Rnd 12 Pre-Match Thread, vs Melbourne at MCG, 7:25 PM Saturday 4 June

[Nico]

Franklin’s hit was off the ball; whatever we might think about Lynch his hit was in play. No argument could be mounted that Buddy’s hit was other than intentional. Doesn’t matter where he intended to hit Cotchin, his intent to hit is obvious . That’s all that is taken into account.

Take the one-match ban, treat it as a chance to rest a no-longer-young Buddy, and select the best team without him.

Ps: Buddy has always had a propensity to lose his cool when provoked, probably did it more often in his Hawthorn days when he was younger. Star players get a lot of ‘attention’ to which is understandably difficult not to react. Problem for Buddy is that he is so tall his retaliation hits or bumps often strike in the no-go area above the neck. I reckon we take this occasional ‘bad’ with the far more often ‘good’, and the many times ‘wonderfully brilliant’.

On thinking more on it best to leave it.

The penalty is one week with an early plea that implies he got 2 weeks. We appeal and lose, it becomes 2 weeks.

With Buddy out we become less predictable. Now bring in Amartey to play forward to give us some movement up there. Please not one dimensional McLean.

[SwanSand]

I don't think we're getting great value from Campbell in the back half. His pace and kicking skills suggest he could fit in well there, but he doesn't (yet) seem to have the confidence to use his pace to run the ball out of defence, or to take on the risky kicks that Blakey does (and that sometimes come unstuck but often truly clear the ball for us). When he came on as sub for Kennedy last week, he played further up the ground and I think was more effective. So if Wicks were to be banished (and I don't have strong feelings either way), I'd love to see Campbell move up and play across half forward for a game or two.

Alternatively, Ronke did have a decent game on Friday afternoon.

I also don't think we're getting as much out of Florent as we might. He's doing an OK job playing a defensive role but I'd moved him up to play on the wing, replacing Roberts, and also sometimes at centre bounces.

Don’t you think we are trying to play too many midfielders in defensive roles. Especially ones who are not defensively minded. And then we laud the amazing plan of sending Mills behind the ball. Surely the solution to the problem in the first place is to play defenders in defensive roles.

We are carrying too many players who have dropped off compared to last year and no wonder we are struggling.
Florent, Wicks, Mcinerney
Add to it that we have lost Dawson.

Atleast Papley has started to get some of his confidence up.

I would drop Florent to the VFL to gain some confidence. He should be the one in midfield killing it and he has been pushed out of there. Wicks is unable to do the damage in F50 and he is damaging to us now with his poor discipline. And Mcinerney has either lost confidence or is playing injured. At the start of the year, he had the confidence of running past opposition but he now just gets the foot to the ball as quickly as he can. I reckon he is injured and if he is he should just be rested.

[Nico]

Don’t you think we are trying to play too many midfielders in defensive roles. Especially ones who are not defensively minded. And then we laud the amazing plan of sending Mills behind the ball. Surely the solution to the problem in the first place is to play defenders in defensive roles.

We are carrying too many players who have dropped off compared to last year and no wonder we are struggling.
Florent, Wicks, Mcinerney
Add to it that we have lost Dawson.

Atleast Papley has started to get some of his confidence up.

I would drop Florent to the VFL to gain some confidence. He should be the one in midfield killing it and he has been pushed out of there. Wicks is unable to do the damage in F50 and he is damaging to us now with his poor discipline. And Mcinerney has either lost confidence or is playing injured. At the start of the year, he had the confidence of running past opposition but he now just gets the foot to the ball as quickly as he can. I reckon he is injured and if he is he should just be rested.

Jmac's form dropped off after he signed his new contract. Doesn't look injured to me.

[liz]

Don’t you think we are trying to play too many midfielders in defensive roles. .

Aren't we essentially arguing the same thing. I'm suggesting moving Florent and Campbell out of defence so we can more out of them attacking-wise. Which would result in Lloyd, Blakey, COR and Fox providing the smaller/faster defensive stuff, and Rampe and the two McCartins taking on the taller options. That should provide more options that don't involve moving our best midfielder into a defensive role.

I don't know that Florent is lacking confidence. I just think he's being asked to play a role that curtails his attacking ability. And there's no point moving him to the VFL if there isn't anyone better than him to take his spot in the side (and I don't believe there is: Stephens was good on Friday but really needs to clean up his disposal - and that's based on the last few weeks, not just Friday).

[The Big Cat]

The only argument the swans can make if they appeal Buddy’s suspension is there was insufficient force to constitute striking.

[Aprilbr]

Tough selection choices this week. I would go with the following:

Out: Roberts, Franklin, Wicks

In: Blakey, Amartey, (Fox or Ronke)

If Ronke gets the third slot then its a like for like swap of the three Ins. If Fox comes in then we will need to shuffle others eg Campbell forward. The other thing to consider is whether or not Hickey is available? If he is, then Armetey probably misses out.

[stevoswan]

Yep, take the week's rest Bud, it was so very dumb and clumsy, there's no justification.

Because of course, you wouldn't react at all when someone solidly plants their shoulder into your collar bone, without you knowing it's coming?

Seriously, fans who believe they'd be perfect in the same scenario are having a lend of themselves....and everyone else.

- - - Updated - - -

OUT: Wicks, Buddy, Roberts
IN: Taylor, Amartey, Fox

I'd love to see Taylor get a crack after being BOG in the ressies and putting in week in week out. However I think Taylor had his papers stamped in season 1 by Horse and Ronke will get the look in over Taylor for Wicks who's had 2 average weeks.

If Taylor doesn't get picked, Stephens should be.

[Ludwig]

No Blakey? Assuming his illness is short-lived, I imagine he'll be straight back in (and we did miss him).

I find Taylor immensely irritating to watch in the VFL side. He runs around, gathering possessions at will, calls for the ball when he's in a worse spot than the player passing it to him, and is often careless with his disposal. He does seem to have done something about the fitness issues that were a question mark when he first arrived at the club, but to me, he plays a Darcy Parish/Zac Merrett style of midfield, but with worse disposal. That said, those elements of his game were less prominent on Friday, when I think he did play a good game. I still wouldn't have him in the senior team though.

I don't think we're getting great value from Campbell in the back half. His pace and kicking skills suggest he could fit in well there, but he doesn't (yet) seem to have the confidence to use his pace to run the ball out of defence, or to take on the risky kicks that Blakey does (and that sometimes come unstuck but often truly clear the ball for us). When he came on as sub for Kennedy last week, he played further up the ground and I think was more effective. So if Wicks were to be banished (and I don't have strong feelings either way), I'd love to see Campbell move up and play across half forward for a game or two.

Alternatively, Ronke did have a decent game on Friday afternoon.

I also don't think we're getting as much out of Florent as we might. He's doing an OK job playing a defensive role but I'd moved him up to play on the wing, replacing Roberts, and also sometimes at centre bounces.

So for me:

Out: Roberts, Franklin, Wicks (maybe)
In: Blakey, Amartey, Fox (maybe)

with Campbell and Florent to effectively replace Wicks and Roberts positionally. Blakey and Fox to replace Campbell and Florent positionally, which means COR also keeps his spot. I've only watched a replay of the second half, so far, but he did some pretty impressive things.

I agree with your assessment on Taylor, which is why I put up Clarke's name to come in ahead of Taylor. I have also made similar comments on Stephens, in that he's improving, except for his errant kicking.

I also like your suggestion of moving Campbell to the forward line. I think our defence looks okay with the McCartins, Rampe, Blakey, COR and Lloyd. I'm okay with Florent helping out in defence. We can't throw everyone into the midfield.

The one midfield move I continue to prefer is that of Heeney. He can have some very productive weeks up forward, but when he's off a bit, we're not getting enough from such a huge talent. From the midfield, he can also help out in defence and provide a good marking outlet more often.

I like a core midfield of Mills, Parker, Heeney, Warner and Rowbottom. Even with rotations, we should be able to have at least 4 of those on the ground simultaneously.

We can still have Ronke come in for Wicks, even with a Campbell move forward, with Heeney and Papley taking turns in the midfield. But Fox is okay as well, and versatile enough to play back or forward.

[Agent 86]

Because of course, you wouldn't react at all when someone solidly plants their shoulder into your collar bone, without you knowing it's coming?

Seriously, fans who believe they'd be perfect in the same scenario are having a lend of themselves....and everyone else.

I don’t think anyone’s saying that, Stevo. Cotchin is Like the little brother who niggles you until you whack him and then runs crying to Mum & you get a bollocking.

[COB]

I don’t think anyone’s saying that, Stevo. Cotchin is Like the little brother who niggles you until you whack him and then runs crying to Mum & you get a bollocking.

Stop trying to justify Buddy's action. Niggle is part of the game. If roles were reversed I don't think you'd be so forgiving. Wish people weren't so biased just because they support a particular team.

[Roadrunner]

Stop trying to justify Buddy's action. Niggle is part of the game. If roles were reversed I don't think you'd be so forgiving. Wish people weren't so biased just because they support a particular team.

Not justifying it at all COB, but Cotchin did put on a bit of an act to exaggerate the contact. He wasn’t hurt and wanted to make sure everyone saw what happened. Buddy should know better and a week off is fair- not that he needs a rest as yet!

[Goal Sneak]

Because of course, you wouldn't react at all when someone solidly plants their shoulder into your collar bone, without you knowing it's coming?

Seriously, fans who believe they'd be perfect in the same scenario are having a lend of themselves....and everyone else.

Buddy chose to get involved with a pip-squeak nipping at him and he clumsily got it wrong. I've got no problem with anyone engaging in a bit of argy-bargy but if you get it wrong, there's no point trying to justify it as if you're innocent. I said it was dumb because of the timing and the resulting reverse free kick. Buddy knows better, he got sucked in, even though, ultimately it seemed to spark his game into action.