Our best lineup (players & positions) to take us through the finals in 07...

[JudesaGun]

In your opinion, what is it?

Here's mine:

B: Ben Matthews, Leo Barry, Lewis Roberts-Thomson
HB: Tadgh Kennelly, Craig Bolton, Nick Malceski
C: Luke Ablett, Brett Kirk, Amon Buchanan
HF: Ryan O’Keefe, Michael O’Loughlin, Nic Fosdike
F: Adam Schneider, Barry Hall, Nick Davis
Foll: Darren Jolly, Jude Bolton, Adam Goodes
I/C: Peter Everitt, Jarrad McVeigh, Ted Richards, Sean Dempster

EMG: Tim Schmidt, Paul Bevan, Matthew Laidlaw

And I note:
- One of the best HB lines in the comp, great speed, skill and drive.
- One of the most potent F line in the comp when firing.
- One of best tap ruckman coming off the bench. Great tandem of Jolly and Everitt.
- Good medium-sized bodies off the bench and a vastly improved tagger (McVeigh) to relieve the likes of Ablett, Kirk and Matthews
- Richards over Schmidt on the basis of experience and flexibility. Richards can go forward or back while Schmidt merely provides another midfield option.
- IMO Bevan is just too much of a liability come finals time. His form has been good and he can be a great tagger but he has the potential to give away silly free kicks and/or make mistakes at crucial times which, when playing as a backman, can cost you a game. Dempster is more relaible, has better skills and can play on a medium sized or small forward option. He is a perfect replacement for Malceski or Kennelly when they need a rest.
- Laidlaw lacks game experience but come finals time you need runners so I'd rather him as an EMG over Grudy or Vogels. In any case, we have a number of guys in our starting 22 who can play F or B should we need to mix things up e.g. Richards, LRT, Goodes.

Thoughts?

[hammo]

Thoughts?
You are glowing of our half back line, forwards and ruckmen but glaring in their absense is our stellar midfield?? Perhaps therein lies the reason why we might struggle to win the flag.

[JudesaGun]

You are glowing of our half back line, forwards and ruckmen but glaring in their absense is our stellar midfield?? Perhaps therein lies the reason why we might struggle to win the flag.

Could have said that last year and the year before. If anything our midfield has stayed on par while we have improved our rucks and forwards. Would that not lead to the inevitable conclusion that we are a better chance of winning the flag this year?

[AnnieH]

You haven't got Jesus H Christ in your line up.
We're gunna need him as well.
:)

[Plugger46]

I wouldn't have Dempster or Bevan in our best 22. I'd only have LRT against certain teams too. He is tall and can take a mark, but offers little else.

Teddy is the other one who I would seriously look at.

And while I'm not a fan, Mathews has done enough this season to warrant selection.

[Captain]

Where's Crouch? He is easily in our best 22.

[j s]

You haven't got Jesus H Christ in your line up.
We're gunna need him as well.
:)
We've got his cousin though!

[Ludwig]

Pretty much the team we are fielding Saturday, except Bevan in for Dempster.

Would probably rank Crouch, Bevan, Dempster then Schmidt for the 22nd spot in that order, based at least in part on hardness at the ball, a critical factor in finals. But really not that much between them. But any of them would be okay.

Bevan has been doing the job on the field, so I just have to relent in my criticism for now. Actually think he's been proving me and a lot of us wrong by his recent efforts. Coming around to Connolly's point of view on Bevo.

Bevan, Dempster and Richards all lack a bit of awareness at times. Something that Crouch and Schmidt are good at and in their favour for selection.

I feel pretty comfortable choosing from our top 25 and think we can match it with just about anyone, except the Cats, at the moment, but obviously, the next 4 games will really tell where we are at.

Don't think we can make the GF without Hall and LRT performing near their best. Saturday night should be a good indication of how we will go. We really need to perform against better teams, something we haven't done this year.

[originalswan]

Could have said that last year and the year before. If anything our midfield has stayed on par while we have improved our rucks and forwards. Would that not lead to the inevitable conclusion that we are a better chance of winning the flag this year?

I would question whether the Everitt/Jolly combination is better than the Ball/Jolly combination and would seriously doubt (especially on this years form) whether Barry Hall and Michael O'Loughlin still have the same output as they did in 2005. Hall in particular seems to have lost some pace and consistency.

Jared Crouch would definetely come into the line up once he has regained fitness and some conditioning (especially based on his fantastic 2005 Finals performances).

[Plugger46]

I would question whether the Everitt/Jolly combination is better than the Ball/Jolly combination and would seriously doubt (especially on this years form) whether Barry Hall and Michael O'Loughlin still have the same output as they did in 2005. Hall in particular seems to have lost some pace and consistency.

Jared Crouch would definetely come into the line up once he has regained fitness and some conditioning (especially based on his fantastic 2005 Finals performances).

I'd say Everitt/Jolly is about the same as Ball/Jolly.

I think O'Loughlin is having a fantastic year, as he did in 2005. Hall, not quite the same. Can't put my finger on why this is the case. He seems to be moving freely, and he's not showing the signs that most players show when they're coming towards the end. He just looks down on confidence to me. If he continues to work hard, I'm confident his form will turn around.

[NMWBloods]

Could have said that last year and the year before. If anything our midfield has stayed on par while we have improved our rucks and forwards. Would that not lead to the inevitable conclusion that we are a better chance of winning the flag this year?
I don't think our team is as good as the previous two years.

Hall is well down.

O'Keefe is down a little.

J Bolton is struggling badly.

Kirk is down a little.

McVeigh well below his 2006 performance.

No Crouch.

MOL is slightly down.

Buchanan has been down.

Malceski is well in front of last year.

[Industrial Fan]

I would say Micky O and Kirk have been above their previous seasons.

Maybe not in raw numbers, but certainly their influence on games.

O'keefe has been working harder again this year too.

Bolton and Baz have been down, as has McVeigh. Jolly is hot and cold.

[JudesaGun]

Nothing like a bit of positivity...geez....no wonder I stopped posting here. Too many "I-like-to-call-myself-a-realist-but-really-I-am-an-angry-pessimist-who-loves-to-think-the-worst-because-the-suprise-in-things-turning-out-well-is-so-much-better-without-the-chance-that-I may-actually-be-dissappointed"

Longest name of a "type of person" ever...

[Triple B]

Nothing like a bit of positivity...geez....no wonder I stopped posting here.

Whilst I agree that there is way too many half glass empty posters here, you have to understand it's hard to take anybody with your board name seriously.

[JudesaGun]

What does a board name have to do with the price of fish?

Surely you judge a book by its contents and not its cover. Yet again, I have read the comments of some of the posters here...

[goswannie14]

In your opinion, what is it?

Here's mine:

B: Ben Matthews, Leo Barry, Lewis Roberts-Thomson
HB: Tadhg Kennelly, Craig Bolton, Nick Malceski
C: Luke Ablett, Brett Kirk, Amon Buchanan
HF: Ryan O?Keefe, Michael O?Loughlin, Nic Fosdike
F: Adam Schneider, Barry Hall, Nick Davis
Foll: Darren Jolly, Jude Bolton, Adam Goodes
I/C: Peter Everitt, Jarrad McVeigh, Ted Richards, Sean Dempster

EMG: Tim Schmidt, Paul Bevan, Matthew Laidlaw
Replace Mathews with Bevan and Jude Bolton with Schmidt and I would agree with you.

[liz]

...
O'Keefe is down a little.
...

Kirk is down a little.

...

MOL is slightly down.




I would say Micky O and Kirk have been above their previous seasons.

Maybe not in raw numbers, but certainly their influence on games.

O'keefe has been working harder again this year too.

...

Jolly is hot and cold.

I'm more with MMG on those particular players. I think Kirk is having a super season. He's barely played an ordinary game all year - last week was his quietest second half in ages and was maybe down to the hit of the head on the cricket pitch - or possibly just the general lethargy of the Swans in the second half.

Micky O is exerting influence far wider across the ground than in past years.

O'Keefe I'd say is at about the same level.

And agree that Jolly has been hot and cold - though his "hot spots" in terms of around the ground influence have been so much better than anything last year that overall he's delivering a lot lot more.

The other key player neither of you mentioned was Goodes. Although the last month or so has seen him start to resemble the 2006 model, his best games this year have still only been at the level of his average games last year. If he can continue the upwards trajectory of his form improvement to the level we know he's capable of, that is one major reason to suggest the team can get better.

[swantastic]

Melchoeski is well in front of last year.That's the most sensible thing you have said all year NMW.;) He's that far in front,he is over taking him self.

[Young Blood]

IMO Bevan is just too much of a liability come finals time. His form has been good and he can be a great tagger but he has the potential to give away silly free kicks and/or make mistakes at crucial times which, when playing as a backman, can cost you a game. Dempster is more relaible, has better skills and can play on a medium sized or small forward option. He is a perfect replacement for Malceski or Kennelly when they need a rest.

I'm not sure these two are competing for the same position. Has Dempster ever played on the opposition's small forward? I much prefer Dempster as a player, but in the absence of Crouch I think we need Bevan in the team against most sides.

[NMWBloods]

I'm more with MMG on those particular players. I think Kirk is having a super season. He's barely played an ordinary game all year - last week was his quietest second half in ages and was maybe down to the hit of the head on the cricket pitch - or possibly just the general lethargy of the Swans in the second half.I think he was better in 2005 and 2006.


Micky O is exerting influence far wider across the ground than in past years.Maybe, but that's perhaps because the midfield is so down. Still, he's a forward and needed to kick goals and he's down in that area.


O'Keefe I'd say is at about the same level.Possibly.


And agree that Jolly has been hot and cold - though his "hot spots" in terms of around the ground influence have been so much better than anything last year that overall he's delivering a lot lot more.I think his form has been more extreme than in the past.


The other key player neither of you mentioned was Goodes. Although the last month or so has seen him start to resemble the 2006 model, his best games this year have still only been at the level of his average games last year. If he can continue the upwards trajectory of his form improvement to the level we know he's capable of, that is one major reason to suggest the team can get better.I deliberately didn't mention Goodes because although he's down on his 2006 form I think he's starting to show a bit more than 2005.

[NMWBloods]

Nothing like a bit of positivity...geez....no wonder I stopped posting here. Too many "I-like-to-call-myself-a-realist-but-really-I-am-an-angry-pessimist-who-loves-to-think-the-worst-because-the-suprise-in-things-turning-out-well-is-so-much-better-without-the-chance-that-I may-actually-be-dissappointed"

Longest name of a "type of person" ever...
So if we realistically don't think the side is as good as previously, and we have reasons why, we should still just say 'yes, we're looking great'...?

[connolly]

In your opinion, what is it?

Here's mine:

B: Ben Matthews, Leo Barry, Lewis Roberts-Thomson
HB: Tadhg Kennelly, Craig Bolton, Nick Malceski
C: Luke Ablett, Brett Kirk, Amon Buchanan
HF: Ryan O?Keefe, Michael O?Loughlin, Nic Fosdike
F: Adam Schneider, Barry Hall, Nick Davis
Foll: Darren Jolly, Jude Bolton, Adam Goodes
I/C: Peter Everitt, Jarrad McVeigh, Ted Richards, Sean Dempster

EMG: Tim Schmidt, Paul Bevan, Matthew Laidlaw

And I note:
- One of the best HB lines in the comp, great speed, skill and drive.
- One of the most potent F line in the comp when firing.
- One of best tap ruckman coming off the bench. Great tandem of Jolly and Everitt.
- Good medium-sized bodies off the bench and a vastly improved tagger (McVeigh) to relieve the likes of Ablett, Kirk and Matthews
- Richards over Schmidt on the basis of experience and flexibility. Richards can go forward or back while Schmidt merely provides another midfield option.
- IMO Bevan is just too much of a liability come finals time. His form has been good and he can be a great tagger but he has the potential to give away silly free kicks and/or make mistakes at crucial times which, when playing as a backman, can cost you a game. Dempster is more relaible, has better skills and can play on a medium sized or small forward option. He is a perfect replacement for Malceski or Kennelly when they need a rest.
- Laidlaw lacks game experience but come finals time you need runners so I'd rather him as an EMG over Grudy or Vogels. In any case, we have a number of guys in our starting 22 who can play F or B should we need to mix things up e.g. Richards, LRT, Goodes.

Thoughts?

Malceski gives away more free kicks than Bevo. Why on earth do Malceski and Kenneally need an interchange running back? They will be rested no more than 10 minutes per match. A luxury to have a replacement player for their interchange on the bench surely. Still the justifications for Bevos omission are become extremely weak. He has been in our best five players in the last two games and played well in the Subi pressure cooker. Why omit a player in his best form for two years?

[giant]

You are glowing of our half back line, forwards and ruckmen but glaring in their absense is our stellar midfield?? Perhaps therein lies the reason why we might struggle to win the flag.

Didn't hurt in 2005.

[reigning premier]

I don't think our team is as good as the previous two years.

Agree... BUT......

Hall is well down. No arguments here

O'Keefe is down a little. But still contributing

J Bolton is struggling badly. Yep. Needs to lift. Looked like he was improving last weekend against poor opposition

Kirk is down a little. Think he's going oK. Mainly because he's doing all the work he looks a little down

McVeigh well below his 2006 performance. Bet yo?r ass on that one. But maybe improving at the right time?

No Crouch. We do miss him

MOL is slightly down. Nope. Having his best season for a while. He's had to!

Buchanan has been down. Played very, very strongly on the weekend. Hope he's back!

Malceski is well in front of last year The only reason we've got as many wins as we have.

[NMWBloods]

I'd just note - when I say that certain players are down a little it doesn't mean they're not playing well, just that they're not playing as well as they were during some key stages in the past two years. Given how close the flag race is, if any critical players are down just a little from last year, that puts us behind relative to previous years.

As for MOL, his main job is to kick goals and that's well down. Possessions are much the same.

[hammo]

People are being very generous when they say O'Loughlin is performing better than in previous seasons.

I don't think an average of 1.7 goals per game is a good return for a full forward, whatever his influence across the ground. In 2005 he kicked 52 goals (averaging about 2 goals per game) so on that alone he's below previous seasons' output.

[liz]

Malceski is well in front of last year The only reason we've got as many wins as we have.

A big reason but not the only one. Spida's had a huge say in a couple of games that could have gone either way.

The ruck division as a whole is a mighty improvement on 2006 - and maybe modestly ahead of 2005. Jolly did a gallant job carrying the ruck almost on his own last season but gave us nothing around the ground. I don't think our current ruck duo is dominant at stoppages but both have been very important contributors right around the ground - and if Everitt's arrival has been a factor in helping Jolly become an all round better player, he's been a fantastic get.

[liz]

I don't think an average of 1.7 goals per game is a good return for a full forward

He's not really been playing as a FF though. Hall's been playing much closer to goal this season than in past ones - probably injury related. He's probably the closest we've had to a FF. Micky's role has been more akin to that which Davis generally plays.

[RogueSwan]

... He has been in our best five players in the last two games and played well in the Subi pressure cooker. Why omit a player in his best form for two years?
Take off the Bevan-coloured glasses Conolly.
Sure he has improved, but top five in the last two games? I s'pose we will have to wait until the TLM is compiled to see if that is the case. We all know the TLM is the bible.;)
Round 17: I would put:
B2 (surely he should be B1 by now), Schneiderman, Davis, B1, Captain, Hall, in front of Bevan. Even fossie and jolly could be argued as being better.

and against the hopeless Dees:
Schneider, Monty, Eski, pebbles, Spida, Goodes, fearless fosdike, .... then maybe Bevo in the lower reaches of the top ten if at all?