Essendon affair

[barry]

We might win by forfeit, if ASADA issues infraction notices this week as is being reported in the newspapers.

Essendon may not be able to find 22 clean players on their list.

[hot potato]

We might win by forfeit, if ASADA issues infraction notices this week as is being reported

Essendon may not be able to find 22 clean players on their list.

Interesting , but the actual banning of players (if ever) is still a very long way off.

[aardvark]

Whisper is Horse is scouting Bombers VFL tapes. If the AFL stands down players issued with please explain notices it won't be much of a game. I wonder if channel 7 would still bother to televise it?

[DK_]

Whisper is Horse is scouting Bombers VFL tapes. If the AFL stands down players issued with please explain notices it won't be much of a game. I wonder if channel 7 would still bother to televise it?

If that's true, it's probably because he's expecting changes to a side that could barely scratch together a win against the Brisbane beating boys.

There's not going to be any suspensions this week, just issuing of show cause notices, after which the players have a chance to respond before they are suspended.

Not sure that their mind will be on the game though when they've just been told that their career is over because their coach decided that he wanted to cheat.

Given that they competed well with the top sides in the first few weeks if the season, but now struggle to beat the rear guard, I suspect they know what's coming and there's some serious issues down at Windy Hill.

[Matt80]

If that's true, it's probably because he's expecting changes to a side that could barely scratch together a win against the Brisbane beating boys.

There's not going to be any suspensions this week, just issuing of show cause notices, after which the players have a chance to respond before they are suspended.

Not sure that their mind will be on the game though when they've just been told that their career is over because their coach decided that he wanted to cheat.

Given that they competed well with the top sides in the first few weeks if the season, but now struggle to beat the rear guard, I suspect they know what's coming and there's some serious issues down at Windy Hill.

I think Essondon fans would be disappointed in the words that you have chosen to describe their head coach.

Let the AFL and ASADA work through the whole process and then judgements can be made.

If the bombers end up having a large majority of their list suspended, can the Bombers sign extra players from state leagues so they can put a team on the field for the rest of the season?

[Matt79]

I think Essondon fans would be disappointed in the words that you have chosen to describe their head coach.

Let the AFL and ASADA work through the whole process and then judgements can be made.

If the bombers end up having a large majority of their list suspended, can the Bombers sign extra players from state leagues so they can put a team on the field for the rest of the season?

Even if the Bomber players are given "Show Cause" notices there is a lot of water to go under the bridge before players start missing games. The players can appeal to the Sport Tribunal and then the Federal Court. This all takes time in which the players could keep playing. It will be I suspect at least 18-24 months before any players actually start missing games for all of this.

[DK_]

I think Essondon fans would be disappointed in the words that you have chosen to describe their head coach.

Let the AFL and ASADA work through the whole process and then judgements can be made.

If the bombers end up having a large majority of their list suspended, can the Bombers sign extra players from state leagues so they can put a team on the field for the rest of the season?

I acknowledge that I am relying entirely on media reports for my information and that the media is often wrong. However, it is appearing increasingly unlikely that the Essendon football club will escape without further sanctions because of its supplements program.

Given that no one has suggested that anyone but the ex-head coach drove the supplements program, and he has been suspended for irregularities with it, I would think that Essendon fans would have good reason to be disappointed with their coach rather than anything I've got to say.

As Essendon are tanking now, our team is playing them this week and my comments aren't going to prejudice the proper process, I don't see the issue with discussing it now, including who was responsible and what that says about them.

Having said all that, I'm interested in what the AFL will do about one of their biggest teams being gutted to the point of not being capable of fielding a team. There could be a whole lot of delisted players being offered a second chance.

I also wonder whether and how teams that have traded in Essendon players will fare/be compensated given they have done nothing wrong. I think I recall there was a couple from last year's trade period.

[hot potato]

Even if the Bomber players are given "Show Cause" notices there is a lot of water to go under the bridge before players start missing games. The players can appeal to the Sport Tribunal and then the Federal Court. This all takes time in which the players could keep playing. It will be I suspect at least 18-24 months before any players actually start missing games for all of this.

Exactly, lots of chill time before anyone will be (if ever) missing games.

[Matt80]

Even if the Bomber players are given "Show Cause" notices there is a lot of water to go under the bridge before players start missing games. The players can appeal to the Sport Tribunal and then the Federal Court. This all takes time in which the players could keep playing. It will be I suspect at least 18-24 months before any players actually start missing games for all of this.

With all this pending legal action, who will pay for the legal defences? Will it be the individual players or the Essondon Football Club?

[Melbourne_Blood]

Surely Essendon will have to cough up, they are the employees and ought to be held responsible

[Matt80]

Surely Essendon will have to cough up, they are the employees and ought to be held responsible

Will Essendon be able to fund the individual defences of all their implicated players? Can someone with knowledge of the law give a cost estimation of defending most of their players in the Supreme Court?

[barry]

Interesting , but the actual banning of players (if ever) is still a very long way off.
I thought a ban came into effect as soon as the infraction notice was given. They then have to appeal if they want to play before two years are up.

[Matimbo]

I thought a ban came into effect as soon as the infraction notice was given. They then have to appeal if they want to play before two years are up.

The first step is ASADA issues "Show Cause" notices to each implicated player. Each player then has a deadline to respond stating their intention to defend. This deadline would have to be a minimum of 2-4 weeks but possibly longer. If no defence is raised by a player, I presume they then receive a ban soon after. If they do raise a defence, a legal process will follow before any ban can be applied.

The only thing that could happen in this process this week is the Show Cause notices being issued.

[aardvark]

On Sen today they were saying the indications are that the afl will "stand down" players issued with notices.

[dimelb]

A main thing that puzzles me about this affair is what response will ASADA make when a player says, "I asked the club doctor and he said it would be OK. I've done my due diligence. Are you seriously suggesting I should embark on a crash course in biochemistry?"

[Matt80]

On Sen today they were saying the indications are that the afl will "stand down" players issued with notices.

If that is the case, and the notices are issued before Thursday?s selection, will they have to forfeit the game on Friday night? You would assume that a huge part of their list would have been impacted by the program.

That will be a disaster for the AFL.

Will the AFL let Essendon sign temporary players from State Leagues so they can at least field a team, while this is being sorted.

[southsideswan]

It was reported that early last year the NRL investigated a contingency plan for Cronulla if a large number of players were unable to play. It involved all of the other Clubs "loaning" players for the season (s). Seems more like fantasy league then reality.

[Matimbo]

On Sen today they were saying the indications are that the afl will "stand down" players issued with notices.

Yes, that's possible. In a typical employer/employee issue, the employer can send the employee on some sort of leave while an issue gets dealt with e.g. a company wouldn't want an employee accused of assaulting a co-worker turning up for work in the interim. But I don't see this applying to Bombers players.

Then there is the instance of high profile cases where the person continuing in their position will be seen as damaging to the organisation e.g. the recent spate of NSW politicians standing down whilst corruption accusations get dealt with. However, in these cases it is the individual who decides (albeit under pressure from his political party) to stand down.

If the Bombers players and club execs opposed an AFL stand down order, the AFL would in effect be banning the players before they were given opportunity to defend themselves. This would put the AFL at risk of being sued by any player who successfully defends their charge. The AFL won't want to risk this ... but they also can't have a team playing that has a majority of players under a drug charge.

I'm thinking once again there is some heavy behind the scenes negotiations going on between the AFL and Bombers execs.

[Jewels]

David Zaharakis is going to be a busy boy!

[liz]

David Zaharakis is going to be a busy boy!

He'll have a few to share the workload with - Dustin Fletcher, Brendan Goddard, Joe Daniher

[Reggi]

It was reported that early last year the NRL investigated a contingency plan for Cronulla if a large number of players were unable to play. It involved all of the other Clubs "loaning" players for the season (s). Seems more like fantasy league then reality.

That would be the final straw. I would hate one of our own players.

Ot sure if we should give them Mitchell or Lloyd

[Mug Punter]

A main thing that puzzles me about this affair is what response will ASADA make when a player says, "I asked the club doctor and he said it would be OK. I've done my due diligence. Are you seriously suggesting I should embark on a crash course in biochemistry?"

It won't matter squat. The ASADA code is a code of strict liability - seems harsh but it has to be so to avoid "the dog ate my homework" excuses.

Of course the players in question will have one almighty legal claim upon their employer, Essendon Football Club and I suspect James Hird personally as those people have clearly breached their duty of care.

Time for His Smugness to face the music....

[Doctor J.]

Well it's about time, they've issued them
let the games begin, and the truth come out.
Wonder if Hird will bother coming back from France

[Ludwig]

It's hard to see how this will not end with a suspension of Essendon. I think the rules provide for that in the case of systematic doping. Dragging it out for another year or two will only turn the pain into a long torture. It's unfair to the Essendon players, those who received show cause notices and the others, to force them to endure an extended period of uncertainty.

The AFL should try to bring this to some conclusion this year and not allow it to drag into yet another season next year. The AFL should use this as an opportunity to fix a few problems. Essendon should be expelled from the competition. The Bulldogs and the Saints should merge and sent off to Tassie. Let's get back to a 16 team competition. The big problem is the TV deal and stadium agreements.

What a shame that this blight has to come at a time when the Swans are a major force in the competition. Wouldn't it be nicer if we could all have our focus on the footy?

[chalbilto]

It's hard to see how this will not end with a suspension of Essendon. I think the rules provide for that in the case of systematic doping. Dragging it out for another year or two will only turn the pain into a long torture. It's unfair to the Essendon players, those who received show cause notices and the others, to force them to endure an extended period of uncertainty.

The AFL should try to bring this to some conclusion this year and not allow it to drag into yet another season next year. The AFL should use this as an opportunity to fix a few problems. Essendon should be expelled from the competition. The Bulldogs and the Saints should merge and sent off to Tassie. Let's get back to a 16 team competition. The big problem is the TV deal and stadium agreements.

What a shame that this blight has to come at a time when the Swans are a major force in the competition. Wouldn't it be nicer if we could all have our focus on the footy?

Won't happen because of TV and stadium deals. After all of the COLA grief that Sydney have copped and innuendo regarding Buddy & Tippett, I am not unhappy that Essendon are in this predicament, it's a pity that it isn't Collingwood (because of Eddy!) . I feel sorry for the players as I believe that they were just doing what they were told to do and unwittingly they have, in all probability, ingested banned substances. The coaching staff are the ones who deserve the harshest retribution for what they allowed to occur.

[R-1]

Team sanctions including suspension or expulsion of teams is allowed but discretionary for sporting bodies under the WADA Code. If Essendon are punished further it'll be the usual range of fines, draft and premiership point penalties. They won't be treated like Festina.

[Ampersand]

Bit rich for Essendon FC to claim to be concerned for player welfare after they spent nearly 2 years injecting them with god knows what.

This latest legal action is nothin but a delaying tactic. If Essendon's lawyers had a legitimate issue with the legality of the joint ASADA-AFL investigation they would have challenged it last year well before the investigation even commenced.

Essendon FC have been punished but the players have not. They need to be. The last thing we want is to create an environment where athletes can claim plausible deniability about what is injected into their body and defer responsibility to coaching staff. A six month ban is more than fair. I feel sorry for them but their anger should be entirely directed at their coaching and administrative staff not at ASADA or the AFL. I guarantee all players in the AFL will be taking much more notice of what is put into their bodies over the next few decades as a result of this.

[dimelb]

This article by Brendan Schwab argues that Australian sport in general needs to cut loose from WADA, and specifically that the AFL needs to continue its focus on the club rather than the individual players. I'm inclined to agree, and I think the club made the wrong move in continuing Hird's salary at the same level as when he was coaching, when Hird seems to be the main one who drove the process. I'd be interested to see what others think.

Why Australian sports must cut ties with WADA (http://www.theage.com.au/sport/why-australian-sports-must-cut-ties-with-wada-20140615-zs8k1.html)

[Xie Shan]

Here is Martin Hardie's interview on the Today Show last week explaining the basis for Essendon's Federal Court challenge. Whether they are successful or not will depend on the evidence available, but either way it is going to be some time before this is resolved.

Martin Hardie on ASADA + AFL Today Show 13.6.14 - YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Og2toPu_jI&feature=youtu.be)

[stellation]

What I don't understand with all of this is simply how long it has all taken.

[ScottH]

I'd love to ask Ahmed Saad (http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/ahmed-saad-eyes-2015-afl-return-as-asada-loses-ban-appeal-20140528-zrr2o.html) what he thinks about all this.

[Plugger46]

What I don't understand with all of this is simply how long it has all taken.

ASADA is your answer. Appalling organisation.

[YvonneH]

Is it a coincidence that on Talking Footy last night Tim Watson said Justice Middleton's decision could come down this week (AFTER Essendon bowed out of the Finals) or am I reading too much into that?

Another conspiracy theory perhaps?

[ScottH]

Is it a coincidence that on Talking Footy last night Tim Watson said Justice Middleton's decision could come down this week (AFTER Essendon bowed out of the Finals) or am I reading too much into that?

Another conspiracy theory perhaps?

No.
Just "well timed"!!

[undy]

Hird and Essendon cases dismissed.

[CureTheSane]

They had better not be offered a 6 month deal again.
Perhaps 9 months now if they decide to take a deal. :)

[stellation]

I wonder if Ryan's manager is on the phone to the Bombers?

[ScottH]

We could be playing a VERY, Very weak Bombers side in Round 1 next year.

[barry]

Personally whilst I think drugs have no place in sport it's time for us to move past this episode in the games history. I do agree with roos that we shouldn't have a three strike policy but I don't think there is anything more to be gained by dragging on the essendon drama any longer

The issue has many folds.

Firstly an orchestrated program by the club which got a limp penalty by the AFL. Hird is still coach.
Then the lack of any penalty for players who allowed injecting of unknown substances into them, breaking every rule in the book.

But more importantly is the fact that essendon have shown how to get away with drugs... destroy the evidence. The matter goes away. AFL sanctioned cheating.

To "put it behind us", is to let the guilty walk free. I hope asada appeal, but if they dont it will only be because of lack of powers to gather evidence .

[barry]

Barry, now that our contract is at an end, there is no need for us to stick the boot into the craphole in Homebush.

There was a poor crowd. But I think more people boycotted the game because they only serve midstrength. You are flogging another one of your stable of dead horses.
The two issues are totally seperate.

But even i am suprised by the indifference to drug cheating on display at RWO, by some posters.

[AnnieH]

The two issues are totally seperate.

But even i am suprised by the indifference to drug cheating on display at RWO, by some posters.

Well, they actually haven't been charged with drug cheating, and until they actually are, you are making a mountain out of a molehill.
The verdict from the AFL was that there was not enough evidence... and every good lawyer knows, without evidence, you have nothing.

[Dosser]

The two issues are totally seperate.

But even i am suprised by the indifference to drug cheating on display at RWO, by some posters.

Nobody here is indifferent to it. It is just that by boycotting Swans games when we play them only makes the AFL think that the Swans cant pull a crowd, not that there is some sort of (extremely subtle) grass-roots movement.

[Ludwig]

But even i am suprised by the indifference to drug cheating on display at RWO, by some posters.

I don't think we are indifferent to the use of drugs in sport. I think we are just accepting the reality of the situation and what can be done within the current framework.

I would like to make several points about this issue:


Many Essendon players engaged in a program that almost certainly involved PEDs.
The players were duped by their employer to engage in this program, but should have been more diligent.
There was one person, Stephen Dank, primarily responsible for promoting this program.
Hird and several other Essendon employees were at the very least complicit in this program and have been found so and penalised.
Essendon have been penalised for this program, albeit perhaps not to the extent that many believe they deserved.
It was difficult for ASADA to make their case given that their 3 key witnesses could not be compelled to testify.
The players, although not suspended, have been traumatized by the length of the process, and will continue to be so, since they are not sure what drugs they were given.
It would be unfair to the competition, the Essendon players now on the club not involved in the drug program, the Essendon fans and others earning a livelihood through the Essendon FC to allow the actions of a few people, i.e. Dank, Hird and few others, to continue to bring the game into disrepute.*
Sometimes you just have to move on when you don't get your desired result.



* That role should be returned to Eddie McGuire, where it belongs.

[Matt80]

I had the opportunity to meet Hird and Tania at a corporate function years ago. He was terrific company and was interested in the people around him that he was speaking with. Tania was equally delightful. He was not arrogant at all.

I believe that like so many great people in life that Hird fell in with the wrong people. The situation reminds of a high achieving teenager who meets a new friend, who is a bad influence and ends up heavily dependent on recreational drugs.

Hird trusted Dank. He is an experienced sports Doctor. Doctors are the most trusted people in society. Why would you not have trusted Dank at the time? The results of the players were also impressive, which encouraged Hird to keep things going.

My heart went out to him when he was booed at ANZ. All people on Red and White have friends and family members who have fallen in with the wrong crowd with adverse consequences. I felt for him at a human level.

[dimelb]

Excellent summation Ludwig.

The only point where I differ is No. 2. It still seems to me that a footballer has the right to say to ASADA, "I'm not a biochemist and I'm certainly no expert on drugs, so I checked with the club doctor and got the OK." At that point he's done his due diligence and in my view the matter should then be taken up with the doctor, the coaches etc.

True, in other sports, notably (I think) in athletics, it seems the athlete is obliged to go a lot further. But as a footballer, if you're relying on the doctor and the club nutritionist, and avoiding illegal drugs of any description, that ought to be enough.

[Ludwig]

The only point where I differ is No. 2. It still seems to me that a footballer has the right to say to ASADA, "I'm not a biochemist and I'm certainly no expert on drugs, so I checked with the club doctor and got the OK." At that point he's done his due diligence and in my view the matter should then be taken up with the doctor, the coaches etc.

There are certainly mitigating circumstances when the coach and doctor say everything is WADA approved, but the players know that they are ultimately responsible for what goes into their bodies. Some of the particulars, like the program involving perhaps thousands of injections, going off-site to receive injections and the secrecy of the program should raise a few eyebrows, and perhaps it did, since not every player was on the program. This case should set the bar higher for what is due diligence for players if confronted with a similar situation.

The AFL has to comply with the WADA code if it wants to receive government subsidies. So if it takes the money, it has to agree to a sometimes harsh and strict code. But it is understandable that the WADA code is so strict, since most drug takers in sport get away with it. Keeping drugs out of sport is a very difficult task.

My understanding is that thymosin Beta 4 is not detectable with drug tests at the time and may still not be tested for, so no one will test positive and therefore only a circumstantial case can be pursued. And this makes it all that much more difficult to enforce a drug code.

[goswannies]

I believe that like so many great people in life that Hird fell in with the wrong people. The situation reminds of a high achieving teenager who meets a new friend, who is a bad influence and ends up heavily dependent on recreational drugs.

Hird trusted Dank. He is an experienced sports Doctor. Doctors are the most trusted people in society. Why would you not have trusted Dank at the time? The results of the players were also impressive, which encouraged Hird to keep things going.


You wouldn't trust Mr Dank because he is, in fact, not a doctor. Never was. Never will be. He has no sports doctoral qualification (either medically or philosophically). A quick fact check - or even paying any vague attention to the media over the last two years, would tell you he is a biochemist or sports scientist (depending on which articles you read - or perhaps didn't, in your case)... with questionable qualifications at that. What is currently understood about Mr Dank's qualifications are:

- he's got a physiology or pharmacology degree (they don't even seem to know this for sure)

- he claims to have a degree in biochemistry from the Queensland University of Technology,

- Me Dank was a PhD candidate (but it was suspended last year) at the University of Sydney for a thesis on antioxidants. FYI this is the wrong sort of doctor for administering drugs!

- it is believed Dank undertook a Masters degree in sports science at the University of NSW in the mid 1990s, but it is unclear whether he graduated. UniNSW, in fact, have no record of him graduating

Defending James Hird based on a one off encounter (when you would expect him to be on good behaviour) is one thing, but at least have accurate facts in your defence please.

A rogue "scientist" is not one of the most trusted people in society.

[Ludwig]

I had the opportunity to meet Hird and Tania at a corporate function years ago.

I believe that like so many great people in life that Hird fell in with the wrong people.


James and Tania must have been captivated by the depth of your football knowledge. It must have been difficult to drag themselves away from you.

Unfortunately, like Hirdy, you seem to have have fallen in with the wrong people, like the RWO gang, who are too dumb to appreciate the kind of innovative thinking that could take the Swans to another premiership, whatever it takes.

[barry]

I dont feel sorry for the players at all. They took injected drugs. They were , quite rightly, suspects.

Unless ASADA appeal, the only closure will be when the 34 players and hird retire.

What changes have the AFL made such that prosecution is easier next time ?. Nothing. What has the government done to give ASADA the powers it needs to go after non detectable drugs?. Nothing.

If anything, their are calls to water down ASADAs power. The drug cheats have won.

[Mel_C]

My heart went out to him when he was booed at ANZ. All people on Red and White have friends and family members who have fallen in with the wrong crowd with adverse consequences. I felt for him at a human level.

Sorry but I have no sympathy for Hird. He took no responsibility and he made the situation all about him.

He took the AFL and ASADA to court not because of essendon's "innocence" but because the investigation was supposedly unlawful.

What gets me is that if you were running a legitimate supplements program wouldn't you want to know what each player was given and how much so that you could determine what worked and what didn't??

I have no issue with the swans supporters booing him. Just wait and see what happens this week against the hawks!

[Conor_Dillon]

Sorry but I have no sympathy for Hird. He took no responsibility and he made the situation all about him.

He took the AFL and ASADA to court not because of essendon's "innocence" but because the investigation was supposedly unlawful.

What gets me is that if you were running a legitimate supplements program wouldn't you want to know what each player was given and how much so that you could determine what worked and what didn't??

I have no issue with the swans supporters booing him. Just wait and see what happens this week against the hawks!

Agree whole heartedly...the way he handled himself throughout the entire ordeal was abhorrent, I would have been incredibly embarassed to call myself an Essendon supporter. For what it's worth, Paul Little was equally as bad.

[barry]

Move discussion to a board no one reads = kill discussion .

[Big Al]

Agree whole heartedly...the way he handled himself throughout the entire ordeal was abhorrent, I would have been incredibly embarassed to call myself an Essendon supporter. For what it's worth, Paul Little was equally as bad.

If a manager at my work over saw a program that brought ridicule and embarrassment to my employer he'd be out the door quicker than an Eddie Maguire sprint to to a microphone to denounce the Swans.

In the AFL you get a 12 month holiday in France and you keep your job.

This should be a "Seems Legit" Meme.

[unconfuseme]

The ones who should really be crucified over this were losers anyway ... Julia and her dog - YES YOU JASON CLARE! :p

In their desperate bid to deflect attention from their dysfunctional government, they only managed to derail ASADA's investigations.

Absolutely pathetic, shameful and Un-Australian.

We all know the answers to this sordid affair ... when it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck, it's a f&$3#ng duck folks!:idea:

[AnnieH]

I had the opportunity to meet Hird and Tania at a corporate function years ago. He was terrific company and was interested in the people around him that he was speaking with. Tania was equally delightful. He was not arrogant at all.

I believe that like so many great people in life that Hird fell in with the wrong people. The situation reminds of a high achieving teenager who meets a new friend, who is a bad influence and ends up heavily dependent on recreational drugs.

Hird trusted Dank. He is an experienced sports Doctor. Doctors are the most trusted people in society. Why would you not have trusted Dank at the time? The results of the players were also impressive, which encouraged Hird to keep things going.

My heart went out to him when he was booed at ANZ. All people on Red and White have friends and family members who have fallen in with the wrong crowd with adverse consequences. I felt for him at a human level.

La la land must be a nice place to live.
Are the houses there expensive?

Two facts:

Dank is NOT a doctor; and Hird is a turd.

He got booed because he allowed YOUNG MEN in his care to be injected with god knows what.
I can't wait till these boys grow a third boob... just so you can see that this whole exercise was wrong to begin with.
I'm peeling the potatoes to make the fries to eat with your words.

[Matt80]

La la land must be a nice place to live.
Are the houses there expensive?

Two facts:

Dank is NOT a doctor; and Hird is a turd.

He got booed because he allowed YOUNG MEN in his care to be injected with god knows what.
I can't wait till these boys grow a third boob... just so you can see that this whole exercise was wrong to begin with.
I'm peeling the potatoes to make the fries to eat with your words.

Your a Swans cheer squad member and I'm a Swans member.

We have a common interest that we are both passionate about. Can you try to be a little more positive towards me? We are on the same team!

[Big Al]

Your a Swans cheer squad member and I'm a Swans member.

We have a common interest that we are both passionate about. Can you try to be a little more positive towards me? We are on the same team!

Then stop writing bull@@@@.

Hird was in charge of a programme that brought shame and ridicule on his employers and endangered the health of the people he was in charge of. No where else in society would you see someone keep their jobs in those circumstances.

BTW: Annie is actually the Matriarch of the Brewongle glitterati. I assume the banner thing in Adelaide was Annie storming the ground with security too scared to stop her.

[Matt80]

Good to know. I sit in the Brewongle as well.

[AnnieH]

Your a Swans cheer squad member and I'm a Swans member.

We have a common interest that we are both passionate about. Can you try to be a little more positive towards me? We are on the same team!

I'm a redback member; and a regular premium member.
I put more money where my mouth is.

[Big Al]

I'm a redback member; and a regular premium member.
I put more money where my mouth is.

Not to mention a fair bit of scotch on game day. [emoji3][emoji3]

[AnnieH]

Not to mention a fair bit of scotch on game day. [emoji3][emoji3]

I can do a fair bit of scotch off game day as well.
Mmmmmmmmmm. Scotch.

- - - Updated - - -


Your a Swans cheer squad member and I'm a Swans member.

We have a common interest that we are both passionate about. Can you try to be a little more positive towards me? We are on the same team!

*You're.
(Grammar and spelling are very important in a chat room.)

[ScottH]

Good to know. I sit in the Brewongle as well.

Then you have probably heard her!!!

[AnnieH]

Then you have probably heard her!!!

You're funny.
The players can hear me on the ground!!

[Matt80]

You're funny.
The players can hear me on the ground!!

Ha Ha. My four year old will copy whatever you yell out. Are you in the grandstand or down at ground level?

In his first game he was yelling "come on Heeney" at the top of his voice when the crowd was silent. I did not know where to look. He easily recognises that blond hair of Heeney. Heeney should be introduced into the Game of Thrones series as a distant Targaryen relative.

[CureTheSane]

*You're.
(Grammar and spelling are very important in a chat room.)

I think so to

[Big Al]

I think so to

Lol

[Meg]

Lol

Lolly.

[AnnieH]

I think so to

You kill me CTS.

[CureTheSane]

You kill me CTS.

I guess you can call me KT then :)

[unconfuseme]

Cookies must be enabled. | The Australian (http://www.theaustralian.com.au/sport/afl/stephen-dank-guilty-of-charges-relating-to-bombers-supplements/story-fnca0u4y-1227308309517)

�The tribunal has found that the former Essendon support person (Dank) has been found guilty of 10 breaches of the AFL anti-doping code,� the league said in a statement.

�The breaches include trafficking, attempting to traffic and complicity in matters related to a range of prohibited substances.� Dank was accused of being the architect of the supplements program and overseeing what substances the players took.


WHAT?

So what did Essendon do with the prohibited substances if they didn't inject any of the @@@@ into any of the players ....???:rofl

[Mug Punter]

I'm also struggling to find how Dand can be banned but Hird and the bombers are let off

Talk about turkeys voting for Xmas....

[AnnieH]

It's just outrageous.
Hird the Turd should have been sacked.

[Mel_C]

ASADA have decided not to appeal the ruling by the AFL. Will be interesting to see what WADA do. I'm sure they are not impressed with how the whole situation has played out.

[Untamed Snark]

Doubt anyone is-other than Hird's lawyers

[Mug Punter]

ASADA have decided not to appeal the ruling by the AFL. Will be interesting to see what WADA do. I'm sure they are not impressed with how the whole situation has played out.

I read that WADA don't like backing losing horses and that apparently, incredible as it is to believe, the legal rationale for the decision of innocence against the Bombers is apparently pretty much bomb-proof.

So in the absence of Dank chirping (unlikely) or a player breaking ranks (extremely unlikely) then I'd say the case is closed. Probably for the best really, I'm thoroughly sick of the entire affair

[CureTheSane]

Dank will do something when he wants his face on TV again. Mr.Wild Card