Bevan & Matthews

[Chilcott]

Both of these players are talked about alot on the forum.

Bevan could be OK if he stops turning the ball over at critical times. Also, he always seems to turn it over in the corridor where its easy for the opposition to score from it. I will give him credit for his tackles and he is a hard nut of sorts.

Matthews on the other hand is a donkey. What @@@@s me is the 'corale' he uses instead of 'aim at the hips' and tackle the player. He puts his hands up and stands a few metres off the player. The opposition player does not feel any pressure at all and just looks for a better option down the ground.

[BSA5]

Both of these players are talked about alot on the forum.

Bevan could be OK if he stops turning the ball over at critical times. Also, he always seems to turn it over in the corridor where its easy for the opposition to score from it. I will give him credit for his tackles and he is a hard nut of sorts.

Matthews on the other hand is a donkey. What @@@@s me is the 'corale' he uses instead of 'aim at the hips' and tackle the player. He puts his hands up and stands a few metres off the player. The opposition player does not feel any pressure at all and just looks for a better option down the ground.

I'm new to the forum and I noticed it as well, but I can't say I disagree with it.

Bevan is definitely a hardnut, but that's all he's got going for him. And often that goes against him, and he gives away stupid frees. He isn't particularly fast, he has very poor disposal skills, he has no footy brain, he isn't much use in aerial contests, and he doesn't pick up many possessions (though in fairness that is in part due to his defensive role).

Matthews, well, he wasn't always as bad as he has been recently. He's just getting old. It's time to bring in the new guys. He's never been in our top 15 or anything, but now I think he's genuinely dropped out of our best 22.

[goswannie14]

They should both be used for target practice at Pucka.;)

[reigning premier]

Every team needs a couple of donkeys. More over, they need a couple of guys that are going to sacrifice their game, put the saddle on an opponent and shut them down. No glory for them. No stats. And certainly no recognition of their efforts from the supports. That's what Bevan and Mathews do. And to a lesser extent, Crouch. They perform a nessecary, unappreciated task. They do their inglorious task with relative efficiency IMHO.

My point is, How people can sledge these two when we have the likes of McVeigh running around is beyond me???? McVeigh is supposed to be a "play maker" and "ball winner". When he starts doing his job as well as Bevan and Mathews do theirs, then we can start looking at others. Until then, let's just concentrate on where the problems are, not just where they are perceived to be.

[BSA5]

Every team needs a couple of donkeys. More over, they need a couple of guys that are going to sacrifice their game, put the saddle on an opponent and shut them down. No glory for them. No stats. And certainly no recognition of their efforts from the supports. That's what Bevan and Mathews do. And to a lesser extent, Crouch. They perform a nessecary, unappreciated task. They do their inglorious task with relative efficiency IMHO.

My point is, How people can sledge these two when we have the likes of McVeigh running around is beyond me???? McVeigh is supposed to be a "play maker" and "ball winner". When he starts doing his job as well as Bevan and Mathews do theirs, then we can start looking at others. Until then, let's just concentrate on where the problems are, not just where they are perceived to be.

But Bevan and Matthews don't do their jobs well. If they were good taggers then I'd have no problem at all with them, but they just aren't. It's no use tackling your opponent every time he gets the ball if more often than not you give them a free anyway (that's Bevan I'm talking about). The don't actually shut their opponents down. At least not as well as some players.

And I really don't see why people bash McVeigh. Sure, he isn't our number one midfielder, but he isn't a bad player by any means. His kicking lets him down too often, otherwise he would be a really good player, but as he is he's serviceable.

[AnnieH]

But Bevan and Matthews don't do their jobs well. If they were good taggers then I'd have no problem at all with them, but they just aren't. It's no use tackling your opponent every time he gets the ball if more often than not you give them a free anyway (that's Bevan I'm talking about). The don't actually shut their opponents down. At least not as well as some players.

And I really don't see why people bash McVeigh. Sure, he isn't our number one midfielder, but he isn't a bad player by any means. His kicking lets him down too often, otherwise he would be a really good player, but as he is he's serviceable.

McVeigh???? Surely you're talking about the one who plays for the Bombers?

McVeigh has been a waste of space for a long time now.
Bevan should have been dropped last year.
Matthews is a workhorse. His job is to stop the ball from going into the opponents forward 50. For a game plan that is created on stoppages, he does that well.

[gloveski]

give me Matthews anyday over Bevan

[BSA5]

McVeigh???? Surely you're talking about the one who plays for the Bombers?

McVeigh has been a waste of space for a long time now.
Bevan should have been dropped last year.
Matthews is a workhorse. His job is to stop the ball from going into the opponents forward 50. For a game plan that is created on stoppages, he does that well.

There is nothing wrong with McVeigh. Although I DO think he would be better suited somewhere in the forward line, rather than the midfield. His poor disposals would be less of a problem there. Sure, McVeigh isn't a star, but he's always been in our best 22. Not by a lot, sometimes only just, but I've never had a problem with him being selected over anybody else.

As for Matthews, I agree, he has done a good job for a long time, but he's getting old now, and less physical, and I think he's slipped outside our best 22.

[2005]

Paul Bevan is very frustrating to watch as he will do something well and than just have a brain explosion and destroy the ball.
Benny , the game has just got past him. He was never a star a honest toiler at best who got the most out of himself. He will be there abouts .
Every side has these blokes you hate & these are 2 guys that get targeted
the majority of the time.
I still rekon Roosy will stick fat with the senior group , though I hope the likes of Bevo & Benny are picked on form , not on past performances.

[TheGrimReaper]

Keiran Jack should take Paul Bevan's spot in the team as soon as possible.

[Robbo]

Keiran Jack should take Paul Bevan's spot in the team as soon as possible.

I wholeheartedly agree.

[BSA5]

Keiran Jack should take Paul Bevan's spot in the team as soon as possible.

Definitely. Let's see if Jack can succeed where Bevan failed.

[reigning premier]

Keiran Jack should take Paul Bevan's spot in the team as soon as possible.


I disagree.

Jack should be groomed as Benny's replacement next year. Yes get him in the team now if he fits, but in the longer term, for when Benny retires (Probably at season's end), he will be a great replacement.

[BSA5]

I disagree.

Jack should be groomed as Benny's replacement next year. Yes get him in the team now if he fits, but in the longer term, for when Benny retires (Probably at season's end), he will be a great replacement.

He'll fit in nicely this year in Bevan's old possie!

[Old Royboy]

I disagree with using Cracker as a small defender. In the ressies games in the first half of last year (when he dominated and earned his elevation) he was a midfielder. I was gobsmacked when he was elevated and sent to the back pocket where he was totally a fish out of water. As a midfielder he is good both inside and outside - good in the packs with quick hands, but also a good ball runner possessing both a swerve and sidestep. We saw the siidestep last week but like his Dad Jimmy he prefers the swerve. His disposal can let him down but compared to the likes of Bolton, McVeigh, Bevan and Mathews it is blue chip. Would those guys have had the nous and the skill to execute that pass to Nick Davis Cracker did last week? Countless times in the ressies I have seen him break free and kick long goals. A bloke with those attributes is wasted as a stopper. Cracker has more talent in his big toe than Mathews and Bevan. He and Dicky are the future of our midfield.

[Big Al]

They should both be used for target practice at Pucka.;)

Waste of tax payer funded ammo:p

[connolly]

But Bevan and Matthews don't do their jobs well. If they were good taggers then I'd have no problem at all with them, but they just aren't. It's no use tackling your opponent every time he gets the ball if more often than not you give them a free anyway (that's Bevan I'm talking about). The don't actually shut their opponents down. At least not as well as some players.

And I really don't see why people bash McVeigh. Sure, he isn't our number one midfielder, but he isn't a bad player by any means. His kicking lets him down too often, otherwise he would be a really good player, but as he is he's serviceable.

The stats make interesting comparisons. Bevo made 35 tackles last year and gave away 18 free kicks; Goodesy made 77 tackles and gave away 34 free kicks; (almost the same ratio of free kicks against to tackles) Big Barry made 21 tackles and gave away 41 free kicks (no comparison - much worse and he's a forward). I didn't bother looking up the comparative stats on Mc Veigh. I couldn't be arsed. He doesn't try, why should I.

[goswannie14]

Waste of tax payer funded ammo:pIt saves shooting those little yellow and black targets though.

[Nico]

The stats make interesting comparisons. Bevo made 35 tackles last year and gave away 18 free kicks; Goodesy made 77 tackles and gave away 34 free kicks; (almost the same ratio of free kicks against to tackles) Big Barry made 21 tackles and gave away 41 free kicks (no comparison - much worse and he's a forward). I didn't bother looking up the comparative stats on Mc Veigh. I couldn't be arsed. He doesn't try, why should I.


What that tells us is that Bevan doesn't make as many tackles as some people think. Main reason being he is slow and doesn't get to enough contests.

Spends a lot of time wandering around looking for his man.

Wh..wh...where did he go Doc.

[BSA5]

The stats make interesting comparisons. Bevo made 35 tackles last year and gave away 18 free kicks; Goodesy made 77 tackles and gave away 34 free kicks; (almost the same ratio of free kicks against to tackles) Big Barry made 21 tackles and gave away 41 free kicks (no comparison - much worse and he's a forward). I didn't bother looking up the comparative stats on Mc Veigh. I couldn't be arsed. He doesn't try, why should I.

Big Barry didn't give away his frees making tackles though, and neither did Goodes, and that is the issue we are talking about.

[ernie koala]

Bevan - out.....Jack - in
McVeigh - out....Bird - in
Mathews - out..... Anyone - in

[BSA5]

Bevan - out.....Jack - in
McVeigh - out....Bird - in
Mathews - out..... Anyone - in

Try:

Bevan - out....Jack - in
Matthews - out....Bird - in
McVeigh - moved forward
Grundy - out....White - in.

[Nolie]

Every team needs a couple of donkeys. More over, they need a couple of guys that are going to sacrifice their game, put the saddle on an opponent and shut them down. No glory for them. No stats. And certainly no recognition of their efforts from the supports. That's what Bevan and Mathews do. And to a lesser extent, Crouch. They perform a nessecary, unappreciated task. They do their inglorious task with relative efficiency IMHO.

My point is, How people can sledge these two when we have the likes of McVeigh running around is beyond me???? McVeigh is supposed to be a "play maker" and "ball winner". When he starts doing his job as well as Bevan and Mathews do theirs, then we can start looking at others. Until then, let's just concentrate on where the problems are, not just where they are perceived to be.

This is a very insightful well thought out post which gives a good bit of balance to the Bevan/Mathews bashers. This is why I love RWO. Well done.

[Legs Akimbo]

Analyse this...

Columns show:
% efficiency
% Standard deviation of efficiency (i.e. 2/3 of efficiency across games is +/-)
Contested possessions
Uncontested possessions
Total possessions
% contested


Villains % eff Std Con Unc TP %C

B. Mathews 77% 11% 81 223 304 27%
J. McVeigh 76% 9% 92 230 322 29%
J Bolton 74% 11% 201 223 424 47%
P.Bevan 83% 11% 55 151 206 27%
A. Buchanon 74% 10% 86 216 302 28%

Heroes

N. Malceski 83% 10% 95 344 439 22%
A. Goodes 74% 11% 195 264 459 42%
N. Davis 80% 9% 73 142 215 34%
T Kennelly 86% 9% 61 151 212 29%

Source: Herald Sun

P.S. what it doesn't tell you - game time, penetration of kicks, quality of uncontested possessions, creativity

[connolly]

Analyse this...

Columns show:
% efficiency
% Standard deviation of efficiency (i.e. 2/3 of efficiency across games is +/-)
Contested possessions
Uncontested possessions
Total possessions
% contested


Villains % eff Std Con Unc TP %C

B. Mathews 77% 11% 81 223 304 27%
J. McVeigh 76% 9% 92 230 322 29%
J Bolton 74% 11% 201 223 424 47%
P.Bevan 83% 11% 55 151 206 27%
A. Buchanon 74% 10% 86 216 302 28%

Heroes

N. Malceski 83% 10% 95 344 439 22%
A. Goodes 74% 11% 195 264 459 42%
N. Davis 80% 9% 73 142 215 34%
T Kennelly 86% 9% 61 151 212 29%

Source: Herald Sun

P.S. what it doesn't tell you - game time, penetration of kicks, quality of uncontested possessions, creativity

The Hun has Bevo's efficiency rating bang on with the Eski. Despite the fact its an awful rag on that point I'll rest my case.

[ScottH]

The Hun has Bevo's efficiency rating bang on with the Eski. Despite the fact its an awful rag on that point I'll rest my case.The stats are usually from Champion Data, so you can't blame the HS for that.

The fact that 3 of the 4 Heroes have a superb natural talent, it is always hard to compare these types with lesser players.

[Legs Akimbo]

Villains % eff Std Con Unc TP %C

B. Mathews 77% 11% 81 223 304 27%
J. McVeigh 76% 9% 92 230 322 29%
J Bolton 74% 11% 201 223 424 47%
P.Bevan 83% 11% 55 151 206 27%
A. Buchanon 74% 10% 86 216 302 28%

Heroes

N. Malceski 83% 10% 95 344 439 22%
A. Goodes 74% 11% 195 264 459 42%
N. Davis 80% 9% 73 142 215 34%
T Kennelly 86% 9% 61 151 212 29%

Assuming the data is correct...

Matthews: Can function effectively as a stopper (something not considered here), but for a guy enjoying 75% uncontested footy, screwing it up a quarte of the time and having too many bad days, is not good enough.

McVeigh: Slightly better than Mathews (and fair bit more consistent)

Bolton: The comparison against Goodes is interesting and remarkably similar. What is doesn't show is that goodes takes more contested marks, kicks more goals and more often sets up important passages of play (all anecdotal of course).

Bevan: Not as bad as many think, particularly his disposal, but considering his role, needs to win more contested footy.

Buchanan: Disposal a problem. Compare to Bolton. Winning half as much contested footy but making just as many mistakes. Not good enough and why I think he was dropped last year. I've said it before, his kicking technique is atrocious. Kicks the ball outside the line of his body to create angles, which can look dandy when it comes off, but very unreliable (try it and see).

Malceski: We are going to miss him heaps, particularly when you take into account his penetration. 83% hits the target and does so over distances the other guys cannot match. Let's hope Mattner can step up.

Davis: Quality. I think his key issue is he doesn't get enough of the ball / get to enough contests.

Kennelly: Incredible to think the guy with the most effective disposal, hadn't picked up a footy until he was an adult.

[NMWBloods]

Nice work Legs...

Bolton: The comparison against Goodes is interesting and remarkably similar. What is doesn't show is that goodes takes more contested marks, kicks more goals and more often sets up important passages of play (all anecdotal of course).Yes - the critical difference is that Goodes stuffs up trying to make things happen. That will happen but when it works he creates. Bolton rarely creates.


Bevan: Not as bad as many think, particularly his disposal, but considering his role, needs to win more contested footy.His high effectiveness more reflects that a lot of his disposals are dinky little 15m passes when in the clear.


Buchanan: Disposal a problem. Compare to Bolton. Winning half as much contested footy but making just as many mistakes. Not good enough and why I think he was dropped last year. I've said it before, his kicking technique is atrocious. Kicks the ball outside the line of his body to create angles, which can look dandy when it comes off, but very unreliable (try it and see).His disposal has always been an issue, especially when kicking for goals, but most times he makes up for that by being one of the most creative players in our team.


Malceski: We are going to miss him heaps, particularly when you take into account his penetration. 83% hits the target and does so over distances the other guys cannot match. Let's hope Mattner can step up.We will definitely miss him. I have no doubt Mattner can step up but the problem for us is we needed both of them.


Davis: Quality. I think his key issue is he doesn't get enough of the ball / get to enough contests.Yep, and it also shows how much contested ball he gets, contrary to many complaints about him laying back and looking for the easy disposal.


Kennelly: Incredible to think the guy with the most effective disposal, hadn't picked up a footy until he was an adult.We missed him a lot last year - hope his knee is right this year.

[ernie koala]

Try:

Bevan - out....Jack - in
Matthews - out....Bird - in
McVeigh - moved forward
Grundy - out....White - in.

I don't fancy Bird as a back pocket. He looks like a natural onballer. who rests in the forward pocket.
As for Mr McVeigh......he can't, or won't, tackle, he constantly turns the ball over. And he never ,ever, goes hard at the ball or the man....Which makes him.... a fabulous member of the 'fab trio'.:cool:

[BSA5]

I don't fancy Bird as a back pocket. He looks like a natural onballer. who rests in the forward pocket.

Sorry, I didn't mean Bird should be in the back pocket. Just that Matthews should go out, and Bird should come in.


As for Mr McVeigh......he can't, or won't, tackle, he constantly turns the ball over. And he never ,ever, goes hard at the ball or the man....Which makes him.... a fabulous member of the 'fab trio'.:cool:

McVeigh averages 2.3 tackles per game, respectable given his role. His disposal is poor, I'll give you that, but that problem would largely be negated by him playing in the pocket. And I don't think it's fair to say he never goes hard at the ball or the man. That isn't really his role. We have enough guys who do that, like Kirk, Ablett and Bolton. I say play him in the forward line, and see how he goes. One thing I've noticed about McVeigh, especially over 2007, was that whenever he moved forward he would almost invariably pop up and kick a goal, sometimes two. It didn't happen enough for my liking, but with Scheider gone that leaves a hole for McVeigh to fill.

[goswannie14]

McVeigh averages 2.3 tackles per game, respectable given his role. His disposal is poor, I'll give you that, but that problem would largely be negated by him playing in the pocket. And I don't think it's fair to say he never goes hard at the ball or the man. That isn't really his role. We have enough guys who do that, like Kirk, Ablett and Bolton. I say play him in the forward line, and see how he goes. One thing I've noticed about McVeigh, especially over 2007, was that whenever he moved forward he would almost invariably pop up and kick a goal, sometimes two. It didn't happen enough for my liking, but with Scheider gone that leaves a hole for McVeigh to fill.This is the most sensible post you have made yet BS.;)

Too many on this board want every player to be an in and under. As you said, we have enough of those type of players. We need those who can then receive it and do something with it. I'm not saying McVeigh is the complete answer, but that is the role that he should be, and usually is playing.

[BSA5]

This is the most sensible post you have made yet BS.;)

Too many on this board want every player to be an in and under. As you said, we have enough of those type of players. We need those who can then receive it and do something with it. I'm not saying McVeigh is the complete answer, but that is the role that he should be, and usually is playing.

Right. The problem is that as a midfielder, what he does with it usually requires good disposal. That isn't a strength of his. Therefore, he should play as a small forward. There, his poor disposal wouldn't be so much of a problem. McVeigh's low efficiency with his disposals is not really due to poor accuracy, but lack of penetration with his kicks. In other words, he kicks lollipops which put pressure on his teammates. You don't need penetration when kicking at goal. All you need is half-decent accuracy, and McVeigh can handle that.

[ernie koala]

Sorry, I didn't mean Bird should be in the back pocket. Just that Matthews should go out, and Bird should come in.



McVeigh averages 2.3 tackles per game, respectable given his role. His disposal is poor, I'll give you that, but that problem would largely be negated by him playing in the pocket. And I don't think it's fair to say he never goes hard at the ball or the man. That isn't really his role. We have enough guys who do that, like Kirk, Ablett and Bolton.with Scheider gone that leaves a hole for McVeigh to fill.

Those tackles will be standing over an already tackled player.:rolleyes: He tackles like a broken turnstyle.
Going hard at the ball, and hard at the man, is part of every players role , it does not necessarily mean being 'in and under'.
For example: Stuart Maxfield was hard at the ball and the man, he was not an 'in and under' player, he was a receiver who would go and get his own ball, or make the tackle, when the situation arose. To suggest that only 'in and under' players should be hard at it, is wrong. That sounds more like the toothless tigers philosophy.;)

[BSA5]

Those tackles will be standing over an already tackled player.:rolleyes: He tackles like a broken turnstyle.
Going hard at the ball, and hard at the man, is part of every players role , it does not necessarily mean being 'in and under'.
For example: Stuart Maxfield was hard at the ball and the man, he was not an 'in and under' player, he was a receiver who would go and get his own ball, or make the tackle, when the situation arose. To suggest that only 'in and under' players should be hard at it, is wrong. That sounds more like the toothless tigers philosophy.;)

Don't get me wrong, in an ideal world, every player would be hard at the man. All I'm saying is that given McVeigh's role, it isn't terrible. Yes, he could be harder at the ball and man, but the fact that he's not isn't as big a deal as it would be for some other players. See?

[connolly]

What that tells us is that Bevan doesn't make as many tackles as some people think. Main reason being he is slow and doesn't get to enough contests.

Spends a lot of time wandering around looking for his man.

Wh..wh...where did he go Doc.

Defenders tackle rates. Craig Bolton made 40 tackles (2007) at an average of 1.7 per game, Leaping made 40 at an average of 2.0, Eski made 60 at an average of 2.7 and Bevo made 40 at an average of 2.0. Benny made a staggering 69 tackles at an average of 2.9. Either perceptions or stastics lie.

[connolly]

Apologies my post was wrong. Bevo made 35 tackles at an average of 2.1 per game.

[Robbo]

We should give him a chance to improve those numbers. Send him to the Canberra amateurs to play against the teachers and corner store attendants.

[AnnieH]

Sorry, I didn't mean Bird should be in the back pocket. Just that Matthews should go out, and Bird should come in.



McVeigh averages 2.3 tackles per game, respectable given his role. His disposal is poor, I'll give you that, but that problem would largely be negated by him playing in the pocket. And I don't think it's fair to say he never goes hard at the ball or the man. That isn't really his role. We have enough guys who do that, like Kirk, Ablett and Bolton. I say play him in the forward line, and see how he goes. One thing I've noticed about McVeigh, especially over 2007, was that whenever he moved forward he would almost invariably pop up and kick a goal, sometimes two. It didn't happen enough for my liking, but with Scheider gone that leaves a hole for McVeigh to fill.


He seemed to play very well up forward against Port in the practice match.

[graemed]

Have enjoyed the debate especially those arguments backed by stats wrt the various "villians v heroes".

I realise that Malceski will be a loss but I feel that his role last year was exaggerated in importance due to the loss of Kennelly and LRT. Tadgh for his obvious ability to break lines feed off the football with intellegence and depth and be creative when the need demanded. LRT for the simple reason that it will release Craig Bolton to take on a similar role to Tadgh.

Mattner's inclusion is likely to more important to the midfield than defence and I think Roos plans to use him across the centre with him falling back in defence to generate a loose target.

Bevan is most effective when he has a licence to counterattack as he is a surprisingly accurate kick for goal. He is disciplined, hard at it and hard bodied. In finals these qualities cannot be undervalued. He will be under pressure to remain in the team but has performed well under similar pressure in the past, e.g. prelim final v St Kilda 2005.

Matthews has less speed, is prone to make poor decisions (slowly) and has significant disposal issues. He can "get the ball" but usually uncontested because oppposition teams do not usually mark him too closely which can be frustrating especially for swans supporters. I cannot believe that with the pressure from the younger crew he will maintain his place this year.

[BSA5]

Defenders tackle rates. Craig Bolton made 40 tackles (2007) at an average of 1.7 per game, Leaping made 40 at an average of 2.0, Eski made 60 at an average of 2.7 and Bevo made 40 at an average of 2.0. Benny made a staggering 69 tackles at an average of 2.9. Either perceptions or stastics lie.

Craig Bolton is a tall defender. He's a spoiler, not a tackler. Same with Leo. Malceski plays in defense, but he isn't a defender. You can't just group a bunch of players together because they play in a similar part of the ground. Bevan and Mathews are being paid to tackle. They should be up around 4 tackles a game at least.

[bennyfrou]

I think McVeigh should play the small forward role, but at which player's expense????

[BSA5]

I think McVeigh should play the small forward role, but at which player's expense????

Schneider's, of course. With Schneider no longer at the Swans, that leaves a space for McVeigh to slot in.

[Nico]

Have enjoyed the debate especially those arguments backed by stats wrt the various "villians v heroes".

I realise that Malceski will be a loss but I feel that his role last year was exaggerated in importance due to the loss of Kennelly and LRT. Tadhg for his obvious ability to break lines feed off the football with intellegence and depth and be creative when the need demanded. LRT for the simple reason that it will release Craig Bolton to take on a similar role to Tadhg.

Mattner's inclusion is likely to more important to the midfield than defence and I think Roos plans to use him across the centre with him falling back in defence to generate a loose target.

Bevan is most effective when he has a licence to counterattack as he is a surprisingly accurate kick for goal. He is disciplined, hard at it and hard bodied. In finals these qualities cannot be undervalued. He will be under pressure to remain in the team but has performed well under similar pressure in the past, e.g. prelim final v St Kilda 2005.

Matthews has less speed, is prone to make poor decisions (slowly) and has significant disposal issues. He can "get the ball" but usually uncontested because oppposition teams do not usually mark him too closely which can be frustrating especially for swans supporters. I cannot believe that with the pressure from the younger crew he will maintain his place this year.

Gee I must look at the 2005 Prelim again. Bevan was just awful from memory and that was when I decided, after a number of poor games leading up to that game, to jump right off him. I was stunned the next week when he got a game in the GF, and I recall many people saying he had to be luckiest bloke ever to hang a Premiership Medallion around his neck.

Duck.... here comes Connolly.

[573v30]

Put Bevan and Mathews in the Reserves. Anyone disagree?

[TheGrimReaper]

Agreed and promote D O'Keefe and Jack into the senior team.

[RogueSwan]

I was stunned the next week when he got a game in the GF, and I recall many people saying he had to be luckiest bloke ever to hang a Premiership Medallion around his neck.
My sentimonies exactly.

[goswannie14]

Gee I must look at the 2005 Prelim again. Bevan was just awful from memory and that was when I decided, after a number of poor games leading up to that game, to jump right off him. I was stunned the next week when he got a game in the GF, and I recall many people saying he had to be luckiest bloke ever to hang a Premiership Medallion around his neck.
Yep, hard to disagree with that comment.

[Claret]

Agreed and promote D O'Keefe and Jack into the senior team.

I think DOK is a fair way off senior footy at the moment.

[Jewels]

I think DOK is a fair way off senior footy at the moment.

Yep, got to agree here. For mine, he is the disappointment of the pre-season so far, I was hoping he would be further along than he is. This is not meant as a criticism of the kid, merely an observation.

[connolly]

Gee I must look at the 2005 Prelim again. Bevan was just awful from memory and that was when I decided, after a number of poor games leading up to that game, to jump right off him. I was stunned the next week when he got a game in the GF, and I recall many people saying he had to be luckiest bloke ever to hang a Premiership Medallion around his neck.

Duck.... here comes Connolly.

Well I have to agree that his 3 possessions are not burned in the memory but he did make 6 tackles. But Bevo's game in the Grand Final was very good. Did his job, placed tremendous pressure on his opponents (he played as a defensive midfielder) and had Chad "Lazarus" Fletcher having a good look over his shoulder. The comment re. "lucky" came from an old thug with an assault conviction, who gave away Craig Bolton and has no credibility.

[Nico]

Yep, got to agree here. For mine, he is the disappointment of the pre-season so far, I was hoping he would be further along than he is. This is not meant as a criticism of the kid, merely an observation.

Jewels, cut the young man some slack. He hardly played any footy last year and was a number 16 draft pick which in draft terms is not too shabby.

Give him a chance to find his feet.

[Nico]

Connolly you must go to sleep counting Bevos.

[2005]

Yep, got to agree here. For mine, he is the disappointment of the pre-season so far, I was hoping he would be further along than he is. This is not meant as a criticism of the kid, merely an observation.


A long way to go for DOK.
Agree I thought he would be further down the track as well
Hopefully will progress as the year rolls on.:confused:

[ernie koala]

Put Bevan and Mathews in the Reserves. Anyone disagree?

I disagree.......
Put all the 'fab trio' in the 2's; ie Bevan, Mathews and McVeigh.

[goswannie14]

I disagree.......
Put all the 'fab trio' in the 2's; ie Bevan, Mathews and McVeigh.
You left out Jude Bolton.

[LittleSchneider]

A long way to go for DOK.
Agree I thought he would be further down the track as well
Hopefully will progress as the year rolls on.:confused:

considering he was our top pick in a "super draft" he is terribly disappointing.

[TheGrimReaper]

considering he was our top pick in a "super draft" he is terribly disappointing.

He had injuries last season, so don't judge Danny O'Keefe too harshly. He is a star in the making and if he has an injury free run, will be a star for us.

You can't just judge a player from one season. :rolleyes:

[BSA5]

I disagree.......
Put all the 'fab trio' in the 2's; ie Bevan, Mathews and McVeigh.

McVeigh forward, not dropped!!!!!

[BSA5]

Some players seem to get lots of chances and others very few.

McVeigh has been moved forward before, with success. This isn't a matter of chances, this is a matter of common sense.

[smasher]

I agree that we must be patient with young DOK.He is still built like a kid and has a fair bit of development ahead.Some of the top blokes running around in the AFL took time to develop.I haven't given up on him,he's just treading water at this stage.

[BSA5]

I'm not disagreeing with him playing forward, just that some players get more chances.

Wait, so were you saying McVeigh hasn't had enough chances, and people are writing him off too quickly, or he's had too many?

[ScottH]

Wait, so were you saying McVeigh hasn't had enough chances, and people are writing him off too quickly, or he's had too many?The latter.

[BSA5]

He's had plenty of chances that other players don't get.

Not sure I agree with you there. He always shown enough to be selected, in my opinion.

[AnnieH]

Not sure I agree with you there. He always shown enough to be selected, in my opinion.

He shows enough on Thursday training to be selected.
Pity he doesn't "show" enough during game time.

[ernie koala]

Not sure I agree with you there. He always shown enough to be selected, in my opinion.

He's had 58 'chances' so far, for little result.:cool: