Hawthorn racism review

[stevoswan]

Totally agreed caj. Surely ALL people should have been in interviewed. This reeks of sensationalism and gutter journalism. Not sure why the ABC resorts to this- they look to vilify people, it seems. Their hounding of Cardinal Pell is a prime example.

Not an ABC fan? Why shouldn't they investigate this stuff?

"Reeks of sensationalism and gutter journalism" That is a nonsense statement which sounds like something SkyNews would say. I'd call it responsible and brave journalism. Hawthorn sitting on this for 2 weeks reeks of preparing a defence of the indefensible and not actually attempting change for the better.

[stevoswan]

I agree fully with this comment. I think it is reckless of the ABC to publish only one side of the story without the alleged guilty parties having had the opportunity to review the report and make an informed comment. I also think it is reckless of many on here to be commenting one way or the other without being fully informed

You mean 'without the guilty parties having time to come up with denials, excuses and deflection'?

BTW, you're commenting. Have you been 'fully informed'?

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They may have been given a series of questions but, I don't think, they have had access to the full report. That is very important. I'm a big fan of the ABC but I believe they have been irresponsible publishing these allegations

I don't. I think we all know how things can be buried or just swept under the carpet. This now won't and that's good.

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Many in the media are already salivating at the prospect of him being finished. ABC used to be distinguished by its balance and journalistic ethics. These days has an obvious consistent agenda of gotcha stories in relation to racism, sexism and discrimination. All important issues but the stories only tell one side of the story and invariably assume guilt.

Gotcha stories that turn out to be true in most, if not all cases. It matters little how you get to the truth....just that you actually get to the truth.

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We haven't had a chance to evaluate any possible alternative scenarios yet. Clarkson vehemently denies the charges. For all his faults, never thought of him as being dishonest. At the very least, let's wait and see what his defence is. Not that it will necessarily save his career.

As if he is going to come out and say 'yeah, that stuff is true....but we lived in different times back then"?

[Maltopia]

So, in your book, every single allegation against somebody is true? Recipe for a nightmare scenario in any society.

Yes, allegations are only allegations until proven as true facts.

However, First Nations (and all minorities) experience allegations all the time without any right of reply, every time they are treated with suspicion by neighbours or police when going about their every day business, when detained without charges etc. The privileged get a right of reply, the downtrodden don't. Clark and Fagan will hire very expensive legal representatives to defend their reputation and refute the claims. The First Nations players don't have the resources or the voice, except through the 'fortune' of the review being initiated and then the ABC interviewing the families/players involved.

Have a listen to this interview all the way to the end with AIME's Deputy CEO, Ben Abbatangelo

AFL Rocked By Review Into Racism Towards Hawthorn First Nations Players - Network Ten

[stevoswan]

Fagan has now also released a statement saying he strongly denies the allegations.

Of course he has. Means nothing.....

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Understand why the complainants names have been kept confidential. Not sure why the same doesn't apply to Fagan and Clarkson until the allegations are tested through an independent investigation.

I believe the Adam Goodes experience tells you everything you need to know about why their names have been kept confidential. I would have thought that was pretty obvious.

[Blood Fever]

Of course he has. Means nothing.....

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I believe the Adam Goodes experience tells you everything you need to know about why their names have been kept confidential. I would have thought that was pretty obvious.

Read the first line of my post

[stevoswan]

The hanging judge

Seriously, if I had my way I'd hang every racist on the planet.

[stevoswan]

Read the first line of my post

Yeah...fair enough BF. I misread.

[Blood Fever]

Yeah...fair enough BF. I misread.

No drama

[KTigers]

However, First Nations (and all minorities) experience allegations all the time without any right of reply, every time they are treated with suspicion by neighbours or police when going about their every day business, when detained without charges etc. The privileged get a right of reply, the downtrodden don't. Clark and Fagan will hire very expensive legal representatives to defend their reputation and refute the claims. The First Nations players don't have the resources or the voice, except through the 'fortune' of the review being initiated and then the ABC interviewing the families/players involved.

Yep, drive around Redfern or Waterloo sometime and have a look at who the coppers have bailed up. I'm yet to see them confronting a
well-dressed white bloke. Man, there's a lot of outrage on here about a couple of multi millionaire successful football coaches whose
careers may now be "besmirched". What, like Tex Walker's career was ended? Pretty sure I saw he got a bunch of Brownlow votes.
Or do they give them out to people who didn't play. And he admitted what he said. And what happened to him in end? Nothing.
Not much concern for the young players who get cut from "The Family Club" and walk out with nothing.

[Blood Fever]

Yes, allegations are only allegations until proven as true facts.

However, First Nations (and all minorities) experience allegations all the time without any right of reply, every time they are treated with suspicion by neighbours or police when going about their every day business, when detained without charges etc. The privileged get a right of reply, the downtrodden don't. Clark and Fagan will hire very expensive legal representatives to defend their reputation and refute the claims. The First Nations players don't have the resources or the voice, except through the 'fortune' of the review being initiated and then the ABC interviewing the families/players involved.

Have a listen to this interview all the way to the end with AIME's Deputy CEO, Ben Abbatangelo

AFL Rocked By Review Into Racism Towards Hawthorn First Nations Players - Network Ten

Not disputing the plight of the indigenous and the racism that exists in this country. Doesn't mean you should even up by abandoning the principle of natural justice.

[Matty10]

It is simply way too early in the reporting of this story to be definitive about anything. To be making judgements at this stage probably says more about the individual bias that a person holds than anything else.

I know this investigation is being framed in terms of race, as the initial probe was charged with exploring the treatment of Indigenous Australians within the Hawthorn Football Club, but I think it would be wiser to expand the criteria and look at the treatment of all young recruits at the club (or any AFL club). The power imbalance that exists between player and club, particularly for those who are vulnerable in some way, could see this sort of thing happen to anyone.

It might end up looking like the RCIADIC where the statistical anomalies are multifaceted instances of institutional racism and its legacies that leads to an outcome rather than racism being the cause of the outcome itself.

At this stage, it is a wait and see approach from me.

[Roadrunner]

This discussion has descended into farce. The idea that the ABC should sit on a report like this, having become aware of it, is patently ridiculous. They offered Fagan and Clarkson ample opportunity to comment, and they declined. At the very least they could have denied the allegations and indicated they would be making fuller statements at a later date. To call this "gutter journalism" and raise the spectre of Pell is beyond nonsensical.

You’re entitled to your opinion Bloods05- I beg to differ. Giving Clarko And Fagan 24 or so hours to respond is a joke and should be called out. And the ABC has form in this regard- some of their journos are anything bar that!