BBBH

[stevoswan]

If people think all players are equal then they are drinking the Kool Aid. If all players were equal then they would all be paid the same amount of money and be as important as each other.

Players are not equal. They are paid according to their on-field capability and some players are much more important than others.

As such older players who are superstars are structurally important and whom have won the biggest of games must be afforded a level of respect from the younger players.

What is the young upstart going to tell Barry in the group forum that he doesn’t already know or has not already been made aware of by Paul Roos. Absolutely nothing. The young upstart in only saying it to appear like they are a leader. These were Barry’s words.

A wonderful example of leadership by a young player was Michael Clarke supporting Shane Warne during the 2005 Ashes series. Shane was struggling with his marriage breakdown, was crying himself to sleep and was raiding the hotel mini bar. Michael Clarke spend time with Shane, listened to him, was a confidant and supported him.

Shane responded by producing his greatest ever on-field series.

Clarke didn’t walk into a Leading Teams meeting and say that Shane is drinking too much alcohol every night and is not fully prepared. That would have eroded all trust.

Why couldn’t the Swans young player supported Barry the way Clarke supported Warne.

BS, you just don't get it do you? Stop doubling down....it's getting tiresome.....read 'more tiresome'. You're pretty much on your own on this one so stop lecturing everyone.

You have no idea what the YU said in that meeting, just that Barry implied that he didn't like it. Boo hoo. As I alluded to in a previous post, he's grown up a lot since then and probably now has an opinion that aligns more with your detractors on this subject.

I'll repeat: You are flogging a dead horse.

Yawn.

[stevoswan]

I’ve said that players can be appointed captain young in their career. Paul Kelly has the authority to give feedback as a young captain because that’s his right and authority.

I don’t believe the young player who criticised Barry in a group forum was a captain but that person was ambitious for leadership and wanted to impress the coaching staff by putting Barry under the bus.

One word on this subjectivity: Bull@@@@.

[Goal Sneak]

Hi Bangalore,

It is true that a club won't succeed without excellent recruitment, players with ability, coaching performances and game plans.

Your argument would be a strong one if you didn't ignore the fact that all of those things are what makes up culture!!

They all have a domino effect! Without strong recruitment we will have players either lacking ability or of a questionable character that makes them hard to coach. There would then be a disconnect between the coach and the playing group, and the game plan will not come together!

So all of the things you think are more important than culture are actually the very definition of "culture"!

Also - a winning team is NOT always a happy team!! How quickly did the culture of Adelaide Crows and Collingwood disintegrate after appearing in grand finals?? They were winning sides yes, but clubs obviously lacking the culture to avoid the sharp downward turn! We were humiliated in the 2014 GF. I know, I was there!! Our club could've done what the Crows & Pies did - panic, overreact, make drastic list management decisions, make changes within the club! We did not do this - we relied on our culture and it got us to ANOTHER grand final two years later!! That is culture right before your eyes!!

Spot on Neon.

The culture also provided a seamless transition between Roos and Longmire. It's no co-incidence that Horse was well established in the way things were done, he served a long apprenticeship and was more than ready to step up. The fact that Brett Kirk has not become a senior coach yet should not be any indication that he wont be in the future. Everyone knew Longmire was ready to be a head coach, yet he chose to be patient and became a premiership winning coach almost immediately.

You can't argue with results, Look at our consistent finals appearances over the last 25 years. The Swans culture is the envy of most other clubs and supporters alike. Rightly so.

- - - Updated - - -

Bull@@@@@@.

Hahaha! yep, Barry threw himself under the bus if anything

[TheBloods]

I’ve said that players can be appointed captain young in their career. Paul Kelly has the authority to give feedback as a young captain because that’s his right and authority.

I don’t believe the young player who criticised Barry in a group forum was a captain but that person was ambitious for leadership and wanted to impress the coaching staff by putting Barry under the bus.

But how do you think PK became captain ! By being a good boy who sat in his seat and kept his mouth shut every time he was expected to do so ? That is not how a footy club works , you know it and i know it . Any young captain has obviously shown a maturity beyond their years ! That includes speaking up when needed to

[goswannies]

I’ve never played AFL at the professional level. Have you? Has anyone on this forum have played at the highest level? If you have played at the professional level disclose it and you’ll have my full respect and I’ll treat your views and opinions as far better than my own opinions.

Bangalore Swans you, yet again, miss my point so please let me spell it out more clearly. I have only played footy at an amateur level. But it wasn’t me that had the audacity to disrespect a professional young AFL footballer by repeatedly referring to them as an “upstart” (hardly a complimentary term) for following team rules and speaking up at a sanctioned team meeting. I suppose I was suggesting that you show the young player the same respect you are expecting them to have shown Barry until you have played as many AFL games as they have.

I thought that press conference where Kirk publicly laid into Barry was very harsh.

For all the Brett Kirk leadership inspired brilliance I note that he hadn’t risen to a role as head coach as yet and other players whom retired after 2010 have become head coaches .

Perhaps grab a copy of Barry’s book. My impression is that Hall respected Kirk and the way he handled that press conference. Brett told him before hand what he was intending to say so that Barry wasn’t blindsided.

As tactfully and gently as I can say this, it was you and only you on this entire RWO forum who is referring to them as a young upstart while taking umbrage with them. So be it. RWO is a forum for expressing opinions and you most certainly have your right. What I personally find a little galling is your manner of repeatedly and unrelentingly rehashing the same points, telling others “we must”, drawing comparisons between the AFL environment and the corporate world and US sport.

I simply cannot fathom how one person can see an issue in an opposing light to the masses and feel that they are vindicated in lecturing the masses ad nauseam.

Perhaps I’m simply wrong. If so, I suspect I’m not alone.

[Bangalore Swans]

Bangalore Swans you, yet again, miss my point so please let me spell it out more clearly. I have only played footy at an amateur level. But it wasn’t me that had the audacity to disrespect a professional young AFL footballer by repeatedly referring to them as an “upstart” (hardly a complimentary term) for following team rules and speaking up at a sanctioned team meeting. I suppose I was suggesting that you show the young player the same respect you are expecting them to have shown Barry until you have played as many AFL games as they have.



Perhaps grab a copy of Barry’s book. My impression is that Hall respected Kirk and the way he handled that press conference. Brett told him before hand what he was intending to say so that Barry wasn’t blindsided.

As tactfully and gently as I can say this, it was you and only you on this entire RWO forum who is referring to them as a young upstart while taking umbrage with them. So be it. RWO is a forum for expressing opinions and you most certainly have your right. What I personally find a little galling is your manner of repeatedly and unrelentingly rehashing the same points, telling others “we must”, drawing comparisons between the AFL environment and the corporate world and US sport.

I simply cannot fathom how one person can see an issue in an opposing light to the masses and feel that they are vindicated in lecturing the masses ad nauseam.

Perhaps I’m simply wrong. If so, I suspect I’m not alone.

Fair call. I will stop using the term young upstart. I’m sure that young player who said those things to Barry is making a name for himself doing corporate lunch time leadership talks around town. He’s probably doing well.

As for Barry he is dragging the whole AFL world on his broad shoulders as he prepares for SBW. He wins that and AFL guys can he considered in the broad community as the toughest footballers of all.

I feel strongly that Kirk didn’t need to go into a press conference and say the famous I’d trust Barry with my kids quote.

What’s wrong with the Antonio Brown and Tom Brady example? Tom Brady is the best on field leader in world sports and that would be many people’s opinion. Antonio let Tom down but he didn’t resort to big quotes in press conferences to kick Antonio down. All Tom said was it was a sad situation. Why did Kirk have to kick Barry down in the press conference? Kirk should reflect on this and think about how Brady handled Antonio.

When all said and done, there would have been no 2005 premiership without Barry so was his structural importance. They got the premiership done without Stuart Maxfeild, Andrew Shauble, Matthew Nicks and Jadon Saddington. It’s simply would not have happened without Barry.

As such, he is a Swans legend despite his difficult later years.

[Bangalore Swans]

But how do you think PK became captain ! By being a good boy who sat in his seat and kept his mouth shut every time he was expected to do so ? That is not how a footy club works , you know it and i know it . Any young captain has obviously shown a maturity beyond their years ! That includes speaking up when needed to

I think PK got the job a bit like Alan Border in the 80s. There probably wasn’t a lot there and PK displayed a lot of the leadership traits. I’m sure giving it to senior players in team meetings wasn’t one of the winning qualities.

Matthew Rawle of the GCS will probably get the job young like PK in the early 90s because there is not much else.

PK turned out to be absolutely brilliant captain. Judging by their close friendship, I don’t think PK would have given it to Pluggar in team forums.

[0918330512]

I think PK got the job a bit like Alan Border in the 80s. There probably wasn’t a lot there and PK displayed a lot of the leadership traits. I’m sure giving it to senior players in team meetings wasn’t one of the winning qualities.

Matthew Rawle of the GCS will probably get the job young like PK in the early 90s because there is not much else.

PK turned out to be absolutely brilliant captain. Judging by their close friendship, I don’t think PK would have given it to Pluggar in team forums.

Among the players on our list when Kells was appointed captain were: Mark Bayes, Dennis Carroll, Neil Cordy, Daryn Creswell, Andrew Dunkley, David Murphy.

Yup. Not much else to choose from

[0918330512]

As for Barry he is dragging the whole AFL world on his broad shoulders as he prepares for SBW. He wins that and AFL guys can he considered in the broad community as the toughest footballers of all.

Oh my lord, a has been AFL player going toe to toe with a has been rugby player. I expect there will be another Pacific tsunami warning when power of the first punch of that bout lands. Honestly, if you think more than the minority of the population gives a rats fat clacker about that one, I’ve got a fair chunk of the Sydney Harbour Bridge to sell you

[0918330512]

What’s wrong with the Antonio Brown and Tom Brady example? Tom Brady is the best on field leader in world sports and that would be many people’s opinion. Antonio let Tom down but he didn’t resort to big quotes in press conferences to kick Antonio down. All Tom said was it was a sad situation. Why did Kirk have to kick Barry down in the press conference? Kirk should reflect on this and think about how Brady handled Antonio.

Ummm because it’s gridiron and who really cares about that sport? I mean a bunch of Americans do. And some Aussies. But this is an Aussie Rules board.

And who the 🤬 is Antonio Brown?

Please don’t answer that. I simply couldn’t care less.

[Bangalore Swans]

Oh my lord, a has been AFL player going toe to toe with a has been rugby player. I expect there will be another Pacific tsunami warning when power of the first punch of that bout lands. Honestly, if you think more than the minority of the population gives a rats fat clacker about that one, I’ve got a fair chunk of the Sydney Harbour Bridge to sell you

I object to Barry and SBW being referred to as “a has been”. What have you been? Correct me if I’m wrong, in the world of elite Australia sport you’ve been “a never been”. Barry and SBW are legends of their respective sport and deserve to be called better than “a has been”.

I think the fight is attracting huge interest. I think at least 80% of Swans fans will tune on March 23rd as long as the Swans are not playing.

[stevoswan]

If it's anything, this thread sure is entertaining.