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Thread: Swans pushing for 3 Grand Finals

  1. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Boddo View Post
    The small advantages the northern clubs had to help them compete with Victorian clubs have virtually gone.

    The academies have become heavily screwed in Victorian clubs favour now with even WA/SA having put in a submission to try to change their academy rules to atleast have a semblance of what the Vic clubs have.

    COLA is virtually gone.

    Non Victorian clubs do not have nowhere near the prime time games the Vic clubs have. You get to see great blockbusters like Carlton v St Kilda instead of the Showdown.

    All the controls that kept non Vic clubs quiet are gone.

    I don’t think it’ll go away I think it’s the start.
    Thats a very good point. You cant be held to ransom if you have nothing to lose.

    Its falling into line now. The big powerful non-vic clubs (Swans, WC and Adelaide) are aligned, and all have recent experience of the disadvantages.
    The Mid-tier will probably follow soon (Port, Brisbane, Freo).
    Be very interesting to see what the minnows do (GC and GWS). The AFL still have significant leverage against them in their fledgling state. But better to die on your feet, than live on your knees.

  2. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by KSAS View Post
    I know this is slightly off topic, but I had a look at the AFL Org structure and I think it's glaring for a national competition there are no state representive positions.

    I would have an AFL office in each state with a local CIO heading it,
    who are on the ground and in continuous contact with local leagues and AFL clubs, nose to the ground to address/highlight residing issues. Each of these state CIOs report directly to the AFL Commission.
    Those CIO's to be selected by the clubs in their respective states and not the league itself.....we don't want Victorians plants liaising with their masters on matters interstate and manipulating things at their behest.

  3. #27
    It just shows how bad the administrators are if they believed the new contract would just slide by unotticed.

    IMO this is only the start. Next will be the FIXture.

    People talk now and especially on social media. The old days of being fed bs by the likes of Sheahan via the VFL are gone. People have no interest in a concocted sports entertainment business.

    They like to see everything fair n above board. Not a mates club that’s run by people just to make a few extra bucks for themselves. Perfect example was Fitzpats....t.

  4. #28
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    I'm not a fan of Jeff Kennett but there is a quote from him in the Herald Sun about the AFL Commission saying "The commission is just soft. We know they're don't uphold the highest standards of governance."

    He is absolutely correct!

  5. #29
    Carpe Noctem CureTheSane's Avatar
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    The Swans would never come out and say that for fear of persecution (trade bans etc)
    I see us (and most teams) as being fairly submissive to the AFL
    Then you have the Hawks, the Bulldogs, and The Magpies and a couple of others who have representatives who are defiant and dissentious.

    Like it or hate it, they sure create a real culture for the management of the club.
    Our management culture would be, um... not sure, it's all behind closed doors. Not ashamed of this, but hard to be proud of it, like Hawks supporters would be right now with Jeff saying what they don't get to say, on their behalf.
    The difference between insanity and genius is measured only in success.

  6. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by stevoswan View Post
    Some of the comments in today's H/S regarding this show what the non Vic teams are up against. Very anti Swans, along the lines of 'they need three chances', 'pathetic interstate crap', 'still looking for unfair advantages', 'interstate teams have done very well in the GF' and even this wacky pearler.....'the Swans have the luxury of 11 home games every season, what more do they want?!' Seriously??!! There was even one bemoaning their greatest fear, interstate GF's.....'are we going to have GF's at tiny stadiums like Spotless or Metricon?' They really fear the GF being taken away from the exclusivity of the MCG.....

    The delusion of this league being a totally fair one runs high in Victoria.
    I had a debate with an Essendon supporting work colleague about how the AFL competition favours Victorian clubs, specifically the Grand Final issue and player drain from non-football states. He's normally quite an intelligent person but his main points were the Grand Final is at neutral venue (!!!), interstate clubs have an unfair advantage because of their home grounds regardless of travel, loss of players to Victorian clubs etc (!!!). and that Victorian clubs play derbies every week which affects their pre-match build up and post-match recovery whereas non-Victorian clubs only play one or two derbies a year, giving them yet another advantage (!!!!).
    It will be a long, long, long time, probably multiple generations before the inherent inequalities that exist in the AFL due to geographic location are negated.

  7. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jimitron5000 View Post
    I had a debate with an Essendon supporting work colleague about how the AFL competition favours Victorian clubs, specifically the Grand Final issue and player drain from non-football states. He's normally quite an intelligent person but his main points were the Grand Final is at neutral venue (!!!), interstate clubs have an unfair advantage because of their home grounds regardless of travel, loss of players to Victorian clubs etc (!!!). and that Victorian clubs play derbies every week which affects their pre-match build up and post-match recovery whereas non-Victorian clubs only play one or two derbies a year, giving them yet another advantage (!!!!).
    It will be a long, long, long time, probably multiple generations before the inherent inequalities that exist in the AFL due to geographic location are negated.
    Maybe you should suggest to him that his team relocate so that they can gain a competitive advantage over the eight teams that remain in Melbourne. Alice Springs must surely be ripe for an AFL team? Or if he's an Essendon fan, maybe the Tiwi Islands would better suit (given they seem to feel some connection to that part of the country).

  8. #32
    Statistically its actually much easier for a Victorian team to finish top 4 than a non-victorian.

    A non-victorian has (roughly) 11 games of distinct home ground advantage, and 11 games of distinct away ground disadvantge. Their win/loss distribution graph is centred around 11 wins, but quite narrow at the sides. (ie the distribution is narrow).

    A vic side has (roughly) 18 games of neutral ground advantage, 2 games of distinct away disadvantage, and 2 games of distinct home advantage. The win/loss distribution graph is centred around 11 wins also, but much wider variance because of the high number of 50/50 games.

    What this means is that West Coast, Adelaide and Sydney of the last 3 years were super teams to defy this probability, and if all hosted grand finals at a neutral venue they would win in a canter because their victorian opponents got into top 2/4 without having to win a lot of away disadvantaged games, and so were a weaker list.

    Also means Brisbane and GC are/were really a lot worse list-wise than other teams when they are finishing last. It means they cant even win more than a couple of heavily home ground advantaged games.

  9. #33
    I said in this thread before that I believed the FIXture would be the next issue that non-Vic clubs go after next, then the extension of draftees to a 3 year contract. This advantages Victorian clubs massively. Then 3rd party deals.

    There’s nothing keeping these clubs quiet anymore, no COLA, no retention allowance, the academy advantages have shifted to the Victorian clubs, the FIXture, Victorian clubs travelling less etc etc.

    The administrators have shifted the balance so far in the Victorian clubs favour that the non-Vic clubs having nothing to lose now.


    I actually think this could be a massive turning point in dragging a so called national league to become a truly national league n grow the game.

  10. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Boddo View Post
    I said in this thread before that I believed the FIXture would be the next issue that non-Vic clubs go after next, then the extension of draftees to a 3 year contract. This advantages Victorian clubs massively. Then 3rd party deals.

    There’s nothing keeping these clubs quiet anymore, no COLA, no retention allowance, the academy advantages have shifted to the Victorian clubs, the FIXture, Victorian clubs travelling less etc etc.

    The administrators have shifted the balance so far in the Victorian clubs favour that the non-Vic clubs having nothing to lose now.


    I actually think this could be a massive turning point in dragging a so called national league to become a truly national league n grow the game.
    None of these 3 things applied to West Coast, Freo, Port or Adelaide, so why were they quiet ?

  11. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by barry View Post
    None of these 3 things applied to West Coast, Freo, Port or Adelaide, so why were they quiet ?
    The academy disadvantage does apply to WA/SA. I identified this on here a long time ago before this came about. A submission has already been sent to the AFL.

    https://www.theage.com.au/sport/afl/...20-p4zmq3.html

    If Franklin grew up in Collingwoods zoned area he’d be tied to Collingwood whether that be their country or metro zone.

    But if say he grew up in Bunbury, Fremantle would have no rights to him. Even though Bunbury is basically the same size as Launceston. The place North have rights to indigenous players like Tarryn Thomas.

    Non Victorian clubs just want an even playing field n not these backroom mates clubs sweat heart deals that Vic clubs are used to.

    The days of these shonky Victorian deals are going to die a slow death. The writing is on the wall.

  12. #36
    Travelling Swannie!! mcs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by liz View Post
    Maybe you should suggest to him that his team relocate so that they can gain a competitive advantage over the eight teams that remain in Melbourne. Alice Springs must surely be ripe for an AFL team? Or if he's an Essendon fan, maybe the Tiwi Islands would better suit (given they seem to feel some connection to that part of the country).
    I like your thinking Liz. The Tiwi Island Bombers all the way for mine.... just take their fans with them please rofl
    "You get the feeling that like Monty Python's Black Knight, the Swans would regard amputation as merely a flesh wound."

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