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Thread: Coaching and Plan B

  1. #13
    Senior Player Bloody Hell's Avatar
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    The "no plan B" cliche translates as not a great game day coach - or flexibility in the approach, which for me rings true with Longmire.

    He believes what they are doing will get the job done. Which mostly works in H&A, but finals is different.

    I have never rewatched the 2014 GF (or 1996, 2005 and 2016) but my memory of that match was Longmire was badly touched up by Clarkson.
    The eternal connundrum "what happens when an unstoppable force meets an immovable object" was finally solved when David Hasselhoff punched himself in the face.

  2. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Bloody Hell View Post
    I have never rewatched the 2014 GF (or 1996, 2005 and 2016) but my memory of that match was Longmire was badly touched up by Clarkson.
    I too have never rewatched the 2014 GF but my memory is that we got smashed from the get go. They were better, fiercer, stronger and any different game-plan in coaching would've had little impact.

  3. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by AB Swannie View Post
    I too have never rewatched the 2014 GF but my memory is that we got smashed from the get go. They were better, fiercer, stronger and any different game-plan in coaching would've had little impact.
    +1

  4. #16
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    Clarkson's 62% winning record is a bit surprising as I do consider that the only side in the last decade, maybe ever, that has truly had a 'plan B' (and even a 'plan C') AND had a player group which could virtually coach itself on field to adapt games plans as the game unfolded, was Clarkson's Hawthorn of 2013-15. The Swans need to develop this skill in their player group, on top of their undoubted talent....if we could achieve this, we would win heaps of flags.
    I think with the standard of list we have and the stage of development it's at, the timing is perfect for new coaches and ideas to come in. I truly hope they are working on the above....
    Last edited by stevoswan; 21st December 2017 at 07:16 PM.

  5. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bloody Hell View Post

    I have never rewatched the 2014 GF (or 1996, 2005 and 2016) but my memory of that match was Longmire was badly touched up by Clarkson.
    You haven't rewatched 2005?????
    I know you meant 2006. I actually saw the end of that game when it was replayed on Fox one day .

  6. #18
    Veterans List wolftone57's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by neilfws View Post
    Indeed. Just went for a look at the latest numbers. H&A games:

    1. Scott 73.86%
    2. Pyke 71.59%
    3. Longmire 70.13%

    then a fair bit of daylight to

    4. Simpson 63.07%
    5. Clarkson 62.28%
    Those figures are deceptive. Clarkson took over a very weak team and built the list. Both Longmire and Scott took over when the teams were pretty good and the lists were top quality. In fact Scott took over a ready made premiership team. Longmire's Swans had a few holes but not that many and they were plugged rather quickly by good drafting leading to a premiership in 2012. Let's face it he only took over in 2011. After all we made the semi finals in 2010. We were in exactly the same position in 2011.

    Scott took over from Bomber Thompson in 2011. He won the premiership in his first year with a side that had won the 2007, runner up 2008, 2009, prelim 2010. This was a pretty good side, no I'd say this was the most experienced finals side and one of the most talented ever assembled. He inherited a gold mine. since then Scott has coached the Cats to the Elimination in 2012, the Prelim in 2013, Semi 2014, 2015 no finals, Prelim 2016, Prelim 2017. He keeps trading experienced players, some seen as the best in the league, into his team to keep them up the top. He is trying to buy a premiership in the next two years. If he doesn't they could be in trouble. They have not drafted much youth in the last 5 years and their depth is pretty poor.

    Simpson again is a coach that took over a struggling side. Although his record is not as good as the others.

    Clarkson took over Hawthorn when they were right down. In fact they were second bottom. Between 2000 & 2004 they finished 8, 6, 10, 9, 15. When Clarkson took over the list needed a total clean out. Players like Ben Dickson who turned up but failed to play most weeks found themselves being shown the door. All the dreadful dross they had traded in from other sides like Essendon were let go. Hence in 2005 they finished 14th, in 2006 11th, 2007 5th playing off in the Semi Final and won the Premiership in 2008. They have improved under Clarkson every year he has had charge. He became the second coach in this millennium to coach three in a row and has won 4 Premierships. Neither Scott nor Longmire have done that. In fact both have won one Premiership, so sometimes figures lie. By the way with the team Scott was gifted, Longmire less so, he should have won more. Although you could argue so should Longmire.
    Last edited by wolftone57; 28th December 2017 at 05:02 PM.

  7. #19
    Veterans List wolftone57's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stevoswan View Post
    Clarkson's 62% winning record is a bit surprising as I do consider that the only side in the last decade, maybe ever, that has truly had a 'plan B' (and even a 'plan C') AND had a player group which could virtually coach itself on field to adapt games plans as the game unfolded, was Clarkson's Hawthorn of 2013-15. The Swans need to develop this skill in their player group, on top of their undoubted talent....if we could achieve this, we would win heaps of flags.
    I think with the standard of list we have and the stage of development it's at, the timing is perfect for new coaches and ideas to come in. I truly hope they are working on the above....
    It's all about where the Hawks were when he took over. In his case he had to rebuild the Hawks list and game from scratch, in 2004 they were 15th and he only managed 14th in 2005 due to a rebuild. Whereas both Scott and Longmire inherited finals sides from the year before.

  8. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by wolftone57 View Post
    It's all about where the Hawks were when he took over. In his case he had to rebuild the Hawks list and game from scratch, in 2004 they were 15th and he only managed 14th in 2005 due to a rebuild. Whereas both Scott and Longmire inherited finals sides from the year before.
    Agree Clarkson is a very good coach. I reckon he has had more talented players than Longmire over the years. S. Mitchell, Hodge, Buddy, Burgoyne, Roughead, Cyril etc provided more skill and brilliance. Longmire has done well to win one against them on their home ground as well as getting to two others.

  9. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mel_C View Post
    You haven't rewatched 2005?????
    I know you meant 2006. I actually saw the end of that game when it was replayed on Fox one day .
    The main thing I remember from the '06 GF, besides the huge letdown when the siren went to end it, was Goodesy receiving a lightning quick handball from BBBH in the first seconds of the last quarter and drilling it from 40m out and I was thinking, "we've got this!". I was expecting our boys to go berserk! The resulting arm wrestle was excruitiating! One @@@@@@ing point!

  10. #22
    Plan B !!

  11. #23
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    Re 2006

    How do you have a plan B to counter pumped up …juiced up bunch of drugies, who ran just as hard at the end of the 4th quarter as the start of the match.

    They looked like action heroes

    Cant counter that crap.

  12. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by BRISWAN View Post
    Re 2006

    How do you have a plan B to counter pumped up …juiced up bunch of drugies, who ran just as hard at the end of the 4th quarter as the start of the match.

    They looked like action heroes

    Cant counter that crap.
    Don't know that you can't beat it but it's very hard to. We should have played against Adelaide in that granny then it would have been a fair game as they were beaten by the DRUG CHEATS in the prelim.

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