

    What are thinking of doing with Blakey? Is he not a forward option?

    If we recruit Moore or McGovern it will cost us a first year draft pick. Does that mean we aren't setting the midfield as our prime recruiting target position.

    It will be interesting to see how this plays out.

  8. #1508
    Pushing for Selection Muttley's Avatar
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    Hope we rookie Michael Gibbons.
    Classic group think case where all the recruiters think he is 'too small' but he is actually a gun like a Dane Zorko.

    Michael Gibbons - Williamstown Football Club

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Ludwig View Post
    What happened to Buddy, Reid and McCartin?

    The rumoured pursuit of Moore and McGovern is somewhat enigmatic since it's not overtly apparent that we are deficient in this area. Does it mean that the we've lost confidence in Reid's ability to stay free of injury? Buddy will be 32 next year, but is still likely to be the best forward in the comp if he's fit. Are we thinking of playing Buddy as a midfielder to give us more power to deliver the ball accurately into the forward line? I like that idea, if it is in our plans for next year.

    After playing most of the season and getting much praise, what happens to McCartin next year? Don't we just continue his development.

    What are thinking of doing with Blakey? Is he not a forward option?

    If we recruit Moore or McGovern it will cost us a first year draft pick. Does that mean we aren't setting the midfield as our prime recruiting target position.

    It will be interesting to see how this plays out.

    I am not even convinced Moore and/or McGovern are actually any good.

    The West Coast McGovern is a gun but the Adelaide one isnt as good.

  9. #1509
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    Quote Originally Posted by Muttley View Post
    I am not even convinced Moore and/or McGovern are actually any good.

    The West Coast McGovern is a gun but the Adelaide one isnt as good.
    Totally agree.

    If anyone at the Swans is reading this: DO NOT RECRUIT MOORE OR MCGOVERN......they are crocks that we don't even need.

  10. #1510
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    agree with this.

  11. #1511
    Moore wants to come to Sydney, so don't look a gift horse in the mouth.

    Richmond are getting lynch, so if you want a crack at a flag you have to go after players

  12. #1512
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    I don't know about McGovern, but I think Moore would be great for us. He seems as good person as well.

    However, I don't want to lose our first round pick in the draft (presuming we don't have to use it on Blakey). I read Geelong are after Jack Steven. If that trade occurs and involves at least Geelong's pick 12, perhaps we could somehow get it for Hanners (I imagine we'd have to give something else) and use it on Moore.

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