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Thread: Best 22 for 2019

  1. #85
    Quote Originally Posted by liz View Post
    The players I'd lock into our best 22 at this stage are:
    Kennedy, Parker, Franklin, Rampe, Heeney, Mills, Jones, Lloyd, Hewett and Smith.
    I agree with this but I would add the following as certain starters if they are fit: Florent, Hayward and Reid. Reid's ability and versatility make him an automatic choice for mine when he is fit. Macca would also have to be a starter if fit, wouldn't he, else why did we retain him? I have no problem with Smith being on this list. I would be amazed if he missed out notwithstanding the hot competition for spots in the back 6. After that it definitely gets interesting.

    While I am not predicting it, I don't see why Reg, AA, Melican and Rampe can't play in the same team. Except for Reg they are all very mobile. AA can rebound. Rampe can play tall and small, as can Melican and Rampe. They wouldn't all be on the field all the time either. I think Melican is the most vulnerable and a fair bit will depend on his preseason. Grundy could lose his spot as the season wears on if Melican overtakes him.

    This is my best guess at the team we will field Round 1 as things currently stand:

    Smith Grundy Aliir
    Lloyd Rampe Macca

    Naismith Kennedy Hewett
    Jones Mills Heeney

    Hayward Buddy Parker
    Ronke Reid Papley

    Interchange: Clarke, Cunningham, Florent, Menzel

    Emergencies: Dawson, O'Riordan, Sinclair, Jack

  2. #86
    Quote Originally Posted by liz View Post
    In recent past years I've thought that there were 15 or 16 players locked into the best 22 at this time of year, with the remaining 6-7 places up for grabs. I'm even less certain this year who our best 22 is. I think there's a lot to train for over the pre-season for a big chunk of our squad.

    The players I'd lock into our best 22 at this stage are:
    Kennedy, Parker, Franklin, Rampe, Heeney, Mills, Jones, Lloyd, Hewett and Smith. Some might argue over Smith but we don't have anyone else in the squad who has shown any ability to play his role. And I know there are some who wouldn't have Jones (and maybe even Mills) as certain starters, but for me they are.

    The rest have competition, some with just a small group of players, others with a larger group.

    I think Cunningham is more likely to be in the starting team than not. He's quick, reasonably consistent and can play a variety of roles. On the other hand, he probably doesn't have the same scope for improvement as some of the younger players. If he's overtaken for a spot in the best 22, I see that as a sign the team has strengthened considerably.

    Similarly I see Papley as on the cusp of being a certain starter (when fit) but the return of some talls and the introduction of Menzel might result in a different looking forward line. In which case, the smaller forwards (Ronke, Papley, Haywood) might be fighting for fewer spots. Which of them can provide most flexibility? And make a mark when rotating through the midfield?


    I don't see Rampe, Aliir, Melican and Grundy all lining up in the same team. I have Rampe as a certainty but the others I think are competing for two spots. If Melican and Aliir can keep Grundy out of the side, that's a good sign. But I'm not writing the wily veteran off yet. The younger players need to do enough to push him out.

    I haven't seen enough of Clarke or Thurlow at their previous clubs to know where to place them. But I suspect Clarke most likely finds his way into the best 22 as the one most able to contribute in the role Hanners played. I have no expectations that Clarke will reach the heights of a younger Hannebery but hopefully he can contribute more than the 2018 Hannebery was able to.

    Dawson and O'Riordan are two who I would love to force their way into the best 22 by the time the season rolls around. They don't have enough runs on the board to be slotted in now, but I think both can bring something to the team that it lacked last year. I think we'll be a better team if they are regulars in the side next year. In the case of O'Riordan, that probably means he needs to force out McVeigh. That's a tough thing to expect of him.

    Florent is one player I think has the capacity to most improve the side but I expect a gradual improvement over the next two or three seasons, rather than a sudden elevation into a top flight player. I hope he's well and truly in the best 22 but he might be competing with Clarke, Cunningham, Jones and maybe some others.

    Similarly, I'm a huge fan of Ronke and see him as a midfielder in the long term, not a small forward (albeit a midfielder who can contribute on the scoreboard). In an ideal world, he would have played a dozen or so games last year, not the majority of the season. It was a big workload for a young player and he was clearly sore by the end of the year. I don't see it as a bad thing if he spends some time in the NEAFL next year, developing his on-ball craft. Alternatively, we could see him with some midfield tagging roles next year. He has the pace and the tenacity. Just as it did with Jack (who I see as his role model), tagging might help him understand where to run to win the ball and to learn the midfield craft off some of the best midfielders in the competition. And it might free up Hewett to focus more on winning the ball at stoppages (where he's already the second best in the team, I believe).

    I can't see Reid, Sinclair and Naismith all in the same team (unless Buddy is injured). But there are a few ways a couple of them could be used in the team. It will be nice if the coaches have some options next season. And Cameron could challenge them for a spot.
    Very thoughtful post, Liz. I might disagree about some particulars, but I reckon the basic thrust of it is spot on. There's no way I'd be tempted to nominate a best 22 at this stage - what they show at training and injuries will be revealing as to who the best 22 will be. But what I am most happy about with our recruitment this season - and it's something clearly borne out in your post, as well as comments others have made - is that there will be genuine competition for spots. I can't image any of us not loving the way Ronke embraced his opportunities this past year - but I also think it's great from the perspective of team success that next year, if he's off his game, he'll also be off the park. And for Ronke's name we could substitute a good many others.

  3. #87
    Veterans List Ludwig's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by liz View Post
    In recent past years I've thought that there were 15 or 16 players locked into the best 22 at this time of year, with the remaining 6-7 places up for grabs. I'm even less certain this year who our best 22 is. I think there's a lot to train for over the pre-season for a big chunk of our squad.

    The players I'd lock into our best 22 at this stage are:
    Kennedy, Parker, Franklin, Rampe, Heeney, Mills, Jones, Lloyd, Hewett and Smith. Some might argue over Smith but we don't have anyone else in the squad who has shown any ability to play his role. And I know there are some who wouldn't have Jones (and maybe even Mills) as certain starters, but for me they are.


    The rest have competition, some with just a small group of players, others with a larger group.

    I think Cunningham is more likely to be in the starting team than not. He's quick, reasonably consistent and can play a variety of roles. On the other hand, he probably doesn't have the same scope for improvement as some of the younger players. If he's overtaken for a spot in the best 22, I see that as a sign the team has strengthened considerably.

    Similarly I see Papley as on the cusp of being a certain starter (when fit) but the return of some talls and the introduction of Menzel might result in a different looking forward line. In which case, the smaller forwards (Ronke, Papley, Haywood) might be fighting for fewer spots. Which of them can provide most flexibility? And make a mark when rotating through the midfield?


    I don't see Rampe, Aliir, Melican and Grundy all lining up in the same team. I have Rampe as a certainty but the others I think are competing for two spots. If Melican and Aliir can keep Grundy out of the side, that's a good sign. But I'm not writing the wily veteran off yet. The younger players need to do enough to push him out.

    I haven't seen enough of Clarke or Thurlow at their previous clubs to know where to place them. But I suspect Clarke most likely finds his way into the best 22 as the one most able to contribute in the role Hanners played. I have no expectations that Clarke will reach the heights of a younger Hannebery but hopefully he can contribute more than the 2018 Hannebery was able to.

    Dawson and O'Riordan are two who I would love to force their way into the best 22 by the time the season rolls around. They don't have enough runs on the board to be slotted in now, but I think both can bring something to the team that it lacked last year. I think we'll be a better team if they are regulars in the side next year. In the case of O'Riordan, that probably means he needs to force out McVeigh. That's a tough thing to expect of him.

    Florent is one player I think has the capacity to most improve the side but I expect a gradual improvement over the next two or three seasons, rather than a sudden elevation into a top flight player. I hope he's well and truly in the best 22 but he might be competing with Clarke, Cunningham, Jones and maybe some others.

    Similarly, I'm a huge fan of Ronke and see him as a midfielder in the long term, not a small forward (albeit a midfielder who can contribute on the scoreboard). In an ideal world, he would have played a dozen or so games last year, not the majority of the season. It was a big workload for a young player and he was clearly sore by the end of the year. I don't see it as a bad thing if he spends some time in the NEAFL next year, developing his on-ball craft. Alternatively, we could see him with some midfield tagging roles next year. He has the pace and the tenacity. Just as it did with Jack (who I see as his role model), tagging might help him understand where to run to win the ball and to learn the midfield craft off some of the best midfielders in the competition. And it might free up Hewett to focus more on winning the ball at stoppages (where he's already the second best in the team, I believe).

    I can't see Reid, Sinclair and Naismith all in the same team (unless Buddy is injured). But there are a few ways a couple of them could be used in the team. It will be nice if the coaches have some options next season. And Cameron could challenge them for a spot.
    I agree with your analysis for the most part, including the numerous spots up for grabs.

    I think the focus should be on who we should target for making our senior side, in the sense that certain players will accelerate the transition of our game plan to more offense.

    Here are a few suggestions:

    • Reg, Macca and KJ shouldn't be first choice senior selections.
    • We don't have an obvious replacement for Smith, but maybe the role of a lock down small defender disappears; others can play the role with less emphasis on defence and more on offence.
    • Target backline should include Melican, Aliir, Rampe, Thurlow and COR. Good height, good mobility, good attacking mindset.
    • Cameron should be given a fair shot as our starting ruckman.
    • Dawson will hopefully become a regular in side. He's been our best performing NEAFL player in quite a few years. Other high performing NEAFL players, Lloyd and Hewitt, show the way forward.
    • It would be nice to see Ling and Stoddart getting senior games. These 2 can truly turn the Swans into a running team that can match the best for pace.


    I sense that the coaching staff realise that we need to transition our game plan. Recent draft selections of players like Hayward, Florent, Ronke, Ling and Stoddart are the best indication of what they're thinking and the direction we're heading.

  4. #88
    Quote Originally Posted by Ludwig View Post
    [Snipped]
    Here are a few suggestions:

    • Reg, Macca and KJ shouldn't be first choice senior selections.


    I sense that the coaching staff realise that we need to transition our game plan. Recent draft selections of players like Hayward, Florent, Ronke, Ling and Stoddart are the best indication of what they're thinking and the direction we're heading.
    Although I agree with other stuff you've said, Ludwig, I want to underscore your point about Reg, Macca and KJ. From what I've seen so far, Ryan Clarke impresses me. I don't think it would help us if the coaching staff take a closed mind into next year as regards the best 22. Let all of these guys consider themselves sure to play ... only on their merits. That way we give the blokes we've got coming in, and the up-and-comers, incentive to work hard to force their way into the side. That's how I hope we'll be shouting "Go Bloods!" a little later in September next year than this.

  5. #89
    Fascinating year ahead

  6. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ludwig View Post
    I sense that the coaching staff realise that we need to transition our game plan. Recent draft selections of players like Hayward, Florent, Ronke, Ling and Stoddart are the best indication of what they're thinking and the direction we're heading.
    I'm repeating something I wrote a few months back, but the clear desire to recruit for pace is nothing new. You can go back to 2009 and see that pace was the primary attribute the club was looking for with the first two selections it made. And then the early pick in almost every year since has had pace as a major reason why they were rated so highly (Towers, Jones, Florent, Hayward, Ling), other than those years where we had priority access to a player than was too good to pass up (Mitchell, Heeney, Mills). Lamb is probably the only one who didn't quite fit that bill, though I suspect, even in his case, he was projected to play in a quicker style than he ever actually delivered.

  7. #91
    I agree we have targetted pace, but by and large, I would say that we have failed in this area. Only a few have made good footballers.

  8. #92
    Senior Player Bloody Hell's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Auntie.Gerald View Post
    Fascinating year ahead
    Agree. We have a good clump coming through in the 20-24 age group that has the makings of a premiership team, with a few exceptional veterans who might pull everyone with them. Could do a Hawks '08.

    Reid's 26, Parker's 26...Mitchell's 25
    The eternal connundrum "what happens when an unstoppable force meets an immovable object" was finally solved when David Hasselhoff punched himself in the face.

  9. #93
    I agree is going to be tough for spots, which is a good thing

    Longterm Naismith is the Ruckman of choice but id doubt very much if he knocks Sinclair out of the team Rd 1. What Sinks did last year is miles better than what Naimsith has been able to do with consistency.

    I live Reg but i think Melican and AA take priority, everyone forgets Melican was every bit as good as AA when he was playing

    Smith and Reg is trouble here

    Fwd line is stacked too, Reid and buddy first choice, Mccartin pressing but we are maybe too tall.
    Menzel has to start and Blakey as a Top 5 draftee has to play.

    Jack in trouble, i hope Dawson Ronke Paps and Hayward keep their spots

    In trouble for mine are Reg Smith Jack Mccartin

  10. #94
    Quote Originally Posted by waswan View Post
    I agree is going to be tough for spots, which is a good thing

    Longterm Naismith is the Ruckman of choice but id doubt very much if he knocks Sinclair out of the team Rd 1. What Sinks did last year is miles better than what Naimsith has been able to do with consistency.

    I live Reg but i think Melican and AA take priority, everyone forgets Melican was every bit as good as AA when he was playing

    Smith and Reg is trouble here

    Fwd line is stacked too, Reid and buddy first choice, Mccartin pressing but we are maybe too tall.
    Menzel has to start and Blakey as a Top 5 draftee has to play.

    Jack in trouble, i hope Dawson Ronke Paps and Hayward keep their spots

    In trouble for mine are Reg Smith Jack Mccartin
    I agree with almost all of this.

    I'm not worried about the forward line being too tall with McCartin, but that he needs to add greater strength before he's a first 22-er in a team which isn't burdened by injuries.

    Smith - I'd have in my 22. I haven't seem stats from the second half of the year, but earlier on competition-wide stats showed him clearly best in his role.

    Agree fully re Naismith and Sinkers. I couldn't leave Sinkers out round 1; the rest of the season is up to how he plays - and injuries, of course.

    Surely, yes, we've got to play Menzel - otherwise would seem pointless getting him. We've got to see what he can do in our team. And maybe Menzel and the return of Reid go a way to address what I think a few of us thought a reasonable comment by Dal Santo, that we play too predictably. I know Harley deflected that with a comment something along the lines that predictable isn't a bad thing when it involves work ethic, etc, etc, but behind the brave face that puts on things - brave, but it's conceded that his comment, too, has an element of truth - it's certain that we are too reliant on Buddy and that we've got to mix it up a bit.

    So, in trouble for mine would be Reg, Jack, McCartin.

  11. #95
    I'm not so quick to agree that we are over-reliant on Buddy. This season we were, because Reid was injured and McCartin so young. But this was not so much the case last year or the year before.

    I don't agree we have to play Menzel. We have picked him up cheap because he was delisted and we will be paying him modestly. It's more that we probably gave him some kind of half-assurances before he agreed to move up here. He may work well in the front half with Buddy, Reid, Hayward and co, or we may decide that we prefer to play Dawson in that position. Menzel will well and truly have to earn his spot over the pre-season - AND stay clear of injury!

  12. #96
    Quote Originally Posted by bloodspirit View Post
    I'm not so quick to agree that we are over-reliant on Buddy. This season we were, because Reid was injured and McCartin so young. But this was not so much the case last year or the year before.

    I don't agree we have to play Menzel. We have picked him up cheap because he was delisted and we will be paying him modestly. It's more that we probably gave him some kind of half-assurances before he agreed to move up here. He may work well in the front half with Buddy, Reid, Hayward and co, or we may decide that we prefer to play Dawson in that position. Menzel will well and truly have to earn his spot over the pre-season - AND stay clear of injury!
    As is implied in your post, bloodspirit, I wouldn't like Menzel guaranteed a spot, and would want him to have to earn it. But other things being equal, I'd be inclined to pick him ahead of Dawson for round 1 on the basis of his averaging two goals a game - in games he's played - over the last couple of seasons, and on the basis of his experience. But if Dawson were to prove himself the better selection (and especially as the season unfolds), all power to him!

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