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Thread: Potential Comp Re-structures for 2009 and beyond

  1. #25
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    Mountain

    What you are saying is correct but how will the proposed new structure improve the problems you have outlined for clubs in the west?

    Short term that may get a few easier games by not having to play Manly and the other stronger clubs but long term this proposal wont develop the game of the clubs in trouble.

    In 3 years time we will be exactly where we are now some strong teams and some easybeats. Under this new structure the blokes who have left the 2nd Division clubs to go to the premier clubs will still leave.

    As I said before it is all short term thinking.

  2. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pekay View Post
    Well put Rafters, spoken by someone who has a true understanding of Sydney Footy, having participated in both SFL and SFA recently and many years ago...This has to happen, regardless of what the Premier Division clubs say about it..it doesn't affect them half as much as it does the lower grades.
    As for Offal, bring an esky brother, me and a few boys are heading down to strongly voice our opinions...We all have a voice, we must be heard and listened to.
    And therein lies the potential problem.

    I have always viewed football as important at all levels. So growing the senior game and having it healthy - at all levels - is vital.

    The game below the Premier Division simply does not matter to a lot of people in Sydney. I have witnessed it first hand, also seeing it at League level, and the attitude is clearly still alive and well judging from some of what I have seen posted here.

    So to many, as long as the top division is going reasonably well, to hell with the rest it would appear.

    To be honest, Premier Division may not need to be touched in any capacity as part of this (although Campbelltown`s ongoing lack of senior depth must be real concern). But certainly the League needs to look at the divisions below that in terms of restructure, if not divisionally (which I don`t particularly like either because of the issue of splitting sides) well then maybe split the comps geographically (which has happened to some degree in the past).

    So, maybe this is more a discussion for those who have an interest in the game at all levels, just not the Premier Division.

  3. #27
    I will be honest and say i couldnt give two hoots about the game below premier division BUT i still cannot see the benefit at ANY level of having a team play at 3 different grounds on the one day.

  4. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by humphrey bear View Post
    Mountain

    What you are saying is correct but how will the proposed new structure improve the problems you have outlined for clubs in the west?

    Short term that may get a few easier games by not having to play Manly and the other stronger clubs but long term this proposal wont develop the game of the clubs in trouble.

    In 3 years time we will be exactly where we are now some strong teams and some easybeats. Under this new structure the blokes who have left the 2nd Division clubs to go to the premier clubs will still leave.

    As I said before it is all short term thinking.
    There is no perfect answer. But it is an issue which needs to be addressed. As can be seen from my subsequent post, the problem with this is that it is going to be discussed on a needs basis.

    In other words, those with a Premier Division alignment probably won`t see an issue. They are doing okay, so what is the problem? Ditto for those from say a UTS and a Manly, who must enjoy having a virtual week off each time they play Nor-West, or Penrith, or Camden.

    On the other side, I can fully understand clubs from the outer west wanting a change. They are adversely affected by the structure as it currently stands (and has stood for years) and are being directly hampered in their efforts to grow their clubs (and the game in general) because of it.

    So probably nothing will come out of it. Those who are travelling nicely will have their say and win out - because they are clearly in the majority. But structurally, Sydney football (certainly below Premier Div level) is grossly inequitable and needs to be fixed.

    If nothing does change, eventually clubs in the west will fall over in my view (which must have been on the cards with several clubs already I would imagine) because I would think they would only want to beat their heads up against a brick wall for so long.

  5. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by shearer View Post
    I will be honest and say i couldnt give two hoots about the game below premier division BUT i still cannot see the benefit at ANY level of having a team play at 3 different grounds on the one day.
    I am strongly against that as well, I am not for one second advocating separation of sides.

  6. #30
    Well retired, still sore Pekay's Avatar
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    I appreciate the reply Duck, but to say my football knowledge is limited is a bit harsh, as all i am doing is relaying and analysing what has been emailed to me from head office. If you have such a great knowledge of the game, surely there is a spot for you down at the league to work your magic. Perhaps you're right, the Premier Divisions Seniors and Reserves need not be touched, all i have done is put together what i think would be a realistic proposal for how footy should be structured. We all have opinions my friend, and they are like ar seholes- all different, and divided. I'm not sure what club you come from, probably a moderately successful one given your opposition to this restructure. Given your opinions, i assume you'll be voicing them at this forum to be held?
    Mountains has it right, this isn't just for Premier League, its for all divisions of Sydney Footy. Footy would be no chop in ten years if there is nothing but the same 20-30 goal hidings being dished out week in week out.
    I've voicedmy opinion, you have yours, no need to bring my 'limited knowledge' of football in to question, you dont even know me to draw that judgement. This isnt a slanging match.

  7. #31
    [QUOTE=mountainsofpain;406316] To be honest, Premier Division may not need to be touched in any capacity as part of this (although Campbelltown`s ongoing lack of senior depth must be real concern).

    Just to clarify, where does our ongoing lack of senior depth come from. Yes we have lost players this season and have struggled for numbers in the ressies,mainly due to some players leaving close to the start of the season which left it too late to recruit as well as some going back to camden when they returned to sydney footy, but that will improve when our u/18s come up at the end of the year and with some recruiting in the off season. Last year we made the finals in seniors and only just missed in the ressies.Dont be too concerned for us we will be fine.
    The edge is not the limit, It's just the starting point...

  8. #32
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    I don't have too much time to read through the annuls of intellect that are present on this forum, but does anybody else find it a tad funny and possibly embarrassing that a city of approx 4.3 million people, and a hugely popular AFL team can only muster up the third strongest comp in the entire NSW/ACT (approx 7.1 million approx combined pop) ?

    The first and second strongest comps are obviously the O&M and the ACTAFL and would both be both coming from an approx pop size of 300-400k each for their respective regional areas...

    So despite having the potential of almost 60% of the combined NSW & ACT state's population, we can only muster up the third strongest competition, behind two seperate regional areas who have incredibly strong comps respectively generated from only around 4-5% of the entire NSW & ACT population.

    Excuse the sums, I am sure there are plenty of experts who can rally off ABS stats to argue the figures used, but I think everybody can get a clear view on the scale we are talking about of how much of an opportunity we are missing.

    I think the Duck's point of serving the weak is extremely apt, and for me a clear result of this would be the number of clubs and grades we have spread throughout Sydney currently across multiple competitions.

    I understand that Football clubs/leagues are often driven greatly on emotion and rarely on logic, I see this as being the direct cause of such a spread of comps, clubs and mini-empires (The "bugger this, let's go make our own" mentality).

    I understand that footy clubs also serves more purposes to people than just an avenue to be a premier player, or a part, of a 'premier' club, hence the need for lower levels/grades, but I think the league needs to rather dramatically cull & align this current scattergun approach of clubs throughout Sydney and throughout competitions and dismantle a few of these mini-empires.

    I'd definitely agree with Ash's earlier comments regarding the need for feeder clubs, and I'd also argue the need for each club to prove their long-term viability to the league. Basically step in, shape up, or ship out.

    Every SINGLE club needs to have a clearly definied premier division club.

    We really need a clear and linear alignment of every club deemed viable in Sydney with a pathway for the cream to rise to the top and be recognised appropriately. Less is best and it's called 'premier' for a reason. Auskick is fun for kids, let's get serious for adults.

  9. #33
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    I think the reason we're needing to have this discussion is clearly stated by a large majority of posters on this thread.
    The people involved in high positions at Premier League clubs that openly say they couldn't give a @@@@ about the lower competitions really need to pull their heads out of the sand and realise that without one you eventually won't have the other.
    Shearer, who is one of your most loyal servants at the Crows? I'd say Rod Craig - and where does he come from. Isn't he a Shark? Would you have such a great player and servant if this so-called insignificant club down the road didn't produce him?
    I'm sure there are plenty of other examples, not just at St George, but certainly at Balmain (until they went to Macquarie Uni this year anyway), while a club like UNSWES will always be strong because as a university they will always have quality players dropping in their lap out of thin air.
    We don't have that luxury or ability.
    The opinions that all you Premier League people have been displaying on here are exactly the opinions being held by the Sydney AFL at least since I've been in Sydney and the reason the small (especially Western) clubs are struggling to be competitive.
    IHK mentioned the O&M - Garry Burkinshaw is from the Hume league, which is a feeder competition to that league, and he has already performed a resurrection job in the Black Diamond (until two months ago they were State Champions).
    I believe he knows what he is doing and I'd put my faith in him to turn things around any day. Ash and Shearer, as key people at your clubs, have you read the release that came out this week? The others may not have, but most of your arguments and concerns have been covered.

    To all of you, please think outside the square on this and not just what benefits your own club.
    It is most likely that Premier League won't be affected anyway - nor does it need to be.
    "It's up to the rest of the players in the room to make a new batch of premiership players next year," Adam Goodes, triple Bob Skilton Medallist, October 7, 2011.

    YOU BETCHA!!!!!!

  10. #34
    BMR, with regard to Rod Craig. Rod is from North Wagga and i believe(i could well be wrong here) only played a season or two at Southern Sharks, not that i am potting them.

    We have been lucky in that the Sharks have sent us some of there talented players such as Rod, Peter Smith, Sean Fitzpatrick and recently Cameron Roe. In turn we have encouraged guys who arent getting a game with us to head down the road and many have had good careers with the Sharks.

    And no i havent read or seen the document.

  11. #35
    If the proposal put forward by the powers???? that be is accepted it will be the death knell of penrith, nor west and camden at the least. It certainly looks like the league want the strong to get stronger and the weak to p>ss off. So much for giving blokes the chance to play footy. It seems we don't want footy clubs unless they can play premier league and if not bad luck. You can maybe go play soccer instead.

  12. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by BeeEmmAre View Post
    I think the reason we're needing to have this discussion is clearly stated by a large majority of posters on this thread.
    The people involved in high positions at Premier League clubs that openly say they couldn't give a @@@@ about the lower competitions really need to pull their heads out of the sand and realise that without one you eventually won't have the other.
    Shearer, who is one of your most loyal servants at the Crows? I'd say Rod Craig - and where does he come from. Isn't he a Shark? Would you have such a great player and servant if this so-called insignificant club down the road didn't produce him?
    It's a fair point BMR, there are a couple of pretty handy guys running around at the minute by the names of Alistair Richardson and Mark Egan who are both Penrith products.

    I can understand people having their parochial views on this issue depending on where they're coming at it from, from my perspective I can only agree with what MOP has had to say here. You can only beat your head against a brick wall for so long. There just aren't the playing and admin resources for footy in the west, and if you're getting pounded into submission every week, the people that do put their hands up year after year eventually give up.

    We'll get to the point in the not to distant future where there'll be no senior football played west of the geographic centre of Sydney bar an AFL club in 2012 if we're not careful. Clearly there are plenty of people that aren't particularly concerned by that prospect which is pretty disappointing.

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