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Thread: Changes for Round 5 v Tigers

  1. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by neilfws View Post
    I don't think the problem is so much individual players, as how they are interacting with each other.

    I hesitate to use terms like "team balance", as I'm not sure precisely how that would be defined or if it is even a real thing. I just get a sense, this season and much of last year, that the team is struggling to "gel". Perhaps it's a function of shared experience, how many games players have played together. Seems we've had a lot of debutants, some key outs due to injury, formerly-reliable veterans suffering lack of form.

    Maybe it all just adds up to a team that just isn't functioning as it should, and time will sort things out.
    Well, they certainly weren't gelling well at the start of the 2017 season but eventually got their act together.....that experience (and the first half of last Thursdays game) gives us hope that you might be right.

  2. #74
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    some have to go. out ronke Thurlow blakey in rowbottom melican oriordon give mcinerney 1 more go
    Last edited by gazza; 16th April 2019 at 06:19 PM.
    forgotten 1996
    2005 a much sweeter memory,2012 even better

  3. #75
    Quote Originally Posted by Ludwig View Post
    I agree we should bring in Cameron, whether we keep Sinclair in the side or not. We can look at that as a separate issue on its own merits.

    Your point is right, that we are just getting killed trying to control the ruck contests and need to find another solution. Unfortunately, we really can't count on Naismith, this year or even in the future. His body just hasn't held up. If he comes good, well that's a bonus.

    That just leaves Cameron as the only one who has a realistic chance of challenging the better ruckmen in the competition, but he will need time to develop at AFL level. He's a ruckman who added forward craft, as opposed to Sinclair, who was a forward who has tried to add ruck craft to his arsenal. Cameron is the more natural ruckman, in both size and technique.

    What are we waiting for?
    I watched the NEAFL game and the impression I had about Cameron was that he was good around the park but got soundly beaten by Nicholls in the ruck (he also seem to smash Amartey and Maclean as well in the ruck). Is Nicholls renown as a good tap ruckman? I know Cameron has racked up some huge hit out numbers on non AFL listed ruckmen but is he effective against AFL quality ruckmen? Maybe that's why Horse is reluctant to play him (I am speculating, the above are genuine questions).

  4. #76
    Quote Originally Posted by Ralph Dawg View Post
    I watched the NEAFL game and the impression I had about Cameron was that he was good around the park but got soundly beaten by Nicholls in the ruck (he also seem to smash Amartey and Maclean as well in the ruck). Is Nicholls renown as a good tap ruckman? I know Cameron has racked up some huge hit out numbers on non AFL listed ruckmen but is he effective against AFL quality ruckmen? Maybe that's why Horse is reluctant to play him (I am speculating, the above are genuine questions).
    Haven't seen a lot of him and I'm sure he's stronger than Sinclair but doesn't look particularly mobile enough for AFL.

  5. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by stevoswan View Post
    Well, they certainly weren't gelling well at the start of the 2017 season but eventually got their act together
    Just looking at 2017-18, amazing how different those seasons were.

    2017: 7 losses in the first half of the year, 7 weeks until a home win. Only 2 losses in the second half, margins rising steadily, all looking good for finals until crushed at the hands of Geelong.

    2018: only 3 losses in the first half, all at home. Then 6 losses in the second half, margins really fell away, never looked like finals contenders and so it proved to be.

    I suppose it does look more like 2017 right now, so who knows.


  6. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ralph Dawg View Post
    I watched the NEAFL game and the impression I had about Cameron was that he was good around the park but got soundly beaten by Nicholls in the ruck (he also seem to smash Amartey and Maclean as well in the ruck). Is Nicholls renown as a good tap ruckman? I know Cameron has racked up some huge hit out numbers on non AFL listed ruckmen but is he effective against AFL quality ruckmen? Maybe that's why Horse is reluctant to play him (I am speculating, the above are genuine questions).
    I don't have the stats, but Cameron has played a fair few games against Nicholls and has generally had the better of him. He's also beaten every ruckman he's come up against, except perhaps McInerney from Brisbane (can't recall). Cameron was the dominant player in the NEAFL last year. Racked up the most Fantasy points by a long way. He's mobile, plays defense and is a good mark and shot for goal. By all accounts, he should become a good AFL player.

  7. #79
    Quote Originally Posted by O'Reilly Boy View Post
    For next week . . .

    Out: McInerny, Ronke, Blakey, Thurlow, Sinclair
    In: O'Riordan, Mellican, Rose, Cameron, Stoddard
    Quote Originally Posted by Ludwig View Post
    I agree with these changes, pending what happens in the NEAFL. Bit I don't think these changes, or any changes, will make much of a difference this year.
    O'Reilly boy started the thread with a pretty comprehensive list of suggested changes - five, no less. I was a bit surprised to see Ludwig endorse all suggestions, given that he's been cautioning against setting our hopes too high this year. If another strand to the discussion is the need for players to gel as a team, surely five changes is too many, even though any one of the five might be justifiable.

    As for mine, Sinkers looked knackered last week, and must have either support or a break; I'd be dropping Blakey before Ronke, but don't look to either of them in the short term as the player critical for revival. As for McInerny, the coaches will have to weigh up whether he played a role better than was apparent to us punters in the stands; my own sense is that he was brought in too early, but perhaps the coaches are already conceding this as a development year.

    I'm warming to aguy's favouring McCartin in the backline; and I'm still wanting Mills to play more time in the midfield, where our being hammered does nothing to the apparent stature of our defence. Surely we could be pro-active on this, even if it is with an expectation that it may not gel at first. In sum, I want to see not more than three changes but do want to see an eye to our future, because I agree with Ludwig and others that this year isn't the one where we threaten for a flag.

  8. #80
    Quote Originally Posted by Ludwig View Post
    I don't have the stats, but Cameron has played a fair few games against Nicholls and has generally had the better of him. He's also beaten every ruckman he's come up against, except perhaps McInerney from Brisbane (can't recall). Cameron was the dominant player in the NEAFL last year. Racked up the most Fantasy points by a long way. He's mobile, plays defense and is a good mark and shot for goal. By all accounts, he should become a good AFL player.
    If that's the case, nows the time to get him in. Sinclair is looking buggered and Naismith's body is literally falling apart before our eyes!

  9. #81
    It is surprising we haven’t come in for more criticism I think, given Adelaide are getting caned in the media, and prior to last week Melbourne had legitimate question marks over them, including having conceded 20 goals each in their previous two games.

    And we were pretty easily brushed aside by both those teams in the end.

    To me we are purposely building for a couple of years from now, but trying to cling on to a level of competitiveness where we might be able to play finals.

    I said it last year, but I don’t understand why you have Rose on the list if you’re not going to play him and push up the next intake of youngsters anyway.

    And it is puzzling why you would re-sign Grundy if the plan was to experiment with McCartin in defence.

    All our older players are injury-plagued or barely offering anything more than younger alternatives - McVeigh aside. But even then we would probably have been better giving O’Riordan a year in that role than a few games in-and-out of the side.

    I would play Rowbottom every week from here on - that would be an investment in a type of player we definitely need to fast-track.

    We do seem to favour giving young players an ‘encouragement award’ of a senior game or two, even if they don’t deserve it (or at least that others are outperforming them in the reserves), so I expect that will continue with a few more in the coming couple of months. None of whom will really do anything to make us a better team for now.

    Not saying that’s good or bad, I can see the logic in giving them a taste, rewarding attitude and training efforts etc - but it does leave better options for a given week in the NEAFL.

  10. #82
    Senior Player dejavoodoo44's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ludwig View Post
    I don't have the stats, but Cameron has played a fair few games against Nicholls and has generally had the better of him. He's also beaten every ruckman he's come up against, except perhaps McInerney from Brisbane (can't recall). Cameron was the dominant player in the NEAFL last year. Racked up the most Fantasy points by a long way. He's mobile, plays defense and is a good mark and shot for goal. By all accounts, he should become a good AFL player.
    The hit out numbers from that game were, Nicholls: 35, Cameron: 25, McLean: 6, Amartey: 3, Day: 2. Unfortunately, the Live Footy app doesn't seem to list hit outs to advantage, or the stat that I wished was recorded, hit outs to disadvantage.

  11. #83
    Quote Originally Posted by Steve View Post
    It is surprising we haven’t come in for more criticism I think, given Adelaide are getting caned in the media, and prior to last week Melbourne had legitimate question marks over them, including having conceded 20 goals each in their previous two games.

    And we were pretty easily brushed aside by both those teams in the end.

    To me we are purposely building for a couple of years from now, but trying to cling on to a level of competitiveness where we might be able to play finals.

    I said it last year, but I don’t understand why you have Rose on the list if you’re not going to play him and push up the next intake of youngsters anyway.

    And it is puzzling why you would re-sign Grundy if the plan was to experiment with McCartin in defence.

    All our older players are injury-plagued or barely offering anything more than younger alternatives - McVeigh aside. But even then we would probably have been better giving O’Riordan a year in that role than a few games in-and-out of the side.

    I would play Rowbottom every week from here on - that would be an investment in a type of player we definitely need to fast-track.

    We do seem to favour giving young players an ‘encouragement award’ of a senior game or two, even if they don’t deserve it (or at least that others are outperforming them in the reserves), so I expect that will continue with a few more in the coming couple of months. None of whom will really do anything to make us a better team for now.

    Not saying that’s good or bad, I can see the logic in giving them a taste, rewarding attitude and training efforts etc - but it does leave better options for a given week in the NEAFL.
    I think the reason that we haven't come to more criticism is the fact that the experts and the majority of critics have come to the conclusion that we are in a decline and are in a transition phase.

  12. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ludwig View Post
    I agree we should bring in Cameron, whether we keep Sinclair in the side or not. We can look at that as a separate issue on its own merits.

    Your point is right, that we are just getting killed trying to control the ruck contests and need to find another solution. Unfortunately, we really can't count on Naismith, this year or even in the future. His body just hasn't held up. If he comes good, well that's a bonus.

    That just leaves Cameron as the only one who has a realistic chance of challenging the better ruckmen in the competition, but he will need time to develop at AFL level. He's a ruckman who added forward craft, as opposed to Sinclair, who was a forward who has tried to add ruck craft to his arsenal. Cameron is the more natural ruckman, in both size and technique.

    What are we waiting for?
    Agreed, aguy and Ludwig - time to bring Cameron in. On aguy's original post: agree with the ins, but Stoddart to replace Ronke, not Jack whose experience we need.

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