Greatest XXII of the Sydney era?

[Donners]

To celebrate the greatest footy stats website, AFL Tables , stretching back to the very first year of the Sydney Swans - and to keep myself sane converting scanned images of stats to HTML for game after game for that site - I put together a "Team of the Sydney Era", covering 1982-2009.

I set a somewhat arbitrary limit of 80 games, reasoning that players should have played at least four solid seasons in that 29-year period to be considered among the best team of the era.

All stats and details cover that period, and are a combination of stats.rleague.com and my own records.

Abbreviations stand for: Games, Goals, Possessions Per Game, Marks Per Game, Swans' Best & Fairest, All Australian and Brownlow Medal votes.


Notable players who are ineligible (<80 gms)
Barry Round
Bernie Evans
Greg Smith
Paul Hawke
Merv Neagle


BP: David Ackerly (86 gms, 10 gls, 16.4 PPG, 3.3 MPG, 1 B&F, 1 AA, 29 BM)
FB: Andrew Dunkley (217 gms, 11 gls, 10.7 PPG, 3.8 MPG, 26 BM)
BP: Leo Barry (237 gms, 56 gls, 12.9 PPG, 5.0 MPG, 2 AA, 13 BM)

The main challenge here was choosing between Rod Carter and Dunkley at full back. Both played plenty of games, were with the side in successful times and were low-possession, strong and tough defenders over an extended period. I went with Dunkley, who was ahead on games, Brownlow votes and stats, but it could have gone either way.

I considered a small back pocket like Crouch, Mathews or Roberts, or taller specialist back pockets like Cordy or Seymour, but Ackerly and Barry achieved outstanding success (albeit in limited time for the former)


HB: Dennis Carroll (205 gms, 112 gls, 19.3 PPG, 3.8 MPG, 1 AA, 58 BM)
CHB: Paul Roos (87 gms, 19 gls, 18.9 PPG, 5.2 MPG, 2 AA, 23 BM)
HB: Mark Browning (129 gms, 63 gls, 19.3 PPG, 2.8 MPG, 1 B&F, 1 AA, 11 BM)

Several quality candidates for the half-back roles, with Toohey and Kennelly also in contention for the flanks and Schauble and Craig Bolton at CHB, but this makes for an exceptionally attacking and versatile trio. Not only do they provide weight of numbers for rebounding out of defence, but they can also kick a few goals, as well as, of course, shutting down an opponent.

W: Wayne Schwass (98 gms, 57 gls, 22.8 PPG, 3.6 MPG, 1 B&F, 1 AA, 1 49 BM)
C: Greg Williams (107 gms, 118 gls, 28.4 PPG, 3.4 MPG, 4 AA, 63 BM)
W: Adam Goodes (276 gms, 311 gls, 17.2 PPG, 5.6 MPG, 2 B&F, 3 AA, 137 BM)

No shortage of options here - Maxfield, Murphy, McVeigh, David and Jude Bolton, O'Keefe, Paul Williams, Kirk, Cresswell... Williams is a certainty, given his outstanding performance, and the only issue with Goodes is his positioning. I think he is best with the freedom of a winger, and there's only so many tall players you can throw into the forward line. Schwass may be the one on the fringe, but for quality of possession backed by numbers, he is the best in my eyes.

HF: Ryan O'Keefe (209 gms, 207 gls, 16.2 PPG, 4.6 MPG, 1 B&F, 1 AA, 48 BM)
CHF: Barry Hall (162 gms, 467 gms, 13.2 PPG, 7.6 MPG, 1 B&F, 3 AA, 63 BM)
HF: Tony Morwood (151 gms, 257 gls, 14.1 PPG, 5.1 MPG, 36 BM)

I had to weigh up whether to go with Lewis or Morwood/O'Keefe. I'm a big fan of Lewis, but Morwood was the more dangerous goalscorer, and was a key part of a stronger side. He also had the versatility to play as a key target. O'Keefe is actually inferior to Lewis in overall stats, but his best has been more outstanding, and in a stronger team. Hall was obvious.

FP: Michael O'Loughlin (303 gms, 521 gls, 13.9 PPG, 5.0 MPG, 1 B&F, 2 AA, 40 BM)
FF: Tony Lockett (98 gms, 462 gls, 9.7 PPG, 6.0 MPG, 1 B&F, 3 AA, 43 BM)
FP: Paul Kelly (234 gms, 200 gls, 20.4 PPG, 3.6 MPG, 4 B&F, 3 AA, 103 BM)

I would have loved to have squeezed in Wright, but Kelly already had the small pocket role. Hard to argue with the other two, though O'Loughlin could have been named on a flank to make room for Capper.

Ruck: Greg Stafford (130 gms, 58 gls, 11.9 PPG, 4.4 MPG, 39 BM)
R/R: Gerard Healy (81 gms, 87 gls, 26.4 PPG, 3.6 MPG, 3 B&F, 3 AA, 39 BM)
Rov: Barry Mitchell (170 gms, 212 gls, 25.7 PPG, 2.5 MPG, 1 B&F, 2 AA, 22 BM)

I think Healy and Mitchell are obvious choices. It came down to Stafford, Ball or Jolly for the ruck. Statistically, they are all pretty much equal, except Jolly is well ahead on hit-outs and down on possessions. However, that also comes about from the style the team played while he was around. It could really have gone to any of them, though.

Int: Brett Kirk (241 gms, 96 gls, 18.5 PPG, 2.7 MPG, 2 B&F, 1 AA, 81 BM)
Int: Daryn Cresswell (244 gms, 209 gls, 23.0 PPG, 4.2 MPG, 1 B&F, 1 AA, 61 BM)
Int: Paul Williams (117 gms, 84 gls, 18.3 PPG, 3.2 MPG, 2 B&F, 1 AA, 10 BM)
Int: Mark Bayes (246 gms, 174 gls, 13.0 PPG, 2.9 MPG, 1 B&F, 1 AA, 30 BM)

Kirk is a pretty outstanding option for leadership, grunt and dedication, and Cresswell has sheer weight of numbers in the engine room. Williams provides plenty of class, and Bayes is the best of the big utilities. I suppose Craig Bolton would be the most obvious choice to replace Bayes, but the latter is more versatile. Of course, there are no shortage of outstanding smaller players who also could have made it: see below.


The unlucky ones...
Warrick Capper (90 gms, 317 gls, 10.4 PPG, 5.0 MPG, 10 BM)
Dale Lewis (182 gms, 186 gls, 17.5 PPG, 5.2 MPG, 37 BM)

Jude Bolton (257 gms, 125 gls, 18.0 PPG, 3.2 MPG, 69 BM)
Steve Wright (191 gms, 195 gls, 18.3 PPG, 1.6 MPG, 2 B&F, 17 BM)
David Murphy (156 gms, 93 gls, 19.0 PPG, 3.1 MPG, 40 BM)
Jarred McVeigh (147 gms, 104 gls, 15.0 PPG, 3.6 MPG, 1 B&F, 20 BM)
Stuart Maxfield (200 gms, 87 gls, 15.1 PPG, 2.8 MPG, 29 BM)

Craig Bolton (170 gms, 15 gls, 14.1 PPG, 4.9 MPG, 2 AA, 12 BM)
Andrew Schauble (88 gms, 23 gls, 10.2 PPG, 4.1 MPG, 1 B&F, 3 BM)
Rod Carter (177 gms, 1 gl, 8.4 PPG, 1.8 MPG, 11 BM)
Tadgh Kennelly (178 gms, 29 gls, 15.7 PPG, 3.7 MPG, 28 BM)

Darren Jolly (118 gms, 59 gls, 9.8 PPG, 3.5 MPG, 9 BM)
Jason Ball (90 gms, 45 gls, 11.6 PPG, 3.9 MPG, 10 BM)



For what it's worth, I have all those players in a seconds side - and with a minimum of 15 games, have teams going all the way down to an eighths! That has the not so inspiring midfield of Fixter, Schmidt, Arnott, Bomford and Lucas...

So...what changes would you make to that side?

[Chilcott]

Pretty hard to argue against you Donners, since you did the research.
Bloody good side.

[laughingnome]

Mark Bayes made the cut. Everything else is irrelevant to me.

There are a lot of tall players in your 22 that could pinch-hit in the ruck, but I think it interesting that while Stafford, Ball and Jolly are all near-equal you couldn't find room for a 2nd ruck in the side.

[Big Al]

Great work Donners...

Would love to see one of my favourite players, Stevie Wright make the cut but I'd be blowed to know who to take out. Maybe Schwass out and Wright in maybe.

[aardvark]

I'm devastated, how could you forget Simon Minton Connell....unbelievable.

[Donners]

I'm devastated, how could you forget Simon Minton Connell....unbelievable.

LOL, I didn't forget him - he's my favourite player! Wish I could have squeezed him in somehow...

There are a lot of tall players in your 22 that could pinch-hit in the ruck, but I think it interesting that while Stafford, Ball and Jolly are all near-equal you couldn't find room for a 2nd ruck in the side.

Yeah, that was a bit of a challenge. I think Goodes would be the clear backup. The only other people in that side who did much in the way of hit-outs were Hall, Dunkley and Roos, and even then primarily at throw-ins down their end. But working out who to drop for another ruckman is the hard bit...

[Wazza]

Nice team well researched the only 2 changes I would make in my selected team -
Leo to the pine C Bolts in the BP, Leo can cover any of the defensive positions C Bolts has been our stand out defender last 6 years.
Morwood out for D Lewis, D Lewis could take any team apart on his day played FWD or MF, ROK is a similar player but Lewis had more X factor, Morwood was more a traditional HF.

Nice work.

Cheers

Waz

[Doctor J.]

Nice team well researched the only 2 changes I would make in my selected team -
Leo to the pine C Bolts in the BP, Leo can cover any of the defensive positions C Bolts has been our stand out defender last 6 years.
Morwood out for D Lewis, D Lewis could take any team apart on his day played FWD or MF, ROK is a similar player but Lewis had more X factor, Morwood was more a traditional HF.

Nice work.

Cheers

Waz

Good work Donners. Agree AFL Tables is THE BEST stats and player information site on the net.

Hard to argue with any of your selections, and the players left out could easily be sllotted into that team.

Wazz, I do however have to jump to the defence of T. Morwood. I am an unashamed fan of Lewie, however him ahead of Morwood doesn't stack up on any level. Selectors for the Team of the Century also agree.

[Plugger46]

I'm 23 so only remember Mitchell at Carlton. Was he really good enough to be named on the ball ahead of Kel?

Great effort by the way Donners.

[Wazza]

Not saying T Morwood wasnt a great player but I f I was selecting a team from these players i would prefer Lewis to him for the versatility it would bring to the team.
Dale Lewis has very similar career stats to Adam Goodes (Minus BM and AA), Goals probably would be similar if he had played same number of games.

But cant and wont argue Morwood shouldnt be there just how i would pick the team.

Cheers

Waz

[Matty10]

Lists of the 'greatest' players are always so hard to make. It is all so subjective (and it is basically a no-win process for the list-maker). Overall it looks pretty good.

I would have Morwood over Lewis. I would also make room for Capper - he was an absolute gun for the Swans - and think it would be crazy to leave out a player who had a 100 goal season to his name.

I would also add David Rhys-Jones name to the list of 'Notable players who are ineligible (<80 gms)' - he was my favourite player during those years - and I was devastated when he left. I thought quite highly of Bernard Toohey & David Murphy also. I would probably drop Schwass from the team too.

[Doctor J.]

Lists of the 'greatest' players are always so hard to make. It is all so subjective (and it is basically a no-win process for the list-maker). Overall it looks pretty good.

I would have Morwood over Lewis. I would also make room for Capper - he was an absolute gun for the Swans - and think it would be crazy to leave out a player who had a 100 goal season to his name.

I would also add David Rhys-Jones name to the list of 'Notable players who are ineligible (<80 gms)' - he was my favourite player during those years - and I was devastated when he left. I thought quite highly of Bernard Toohey & David Murphy also. I would probably drop Schwass from the team too.

No arguements from me on that one
Dr J.