RIP Jesse White's Career

[Big Al]

My patience has run out I'm afraid. Usually he can be counted on to provide a decent contest even if he can't do much else. He couldn't even provide that tonight. I do wanted him to be the player the Swans needed but after countless opportunities he hasn't lived up to it.

If he's not in Ressies next week I'd be very very surprised.

[aardvark]

Doubled his possies this week, 4. only one less than Bevo.:eek:

[Bas]

No longer Great White Hope. I think he might be gone for next week and time to give L J a go. Time for his debut.

[Tooth Fairy]

Just dumbfounded. Can't say anymore othewise. If he gets a game next week I am truly gone. Well not really, but expect more swearing.

[liz]

Have to agree that he'll probably be needing an early alarm call next weekend. The most frustrating thing about him tonight (and on many occasions before) is that he seems happy to stand behind his opponent, hoping for the ball to be kicked over their heads so he can run onto it. It does come off every so often but it was never going to work tonight with a wet, heavy, slippery ball and soggy turf.

I would be delighted to see Lewis III get his chance next week, but he's a very different build to White, so people shouldn't hope he is going to come in and provide the physical presence up forward that we were all hoping White would learn to do.

[CureTheSane]

It's the tattoos.
Every bit of ink reduced his skills :)

I'd also say he's gone for a few weeks to build his confidence.
Sadly, I'm worried that it's not just confidence but a lack of skills of a football brain that are holding him back.
He'll be traded unles he is able to do something more for us, and I just know he'll be one of those players who shines at another club and everyone will be saying "what were the Swans thinking trading White?"

[giant]

Had hands like frying pans last night. As always, did some pretty good things in amongst the dross but needs to make a regular contest. Time to look at LJ I reckon.

[aardvark]

he'll be one of those players who shines at another club and everyone will be saying "what were the Swans thinking trading White?"

The players who come here from other clubs and do well are ones who never really had an opportunity at their original club. Jesse has had more chances than most and leopards never change their spots. He won't do well anywhere else at AFL level.

[Donners]

I don't get it. He has the pace and the size, and his kicking doesn't seem too bad, but he just goes missing. I'm always surprised when I look at the game time in the stats, because I can't believe he could be so invisible in all that time.

He might well become another Scott Stevens if we trade him, but he's not doing anything for Sydney.

[Dosser]

Have to agree that he'll probably be needing an early alarm call next weekend. The most frustrating thing about him tonight (and on many occasions before) is that he seems happy to stand behind his opponent, hoping for the ball to be kicked over their heads so he can run onto it. It does come off every so often but it was never going to work tonight with a wet, heavy, slippery ball and soggy turf.

I would be delighted to see Lewis III get his chance next week, but he's a very different build to White, so people shouldn't hope he is going to come in and provide the physical presence up forward that we were all hoping White would learn to do.

An interesting feature of last night's game was Mummy's impact when thrown forward - maybe this is the presence that would replace White if we rotated the rucks through ff?

[magic.merkin]

I just don't know anymore... Though 2 games of atrocious conditions doesn't pander to the bigger guys. But Mummy seemed to go alright.... understatement

[Cheer_Cheer]

I can't find words to express my disappointment with him. I think now is the time for the final role of the dice and try him down back and move Reid back into the forward line where he belongs. Or maybe put White on the wing and dump Jetta. At least White would be able to tackle.

[GongSwan]

I can't find words to express my disappointment with him. I think now is the time for the final role of the dice and try him down back and move Reid back into the forward line where he belongs. Or maybe put White on the wing and dump Jetta. At least White would be able to tackle.

I agree with putting white down back, we need a tall dowb there with a big body, I guess the question is, if he doesn't use that up forward, will he use it down back? Benny is the only foeward showing anything right now, but Bevo belongs in a pocket purely for the defensive pressure he puts on. Jetta is not suited to wet games, pace but no core strength to beak tackles and does not have the low down skills of a Judd. It's difficult to judge wet games like that, but really, by half time, we should have been far enough in front to hold them off, too many goals missed from very gettable shots. Also I've said it before and I'll say it again, put Mummy and Seaby on the ground and rotate them from ruck and forward line. Delist White, who would trade for him? and reallly, all this talk about our contested style of game, yep, u need to win the ball, but it seems to me our game is based more on free running gettting players into space, this does not work well in wet conditions

[dimelb]

Originally posted by Liz

I would be delighted to see Lewis III get his chance next week, but he's a very different build to White, so people shouldn't hope he is going to come in and provide the physical presence up forward that we were all hoping White would learn to do.
I think of Jetta as Lewis III as he is a later arrival; he certainly has a different build!
But I'd be happy to see Lewis II in the side, whether forward or back. They may cause confusion in opponents' minds if they rotate!

[CureTheSane]

He won't do well anywhere else at AFL level.

Maybe not


He might well become another Scott Stevens if we trade him

Maybe

[Peace]

drop him. soooooo unimpressed with his performance this year...

[gazza]

i agree jessie must go and take jetta and bevan with him.promote anyone who gives a genuine contest at the ball

[stellation]

Not going to give up hope yet.

[Cheer Squad]

i agree jessie must go and take jetta and bevan with him.promote anyone who gives a genuine contest at the ball

Jetta would be in line for the chop before either White or Bevan.

Both White and Bevan have scored handy goals for us on more than one occasion, but Jetta seems to still be trading on his performance in last year's NAB Cup match at Blacktown.

His speed is really not that useful to us on a small and congested ground like the SCG, although it comes in handy elsewhere. It's his accuracy that's the problem. Returns of 8.24 in 25 games overall (and 3.11 at the SCG) suggests he needs a fair bit of time in the reserves working on it.

[cruiser]

It seems to me from what I've read that a few of our younger players, the club's future, are down on form this season. Its not just White.

[ScottH]

To me he seems to lack a bit of footy nous.
When he gets the ball he's usually great, but he just doesn't seem to get it enough.
I know he has a basketball background. Did he grow up playing AFL?

Maybe he doesn't know where to go to get maximum ball.

[dimelb]

To me he seems to lack a bit of footy nous.
When he gets the ball he's usually great, but he just doesn't seem to get it enough.
I know he has a basketball background. Did he grow up playing AFL?

Maybe he doesn't know where to go to get maximum ball.
John Longmire, of all people, ought to be able to help him with this. Or maybe a spell in the twos beckons, under Henry's watchful eye; injury got in his way, but at least he could get the ball.

[magic.merkin]

i agree jessie must go and take jetta and bevan with him.promote anyone who gives a genuine contest at the ball

That suggests you don't think Bevan gives a genuine contest at the ball? That's his number 1 attribute for mine.

[Gezball]

Please Longmire... drop White and don't play Bevan anywhere but forward...

[Donners]

That suggests you don't think Bevan gives a genuine contest at the ball? That's his number 1 attribute for mine.

I always hear that about Bevan, but I don't see it in the games I watch or in the statistics.

It's interesting now that they collect "pressure stats", he seems to be quite unremarkable in an area one might have thought he would excel in.

He seems to be constantly behind or giving away frees in defence. Up forward, he at least manages to get space for an easy mark and a few goals, but also goes missing (though not nearly as badly as White).

Nobody could say he doesn't work hard, but I think his physical impact is overstated, and doesn't make up for his decision-making or skills.

[swansrule100]

give bevan one more go next week but never ever use him in the backline, just plonk him up forward. As for white, i dont think its career over, but he needs a kick up the rear and a confidence boost and he can bugger off to the ressies for a month or two and see how he goes. Lets see if players like johnson and currie can play, presuming they are fit, rather than give white 50 games. I most interested in seeing currie have a go. I know you cant hand out games, but surely white is not performing well enough to get a game right now.

[Jewels]

It's the tattoos.
Every bit of ink reduced his skills :)

I'd also say he's gone for a few weeks to build his confidence.
Sadly, I'm worried that it's not just confidence but a lack of skills of a football brain that are holding him back.
He'll be traded unles he is able to do something more for us, and I just know he'll be one of those players who shines at another club and everyone will be saying "what were the Swans thinking trading White?"
If he does excel at another club (which I highly doubt), then good luck to him but he's had more than his fair share of chances and surely the coaches are as over it as much as we are.


Had hands like frying pans last night. As always, did some pretty good things in amongst the dross but needs to make a regular contest. Time to look at LJ I reckon.
I didn't see them, just stuff up after stuff up, intertwined with strutting around like a peacock!

[rojo]

Speaking of Bevan, I have until now thought that his efforts in the forward line justify him a place in the team, when they play him there, but on Friday night I was really angry at his efforts in the last quarter down back. His pathetic handball that led to a Blues goal, followed by a couple of inept and ineffectual attempts to stop opposition players, were so much the opposite to what was needed, when most of the others were busting a gut - it was just inexplicable. Looking at the replay, his best effort was to run at a player, not to tackle, just run at him, one was Judd and of course he missed him and Judd goaled. If only he had dived to lay a tackle!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I wouldn't just drop him, I'd banish him to Siberia.

[bondy]

I was buying a poncho at Friday's game and the person before me bought a Jesse White badge. It was baffling.

[Cheer Squad]

Longmire seems to think that switching White back and forward between the forward line and the ruck is hindering his development as a forward:

AFL | Sydney Swans coach John Longmire tries to find best fit (http://www.smh.com.au/afl/afl-news/white-caught-in-the-middle-as-longmire-tries-to-find-best-fit-for-swans-20110501-1e375.html)

Perhaps ominously, he also uses the phrase "when or whether" in relation to Bradshaw's return.

[laughingnome]

Longmire seems to think that switching White back and forward between the forward line and the ruck is hindering his development as a forward.

Am I the only one that thinks the obvious call is to play Pyke (or Seaby) as a second ruck, White at FF and Mummy resting forward when not rucking? Reid at CHF (good hands, long kick), Goodes in the midfield with LRT (when fit, hopefully for the Paddle-aid game) and Grundy down back.

[Bas]

Am I the only one that thinks the obvious call is to play Pyke (or Seaby) as a second ruck, White at FF and Mummy resting forward when not rucking? Reid at CHF (good hands, long kick), Goodes in the midfield with LRT (when fit, hopefully for the Paddle-aid game) and Grundy down back.

Makes very good sense to me.

[Plugger46]

Am I the only one that thinks the obvious call is to play Pyke (or Seaby) as a second ruck, White at FF and Mummy resting forward when not rucking? Reid at CHF (good hands, long kick), Goodes in the midfield with LRT (when fit, hopefully for the Paddle-aid game) and Grundy down back.

I guess the problem is only having two runners on the bench, given the sub-rule. Probably makes us a bit slow and reduces our flexibility with the rotations.

[Margie]

Longmire seems to think that switching White back and forward between the forward line and the ruck is hindering his development as a forward:

AFL | Sydney Swans coach John Longmire tries to find best fit (http://www.smh.com.au/afl/afl-news/white-caught-in-the-middle-as-longmire-tries-to-find-best-fit-for-swans-20110501-1e375.html)

Perhaps ominously, he also uses the phrase "when or whether" in relation to Bradshaw's return.

He sounds very conservative in that article about making any changes.

[swansrule100]

longmire is very conservative in that report, if LRT played well and is important to our structure and we are losing why would he play reserves again?

[johnno]

As strange as this may sound....Jesse White NEEDS Daniel Bradshaw back in the side as soon as possible!!!!

Think about it people.

[liz]

longmire is very conservative in that report, if LRT played well and is important to our structure and we are losing why would he play reserves again?

LRT looked seriously short of a gallop on Friday afternoon. I wouldn't be surprised to see him play another couple of reserves games. They made Kennelly play three and have an intensive training bout over the bye and he hadn't been missing from the team for as long as LRT has.

[ugg]

Plus the Dogs won't have a tall forward setup on Saturday. We could easily cover them with Ted Reg and LJ (Yes, I'm pushing his case very hard!)

[Donners]

Longmire seems to think that switching White back and forward between the forward line and the ruck is hindering his development as a forward:

AFL | Sydney Swans coach John Longmire tries to find best fit (http://www.smh.com.au/afl/afl-news/white-caught-in-the-middle-as-longmire-tries-to-find-best-fit-for-swans-20110501-1e375.html)

Perhaps ominously, he also uses the phrase "when or whether" in relation to Bradshaw's return.


He's only had 12 hitouts in 6 games, so if he is spending any sort of time in the ruck (I really haven't seen him at many ruck contests), he's getting slaughtered. Pyke was there in the last game and White still went missing, and he's had five years on the list to develop as a forward.

[Plugger46]

I still reckon he'll be alright. Not doing enough at the moment but conditions in the last two games haven't exactly suited him.

[GongSwan]

Am I the only one that thinks the obvious call is to play Pyke (or Seaby) as a second ruck, White at FF and Mummy resting forward when not rucking? Reid at CHF (good hands, long kick), Goodes in the midfield with LRT (when fit, hopefully for the Paddle-aid game) and Grundy down back.

No you're not, I've been pushing this for a while now, (of course, I'm nobody, doesn't stop me having an opinion). I'd play Seaby, he played a fair bit of wing/forward at the Weagles, and is far more experienced than Pyke, much as I like Mike, I think Seaby would give more and would probably work harder to keep his spot in the team, given that he would replace White who would be pushing back for his spot, Bevan and Moore in the pockets, Reid at CHF, Okeefe and Shaw flanks. Shaw or TDL, Seaby out of the goalsquare, a ttracting a tall defender, if the bulldogs have LAke on Seaby who do they play on Reid? God I wish Eski was fit and LRT was back, that willl b a while tho, and their return will need to be staggered, so they aren't all buggered at the same time, I just hope we get some dry weather

[laughingnome]

Am I the only one that thinks the obvious call is to play Pyke (or Seaby) as a second ruck, White at FF and Mummy resting forward when not rucking? Reid at CHF (good hands, long kick), Goodes in the midfield with LRT (when fit, hopefully for the Paddle-aid game) and Grundy down back.

No you're not, I've been pushing this for a while now, (of course, I'm nobody, doesn't stop me having an opinion). I'd play Seaby, he played a fair bit of wing/forward at the Weagles, and is far more experienced than Pyke, much as I like Mike, I think Seaby would give more and would probably work harder to keep his spot in the team, given that he would replace White who would be pushing back for his spot, Bevan and Moore in the pockets, Reid at CHF, Okeefe and Shaw flanks. Shaw or TDL, Seaby out of the goalsquare, a ttracting a tall defender, if the bulldogs have LAke on Seaby who do they play on Reid? God I wish Eski was fit and LRT was back, that willl b a while tho, and their return will need to be staggered, so they aren't all buggered at the same time, I just hope we get some dry weather

I think there is room for both Pyke and White in the side (albeit a tall one), but Seaby is a straight-swap for White if Longmire wants to continue this charade of a FF who can ruck ~20% of the game.

[Jewels]

He's only had 12 hitouts in 6 games, so if he is spending any sort of time in the ruck (I really haven't seen him at many ruck contests), he's getting slaughtered. Pyke was there in the last game and White still went missing, and he's had five years on the list to develop as a forward.

Yep, spot on Donners. I've been a Jesse advocate up until now, but Friday was the last straw, the excuses have run out.

[JF_Bay22_SCG]

Am I the only one that thinks the obvious call is to play Pyke (or Seaby) as a second ruck, White at FF and Mummy resting forward when not rucking? Reid at CHF (good hands, long kick), Goodes in the midfield with LRT (when fit, hopefully for the Paddle-aid game) and Grundy down back.

Even in the wet? Horse learnt the hard way that playing two many talls on a wet track is tantamount to suicide. Pyke is a decent tap ruckman but his around the ground skills are still lacking. Mummy & Seebs as ruckman, with one resting in the forward line.

Regards of poor weather, is anyone alarmed that in at least 3 games this season we have already squandered decent leads.

As per White, I have always worried that as an athlete nabbed from basketball he lacks basic football skills. Reid is tall and gangly himself, but DOES have those skills. Teaching a player where to position himself is harder than you think if you aren't brought up with AFL. Ask K Hunt how he is finding it!

Sadly I feel the Swans themselves have help destroy White's confidence. Was was being earmarked as out tall leading forward by the end of Season 2009. Then we go & sign Bradshaw. We initially try to play them both in the team & it flops. Bradshaw gets injured & White's confidence is already shot as he knows he is number 2 in the pecking order. The impetus we made with him as a tall full forward was virtually lost.

I'm sure the Suns would be keen on taking him off us. But who'd we get of theirs who could help our team?

JF

[Big Al]

Sadly I feel the Swans themselves have help destroy White's confidence. Was was being earmarked as out tall leading forward by the end of Season 2009. Then we go & sign Bradshaw. We initially try to play them both in the team & it flops. Bradshaw gets injured & White's confidence is already shot as he knows he is number 2 in the pecking order. The impetus we made with him as a tall full forward was virtually lost.


If true he needs to get over himself pretty quickly and show some professionalism.

[swansrule100]

LRT looked seriously short of a gallop on Friday afternoon. I wouldn't be surprised to see him play another couple of reserves games. They made Kennelly play three and have an intensive training bout over the bye and he hadn't been missing from the team for as long as LRT has.

cheers makes more sense, only going by longmire saying he played well.

[liz]

I think there is room for both Pyke and White in the side (albeit a tall one), but Seaby is a straight-swap for White if Longmire wants to continue this charade of a FF who can ruck ~20% of the game.

I imagine Pyke was brought in with that role in mind and one game in the wet isn't sufficient to judge whether he is up for it or not. I realise that you can't easily translate reserves form into expectations of what a player will provide at senior level, but in the handful of games the two have played this year for the reserves, Pyke has been more effective in front of goal as well as better in the ruck. I am sure the coaching staff deliberated long and hard about the Pyke vs Seaby option, but once they plumped for Pyke it surely makes no sense to give up on him after just one game, especially in those conditions. Wouldn't it be better to give Pyke a few games and then if he is having no impact, give Seaby a go?

[swansrule100]

if white is dropped is there room for pyke seaby and mumford in the side?

[liz]

Why would you want all three? What we're missing is an effective target at FF. The ruckman is meant to be a second tall deep target when resting, not the main one unless they are really a forward who rucks a bit.

[juliec]

Jetta would be in line for the chop before either White or Bevan.

Both White and Bevan have scored handy goals for us on more than one occasion, but Jetta seems to still be trading on his performance in last year's NAB Cup match at Blacktown.

His speed is really not that useful to us on a small and congested ground like the SCG, although it comes in handy elsewhere. It's his accuracy that's the problem. Returns of 8.24 in 25 games overall (and 3.11 at the SCG) suggests he needs a fair bit of time in the reserves working on it.

I agree, I think Jetta should spend some time in the reserves, make him try a bit harder to get his spot back in the seniors, I think he got his spot in the seniors and just stayed there with what it seemed like a times with not too much effort, will do him good to stay down until he deserves his spot in the seniors back.

Just my thoughts

[johnno]

Even in the wet? Horse learnt the hard way that playing two many talls on a wet track is tantamount to suicide. Pyke is a decent tap ruckman but his around the ground skills are still lacking. Mummy & Seebs as ruckman, with one resting in the forward line.

Regards of poor weather, is anyone alarmed that in at least 3 games this season we have already squandered decent leads.

As per White, I have always worried that as an athlete nabbed from basketball he lacks basic football skills. Reid is tall and gangly himself, but DOES have those skills. Teaching a player where to position himself is harder than you think if you aren't brought up with AFL. Ask K Hunt how he is finding it!

Sadly I feel the Swans themselves have help destroy White's confidence. Was was being earmarked as out tall leading forward by the end of Season 2009. Then we go & sign Bradshaw. We initially try to play them both in the team & it flops. Bradshaw gets injured & White's confidence is already shot as he knows he is number 2 in the pecking order. The impetus we made with him as a tall full forward was virtually lost.

I'm sure the Suns would be keen on taking him off us. But who'd we get of theirs who could help our team?

JF

Sorry, but I disagree with comment about ruining Jesse White when we had both White and Bradshaw playing. I actually think White was playing some of his best football when Bradshaw was in the side.

[supersall]

Jesse plays well with TDL and Bradshaw in the side. It wasn't just White, all our forwards melted into the midfield on Friday. Ball came down aplenty, and nary a swan in sight.

[swansrule100]

Why would you want all three? What we're missing is an effective target at FF. The ruckman is meant to be a second tall deep target when resting, not the main one unless they are really a forward who rucks a bit.

i wouldnt want all 3 as lumbering ruckman, is one of them capable of taking whites role as a key forward target with the occasional chop out in the ruck as a 3rd option. I wouldnt of thought so, was just thinking outloud, well on my keyboard.

I wouldnt of put pyke in the other night in the first place. But now he is in i would leave him for a while.

How far is Currie off from playing seniors? will it ever happen? can he play whites role?

[Bleed Red Blood]

Even in the wet? Horse learnt the hard way that playing two many talls on a wet track is tantamount to suicide. Pyke is a decent tap ruckman but his around the ground skills are still lacking. Mummy & Seebs as ruckman, with one resting in the forward line.

Umm. So after 20+ years in football, Horse didn't know that about talls? Should we perhaps send a memo on the fundamentals of our game?