What was wrong with the IR team?

[swan_song]

Apart from Nathan Brown...well, the less said the better. What was wrong with it? Personally I think there were too many Sainters and Bummers in it...DalSanto, Aussie Jones, Reivolt...Hird, McPhee, Solomon... that's almost half the damn team from two clubs...
Did we take it seriously enough? Or indeed, should we take it seriously at all. For me, I don't mind the game...it's nothing special, but it has something. Its detractors call it a hybrid of course and laugh at it. But hey, when a schoolkid picked the real football up off the ground and stuffed it under his shirt at rugby school and scooted down to a goal, that was a hybrid game too. Things can develop...

[Sanecow]

I blame the coach and selectors mainly. Plus I believe the fifth pint was dodgy, as it often is.

[The Boot]

And was it true that Jack Love gave the prematch address?
:D :p

[swansrule100]

its a rubbish series that is going to die soon enough i think

i like the idea in theory but to me it just isnt working

[ScottH]

Maybe they should use an oval ball????

They have never been able to kick the round one like the Irish do.

[Sanecow]

If we played the Irish game with an oval ball it would be closer I reckon.

[JF_Bay22_SCG]

Originally posted by swansrule100
its a rubbish series that is going to die soon enough i think

i like the idea in theory but to me it just isnt working

But why isn't it working? Because the Australians, at least during the 1st match, were decided half-arsed about it. And played as if they had no idea about the rules and the usage of the round ball. Kicking out from fullback/goalkeeper both short and towards the boundary line is tantamount to footballing suicide in IR. There are no boundary umpires to through the ball in unbiasedly. Most of Ireland 3 pointers in the 1st test were from stuff-ups the Aussies made trying to play it defensively toward the boundary.

But when you get professional footballers worried about injuries playing against butchers and greengrocers playing out of their skin to repesent not only their country but its unique proud keltic culture, you get results like the ones we saw in Ireland.

What is the answer, I don't know. I'm sure some AFL clubs were rather unenthusiastic about their players playing in it. And at probably the worst time of the year for us, it is highly debatable as to whether any Aussie players had trained on since the end of the AFL season, let alone with a round ball.

I like the concept. And along with several others are dead set keen to try and get an official Australian Cheer Squad going next year with supporters of all the other AFL clubs cheering their country side by side. I'll be at the Melbourne match next year for sure, hopefully with several others from Sydney!

It is not in Ireland where the biggest changes need to be made. It is in our own backyard.

International Rules WILL work, but only if WE want it to!

JF

[Glenn]

As you say the main reason it doesnt work (apart from the timing), clubs are unwilling to risk players, unfortunatly the clubs/players have to realise, if they don't play the nest available team and take it seriously (ie training), the game is going to wither on the vine at a intenational level (if it hasn't already)

[liz]

From some of the comments here you would think that the Irish team has established a dominance that has extended over several seasons. Sure, they won both matches here convincingly, and the first test was the least competitive game since the genre was reborn, but the Australians had won the past two series and previous ones had all been close. That indicates that the handicaps that each side faces are relatively even.

The Australian team probably does need a few more of its "stars" to play, and in particular needs greater continuity from one year to the next so that players start to get the hang of the skills required (ala Nathan Brown) but the concept is far from dead on the basis of one poor and one mediocre Australian showing.

Changing tack a bit - it was good to see Kennelly showing his wares at this level. He was very impressive last night, switching from defence to attack and back again.

[swansrule100]

Originally posted by JF_Bay22_SCG


International Rules WILL work, but only if WE want it to!



the players have to want it too as well

[satchmopugdog]

Liz
I agree with your assessmant of Tadgh's game. He was just about impassable in the third quarter,except when he got the giggles going up for a ball against Kirk.
Craig Bolton was much better this game. His delivery was more accurate and he used space better.
Brett Kirk did a good defensive job as well and hardly wasted the ball.
But the highlight for the Swans players was Jude playing the ball along the sideline trying not to get his fingers bitten off by the dog. It reminded me of that movie "Shakespeare in Love" where someone says during the fight scene "..and there's a dog." the play is complete.
All the dog needed was a 4 on one side and Plugger on the other and history was nearly repeating itself. It was so farsical it was hilarious.

[ScottH]

Originally posted by satchmopugdog
All the dog needed was a 4 on one side and Plugger on the other and history was nearly repeating itself. It was so farsical it was hilarious. I thought Akermanis ahd lost his jumper!!!

[cruiser]

The series should be dumped. Its a complete waste of time and there is very little real interest in it here. The behaviour of the Irish media and some fans was a disgrace, especially for a supposed "friendly". They don't deserve to have our almost best playing over there. Nor is the series worth the risk of injury to our players. As for the dog, why the @@@@@@ didnt they stop play to remove it from the field? What a joke.

I'm off to the beach for the next four months.

[Margie]

I enjoyed the second game more than the first, though it's obvious the Irish soccer skills and round ball come into play a lot. They also go direct through the middle, whereas we play out wide and over utilise the wings.

We could do with continuity of players, but I guess there are always going to be more available when it's played here than over there. Nathan Brown is the only real standout this time around and it would be interesting to see players like the Burgoyne brothers or a few more with soccer backgrounds being selected.

[Damien]

I am not in favour of this series at all, it is not Aussie Rules, and the pinacle to me is a Grand Final...I would suggest bringing back a full State of Origin Series in October with each state being involved....however that is unlikely of course......

If they want to get the best players involved each time - why not make it every two years and turn it into more of an event?.

That way if players are selected to tour Ireland - it is a once in a 4 year opportunity and the players would be perhaps more likely to take up the opporunity instead of 17 players pulling out which makes it a farce.

But I am afraid while it remains Aussie Rules players using a soccer ball, the interest in Australia is simply not going to be any bigger than a casual interest from most people, and of course novelty factors and end of season boredom probably helps add a bit of interest to the Australian based games.

[JF_Bay22_SCG]

Originally posted by Margie
I enjoyed the second game more than the first, though it's obvious the Irish soccer skills and round ball come into play a lot. They also go direct through the middle, whereas we play out wide and over utilise the wings.

We could do with continuity of players, but I guess there are always going to be more available when it's played here than over there. Nathan Brown is the only real standout this time around and it would be interesting to see players like the Burgoyne brothers or a few more with soccer backgrounds being selected.

I enjoyeed the second game. Being both a footy AND soccer fan, I like International Rules. It is strange, it is new, it is a look outside the little goalfish bowl that is Australian Rules football. I find the whole concept of it enticing mystifying, even if with an oblong field we are obviously at a huge disadvantage. (Especially if we have defenders playing towards the boundary lines leading to us losing the ball, as they would do in the AFL-I reckon they badly need boundary umpies so that ruckmen become more a part of game. )

I am appalled at the sense of small-minded apathy in the majority of posters both on Big Footy and unfortunately here on RWO. It was this kind of attitude that basically killed State of Origin. The way it is going it will kill IR as well. What is it with the majority southern staters. It is as if "it isn't footy and doesn't involve my club, so why should I give a crap?"

So what if it is played with a gaelic ball; does that suddenly render the sport a dud as a result. The matches have drawn over 200000 spectators in both Australia and Ireland over the last 2 season; is that not good?

I know as a fact that not only Peter but Benny_w and Beaussie are fulkly into the IR serie. We intend to get an official Australian Cheer Squad going for next season. I will be approaching the AFL Cheer Squads League shortly about this. The atmosphere will be awesome, especially competing against the drunk Paddies singing their songs.

It is at the end of the season. It is a bit different. It is getting 60000 crowds to matches. I say, keep playing it.

But PLEASE take it seriously. That means playing your Simon Blacks, your Akermanis, your Stewart Dews. The team we had was basically a C team. No offense to Craig Bolton, but players of his calibre should NOT be playing for any sort of Australian national team.

JF

[David Votoupal]

Originally posted by JF_Bay22_SCG

I am appalled at the sense of small-minded apathy in the majority of posters both on Big Footy and unfortunately here on RWO. It was this kind of attitude that basically killed State of Origin. The way it is going it will kill IR as well. What is it with the majority southern staters. It is as if "it isn't footy and doesn't involve my club, so why should I give a crap?"

So what if it is played with a gaelic ball; does that suddenly render the sport a dud as a result. The matches have drawn over 200000 spectators in both Australia and Ireland over the last 2 season; is that not good?
[/B]

Difference being that State of Origin is firmly rooted in football tradition. I think it's just that people don't see much point in this, because Aussie Rules footballers traditionally aren't accustomed to representing their country and their are other sports which fill the international dimension lacking in Aussie Rules.

[cruiser]

Originally posted by JF_Bay22_SCG
I am appalled at the sense of small-minded apathy in the majority of posters both on Big Footy and unfortunately here on RWO. It was this kind of attitude that basically killed State of Origin. JF
Why resort to insulting people (in this instance, calling people such as myself small minded) when you disagree with them? Play the ball and not the man!

[JF_Bay22_SCG]

Originally posted by cruiser
Why resort to insulting people (in this instance, calling people such as myself small minded) when you disagree with them? Play the ball and not the man!

I am just seeing all this constant negatively. With people coming up with classic lines like "well it isn't our game, so why should we play it."

I didn't single you out Cruiser. I just wished to comment on what you said.

I just have a huge problem with people who refuse to get stirred up by supporting their country in action. Are AFL club supporters so ignorant to how good it feels to sing "advance Australia Fair" with the next person on foreign soil. I guess they are, because they KNOW NO DIFFERENT! :-(

But hey, people like me who CHOSE to watch AFL footy as wekll as other sports seem to accept that sports are not etched in stone.

JF

[swansrule100]

Originally posted by JF_Bay22_SCG
I am just seeing all this constant negatively. With people coming up with classic lines like "well it isn't our game, so why should we play it."

I didn't single you out Cruiser. I just wished to comment on what you said.

I just have a huge problem with people who refuse to get stirred up by supporting their country in action. Are AFL club supporters so ignorant to how good it feels to sing "advance Australia Fair" with the next person on foreign soil. I guess they are, because they KNOW NO DIFFERENT! :-(

But hey, people like me who CHOSE to watch AFL footy as wekll as other sports seem to accept that sports are not etched in stone.

JF



hmmm so if people dont agree with you they are wrong and un patriotic???

so if Australia enter the skipping championships or nose picking world cup we should automatically think its great???

[NMWBloods]

Originally posted by JF_Bay22_SCG
What is it with the majority southern staters. It is as if "it isn't footy and doesn't involve my club, so why should I give a crap?"

It's not 'as if' that - it is that! Who cares about some crap hybrid game. That's it representing Australia means nothing - do people have to follow Australian teams in absolutely everything they compete in?

[monopoly19]

Originally posted by NMWBloods
That's it representing Australia means nothing - do people have to follow Australian teams in absolutely everything they compete in?

I agree with you there, but there is a certain enjoyment factor in watching the best (somewhat disputable, considering the team sent to Ireland) of our game try and master a foreign game, even if most of them do fail in a spectacular fashion.

[JF_Bay22_SCG]

Originally posted by swansrule100
hmmm so if people dont agree with you they are wrong and un patriotic???

so if Australia enter the nose picking world cup we should automatically think its great???

Well if some of the players were Craig Bolton Jarrod Crouch Jude Bolton (and Tadgh Keneally for the opponents!), I'd at least hope for some support, yes.

Considering his efforts after an Essendon match a couple of years ago, I'd consider Matthew Nicks a certainty for a gold medal.

The thing I'm getting at is that State of Origin died because of similar attitudes. Professional clubs not caring, or WANTING to care. Supporters not WANTING to care. I WANT to care, and NOW before it is too late. Luckily I'm not alone. Pete Hatley wants to go to Ireland in 2006 to support his country and HIS CODE OF FOOTBALL.

I'm not saying IR is ever going to be anything like a Wallabies match. It isn't. But the facts remain, the people of Ireland treat their national shirt with respect. Why are we in this country suddenly too good to be proud of our national winter sports national team, even if it is playing with a round ball with a goalkeeper.

I WANT to care before it is too late. As I think IR gives our sport a novel and interesting contest against fiercely proud opponents. I'm just making a stand. This is more to our game than JUST AFL club football.

Because remember, people didn't WANT to care about AFL in Sydney a few years either. Am I the only one who can see the ironic parallel in all this?

JF

[swansrule100]

but the players are only human need some rest.... id rather the swans didnt miss a flag because some key player got injured playing ireland in a stupid game that isnt even his sport!

[David Votoupal]

Originally posted by JF_Bay22_SCG
I'm not saying IR is ever going to be anything like a Wallabies match. It isn't. But the facts remain, the people of Ireland treat their national shirt with respect. Why are we in this country suddenly too good to be proud of our national winter sports national team, even if it is playing with a round ball with a goalkeeper.

Simple, because it was never part of Australian football tradition to represent your country the way it is in the other football codes.


I WANT to care before it is too late. As I think IR gives our sport a novel and interesting contest against fiercely proud opponents. I'm just making a stand. This is more to our game than JUST AFL club football.

Yes there is more to the Australian game than the AFL. It's called grassroots football, and its something we need to look after more than anything else. Too bad the AFL sometimes don't seem to think otherwise. No grassroots, no football.


Because remember, people didn't WANT to care about AFL in Sydney a few years either. Am I the only one who can see the ironic parallel in all this?



I'd think that's a different issue altogether...

[peterh_oz]

Originally posted by swansrule100
the players have to want it too as well

Most of them do. Did you see Hird abusing **** out of the Irish umpire after that free wasn't paid in the goal square at half time? He wouldn't be doing that if he didn't care.

True, some don't care. Just like some don't care to play for the Kangaroos in the off-season. But many do. I just wish it was best-of-3.

[peterh_oz]

Originally posted by JF_Bay22_SCG
it is a look outside the little goalfish bowl

Umm ... What's a goalfish? Is that like Paul Salmon @ Full-Forward? ;)

[peterh_oz]

Originally posted by cruiser
Why resort to insulting people (in this instance, calling people such as myself small minded) when you disagree with them? Play the ball and not the man!

He was talking generally, and I agree whole-heartedly!

[peterh_oz]

Originally posted by swansrule100
but the players are only human need some rest.... id rather the swans didnt miss a flag because some key player got injured playing ireland in a stupid game that isnt even his sport!

Amazing that almost every other sport can have a rep's series. Whether it be the Wallabies (tho tey don't do muchelse I guess so possibly a bad example), the Kangaroos, soccer (worldwide), basketball (world cup/olympics) and the list goes on. Are our players so unfit or prescious that "they need a rest" compared to other sports?

Sure they need a rest. All people do. They need to rest SO MUCH that Collingwood started training mid-October! I'm not knocking the need to rest, but whether the rest starts end Sept (assuming a GF appearance) or 21 days later really doesn't make much difference. What if there was a draw in the GF? Would those 2 sides be at a disadvantage next year? Or would the AFLPA or us "intelligent supporters" be calling for the replay to be cancelled "because we need a rest"?

Wake up and smell the roses people. Ask the players whether they care. Don't assume. You are right - they are PEOPLE. They have brains and can make decisions. If they didn't want to play, they wouldn't. Crouch got injured. Get over it. He WANTED to play, he didn't have a contract held to his head! We had a **** team this year, but have won 5 of the 11 series', including the last 2. If we'd won each game by a point we'd be saying what a wonderful game it is and can't wait til next year. Like many of us did the last 2yrs!

There's not many things Barassi has got wrong over the years. He can see a point to these matches. So can Sheedy. Sheed's is the guy who would have every injury conceivable attributed to his players if he wanted to, but he wants the series to work. He is even going (been?) to the USA for their National Championships. Gee THAT makes a big difference to Essendon, and the AFL ... NOT. But he is looking at the future.

Remember - those that don't look to the future will cause none to exist! ?P.Hatley (used with permission).

[Damien]

If the Irish/Australian hybrid version of the great Australian game is the future, then it can get stuffed. I wouldn't be a fan.

If you enjoy the games - great go for it, however, this is not the future of our game, and never will be. Just because they are representing Australia doesn't mean the game has to be enjoyed by every hardcore footy fan - that logic is completely flawed!

This game is a bit of fun, and will always be, because it isn't OUR game. Anyone who wants to argue otherwise, good luck, doesn't wash with me.

Would prefer them to develop Aussie Rules internationally over the next century than spend millions on allowing two proud sports to give away great aspects of their games just to allow players to represent their country. (A "honour" 17 of our selected team decided they wouldn't take up this year).

[swansrule100]

Originally posted by peterh_oz
Amazing that almost every other sport can have a rep's series. Whether it be the Wallabies (tho tey don't do muchelse I guess so possibly a bad example), the Kangaroos, soccer (worldwide), basketball (world cup/olympics) and the list goes on. Are our players so unfit or prescious that "they need a rest" compared to other sports?



well when they have an international australian rules tournament ill support it

[cruiser]

Originally posted by JF_Bay22_SCG
...Am I the only one who can see the ironic parallel in all this?

JF
Quite possibly ;)