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Thread: Why isn't there a single combined Black Diamond & Sydney AFL competition

  1. #1

    Why isn't there a single combined Black Diamond & Sydney AFL competition

    To make both the Black Diamond and Sydney AFL competition more even and more interesting why aren't they combined into a single competition with multiple Divisions - as per the QAFL?

    As examples in the QAFL seniors (which would be stronger than Sydney Prems) teams travel from Sandgate in Brisbane to Palm Beach = 114 kms

    In Division 1 teams travel from Noosa Heads to Burleigh Heads = 229kms! The same occurs to varying distances down to Division 5 in the QAFL.

    If there was a single competition in the Sydney / Hunter region and Newcastle City had to travel to Southern Power that would be only 184km - if they had to travel to Wollongong (North Dalton) it would be 228Km (as an extreme comparison).

    The big Sydney Clubs could run Seniors / Reserves in 2 competitions? It would be great to see how Terrigal and Newcastle would go in Prems against Manly and UTS and how Penrith would go against Cardiff and Wyong as examples.

    While there would be a range of logistical issues, they seem to make it work in the QAFL with 4 Divisions of seniors & reserves and 2 division of single teams (no ressies)

    Thoughts?

  2. #2
    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Wills View Post
    To make both the Black Diamond and Sydney AFL competition more even and more interesting why aren't they combined into a single competition with multiple Divisions - as per the QAFL?

    As examples in the QAFL seniors (which would be stronger than Sydney Prems) teams travel from Sandgate in Brisbane to Palm Beach = 114 kms

    In Division 1 teams travel from Noosa Heads to Burleigh Heads = 229kms! The same occurs to varying distances down to Division 5 in the QAFL.

    If there was a single competition in the Sydney / Hunter region and Newcastle City had to travel to Southern Power that would be only 184km - if they had to travel to Wollongong (North Dalton) it would be 228Km (as an extreme comparison).

    The big Sydney Clubs could run Seniors / Reserves in 2 competitions? It would be great to see how Terrigal and Newcastle would go in Prems against Manly and UTS and how Penrith would go against Cardiff and Wyong as examples.

    While there would be a range of logistical issues, they seem to make it work in the QAFL with 4 Divisions of seniors & reserves and 2 division of single teams (no ressies)

    Thoughts?
    Great idea Tom. This is what I was getting at in my recent comment on another thread, ideas like this - we need a plan to develop leagues and clubs to improve standards not wait downstream for flow on effect from Swans/GWS activities (all aimed at drafting a few kids and creating paying fans for their clubs). The leadership to innovate and take initiative in Sydney has always been lacking and still is, other than in pockets of clubs themselves from time to time - so we get points systems, moving feast politically expedient pathways, made up clubs instead of Western Sydney footy club development, inconsistent rules and application of rules at finals and other key times, we see participation numbers of 8 years olds spruiked as the be all and end all etc etc etc - all as people in Moore park try to impress people in Melbourne. AFL needs to collaborate with local club leaders on new strategies and invest in local footy outcomes.

  3. #3
    You struggle to get people to travel to away games on the lower divisions. Imagine a 9am game in away in Newcastle. No thanks.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Wills View Post
    To make both the Black Diamond and Sydney AFL competition more even and more interesting why aren't they combined into a single competition with multiple Divisions - as per the QAFL?

    As examples in the QAFL seniors (which would be stronger than Sydney Prems) teams travel from Sandgate in Brisbane to Palm Beach = 114 kms

    In Division 1 teams travel from Noosa Heads to Burleigh Heads = 229kms! The same occurs to varying distances down to Division 5 in the QAFL.

    If there was a single competition in the Sydney / Hunter region and Newcastle City had to travel to Southern Power that would be only 184km - if they had to travel to Wollongong (North Dalton) it would be 228Km (as an extreme comparison).

    The big Sydney Clubs could run Seniors / Reserves in 2 competitions? It would be great to see how Terrigal and Newcastle would go in Prems against Manly and UTS and how Penrith would go against Cardiff and Wyong as examples.

    While there would be a range of logistical issues, they seem to make it work in the QAFL with 4 Divisions of seniors & reserves and 2 division of single teams (no ressies)

    Thoughts?
    I must admit I can’t see what the benefit of this would be. Apart from some of the stronger Newcastle clubs being able to test themselves against the Sydney clubs. From a Sydney perspective it would only hinder participation rates when players start getting sick of the travel and petrol cost as well as having to spend all day to play a 2 hour game of football. But if I’ve missed an obvious benefit then let me know.


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  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by saviour01 View Post
    You struggle to get people to travel to away games on the lower divisions. Imagine a 9am game in away in Newcastle. No thanks.
    I can't imagine a club like Campbelltown or even Camden would get enough numbers in their Div 3 team to travel to somewhere like Nelson Bay. And vice versa. Prems players would travel, but it's a big ask for lower division players.

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  6. #6
    Well retired, still sore Pekay's Avatar
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    All I read was BUS TRIPS and my liver started throbbing. Still recovering from an overnighter at Gosford in 2012.

  7. #7
    Agree with the comments about travel but why is it not an issue in the QAFL - as I indicted in Divison 1 one of the trips is Noosa Heads to Burleigh Heads = 229kms

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Wills View Post
    Agree with the comments about travel but why is it not an issue in the QAFL - as I indicted in Divison 1 one of the trips is Noosa Heads to Burleigh Heads = 229kms
    But why do it in the first place? What’s the benefit? Just because they do it in Queensland is not a reason we should copy.


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  9. #9
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    I think it actually has some merit however doing it would most likely tear the guts out of the BD as the best players would gravitate towards to two teams competing in PD so in reality it would set the game back immensely.

    Why not have an AFL run 6 team under 21 comp in Sydney outside of the clubs control where the best kids could be developed from 17-21. This would enable those kids to play a high standard and potentially in a few cases get drafted without the empty promises from clubs interested in themselves first and foremost.

    At the same time reintroduce the pathway so that the junior clubs dont have kids poached but stronger junior clubs and also allow the senior clubs to develop/cultivate their region.

    This model would allow junior regions to promote the best kids to an unbiased talented pathway and still develop those not at that standard in a competitive environment. All senior clubs would be able to benefit from hopefully having access to better numbers in their region and hopefully reap rewards commensurate with their work at those clubs.

    As for the kids from the elite comp you would hope that they return to their PD clubs from their region (or the senior club they identify best with) when either not selected in those teams or when they finish at the level to continue playing at a high standard and help improve the overall standard of footy in Sydney.

    Just my thoughts though

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by tara View Post
    I think it actually has some merit however doing it would most likely tear the guts out of the BD as the best players would gravitate towards to two teams competing in PD so in reality it would set the game back immensely.

    Why not have an AFL run 6 team under 21 comp in Sydney outside of the clubs control where the best kids could be developed from 17-21. This would enable those kids to play a high standard and potentially in a few cases get drafted without the empty promises from clubs interested in themselves first and foremost.

    At the same time reintroduce the pathway so that the junior clubs dont have kids poached but stronger junior clubs and also allow the senior clubs to develop/cultivate their region.

    This model would allow junior regions to promote the best kids to an unbiased talented pathway and still develop those not at that standard in a competitive environment. All senior clubs would be able to benefit from hopefully having access to better numbers in their region and hopefully reap rewards commensurate with their work at those clubs.

    As for the kids from the elite comp you would hope that they return to their PD clubs from their region (or the senior club they identify best with) when either not selected in those teams or when they finish at the level to continue playing at a high standard and help improve the overall standard of footy in Sydney.

    Just my thoughts though
    I thought Tom was just suggesting take a look at possibilities, which is the sort of thing I think should happen and be a focus other than pointless rules and regs from league. Too hard, too complex is a defeatist mindset and leads to no positive change. Not all comps would benefit clearly, maybe just prems and plats, who knows, but road trips are fun for the committed footballer - the main premise should be, how do we strengthen competitions and incentivise clubs to improve. U/23 idea from Tara also has a lot of merit. Yes clubs will feel it initially as ever with any version of these ideas as its change, but promo-relegation over the longer terms addresses that reasonably well I think. Otherwise just live with same old.

  11. #11
    Well retired, still sore Pekay's Avatar
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    Could Prems and potentially Plats be done in some kind of north-south conferences?

    Prems North - Newcastle City, Terrigal, North Shore, Pennant Hills, East Coast, Wests

    Prems South - Sydney Uni, UTS, UNSW/ES, Camden, St George, Wollongong/South Coast

    I dunno, there's never an easy answer is there.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Pekay View Post
    Could Prems and potentially Plats be done in some kind of north-south conferences?

    Prems North - Newcastle City, Terrigal, North Shore, Pennant Hills, East Coast, Wests

    Prems South - Sydney Uni, UTS, UNSW/ES, Camden, St George, Wollongong/South Coast

    I dunno, there's never an easy answer is there.
    Why do it in the first place? No one is yet to explain a benefit to the whole idea of including Newcastle teams.


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