Well, I'm not sure that GWS view Sydney as an area able to produce AFL talent? Only one of their academy players from Sydney. And if I remember rightly, St George is more south-eastern Sydney, than western Sydney. And in regards to the rest of the academy talent that they've been 'developing': well, there's a chance that seven of them could see Victoria from their house.Originally Posted by barracuda
Well they are going need to now after the boundary adjustment that quite rightly did not impact us.
I actually think that GWS have missed the boat completely re the junior side in Sydney. And it is all down to AFL hubris. A club formed our of a business plan, not a grassroots appetite for football. Then once decided upon they took an arrogant view that if they brought AFL to Western Sydney that the game would just sell itself and failed to even acknowledge the strengths of NRL and soccer there.
Then of course they recruited Israel Folau because that would convert all the Polynesians from rugby (it was all that easy) and of course we'll send Sheeds up for a few years but really nobody in western Sydney knew him and he then proceeded to offend the Swans fans who they really really needed to try and engage with.
All the time they did f-all for the local game. They let Campbelltown wither and die (could reasonably argue that is really not their remit to save them but the NSWAFL) and have from all reports done nothing to support local clubs and to make matters worse the club they did support was MANLY, because we all know people from the Northern Peninsula travel to Homebush to watch a game of footy. And whilst I am not sure of the exact details I do know that GWS pretty much destroyed the only decent junior club in their catchment area in Bankstown Sports through a mixture of arrogance, ignorance and politics. Many (but not all I may add) football people in Western Sydney despise them and I'd be surprised if many of the window lickers out there in orange actually play the game.
And after spending a couple of games at their business coterie through gritted teeth I can understand why. This club from top down is just a little project. All the clowns on their board and "Friends Of" groups are Eastern Suburbs snobs through and through. They may like Australian Football but you can bet GWS aren't their first team but they think it's jolly good fun when they win. It's a little business project, a nice networking opportunity and much much cheaper than what they have to pay for the same thing across town.
And that is why, despite them effectively going within a kick of the flag in 2016 and playing the biggest club in the land, they barely got into a five figure crowd Saturday. If people aren't on board now I actually don't think even winning a flag will make any difference at all. The good working class folk of Western Sydney can smell a fake when they see one.
GWS had their chance to engage with the community that didn't really want them in the first place (unlike Gold Coast who lobbied for years to get a team) and they turned their nose up at them. They better win a flag this year or next because if they don't watch those numpties leave the sinking ship
Fair few selected from the Sydney academy in the U16 Rams squad
U16 Rams squad announced ahead of Champs
Also the U17's
http://aflnswact.com.au/squad-selected-17-futures-series/
Probably swam the Murray as kids or sat on the banks dreaming of playing footy in the big time in Melbourne.
This is interesting and reflects the new landscape now that GWS have been stripped of their ridiculous Victorian border recruitment zone though I'm not sure how the one kid from Albury slipped in there.
That squad is both a tribute to the work of the Swans Academy and a damning indictment on the GWS Academy.
Look at the numbers. 16 kids from the Swans with five regional kids showing that our Out-of-Sydney academies are also working. Of the 11 Sydney kids we have nine Sydney junior clubs represented.
GWS have ONE single Sydney kid. After six years that is all they can come up with. Absolutely pathetic. And of the other 8 we have four from Canberra, three from the Riverina and one from Albury.
Not defending GWS's treatment of grass roots clubs in western Sydney but you would have to agree it's going to take a while to start producing regular AFL talent from that region. It'll be the toughest region to crack I would think. It would be the equivalent of Melbourne storm getting an academy in Footscray.
I'd debate that Boddo.
Just a summary of the AFL Sydney landscape as I gather you are a WA boy.
The Swans definitely have the better development region in Sydney as it contains the traditional strong areas of the North Shore, Eastern Suburbs and Shire. And make no mistake (as the AFL did) that soccer and NRL are extremely strong in the west of Sydney. And add in the private schools now flocking to the game who also reside in the Swans areas traditionally, not that these kids have started to affect the elite levels yet.
But to suggest the GWS zone is barren is doing that region and it's AFL communities a great disservice. For many years Campbelltown had a very very good junior programme and won U19 flags. Parramatta was also quite strong with Brunton coming from there. East Coast Eagles (Baulko) are also in the GWS zone and are traditionally a very strong junior club. Penrith has effectively it's own junior zone with Penrith, Rooty Hill, St Clair, Emu Plain, Hawkesbury and the Blue Mountains teams. Then you have Bankstown Sports which GWS destroyed. You also also have the SWS area around Liverpool which has also traditionally had decent juniors
Add in the fact that the GWS zone is the fastest growing area for young families.
I'd always expect the Swans to shade the GWS in terms of elite talent from Sydney but then again GWS have a good zone in the ACT to compensate. But to be outgunned by the ratio of 11:1 just demonstrates how little they have invested in their Sydney Academies. Probably due to the fact that they could simply get kids from the Murray, well they are paying for it now.
I'd say that the Swans currently have the best zone but that there is possibly more long term potential in the West but really GWS don't give a stuff about the grassroots
GWS have now been in Sydney 7 seasons (1 in the NEAFL Only) so the argument that they are playing catchup is starting to get a bit old. They can probably get away with it for another two years but by 2019 if they aren't getting at least 4-5 Sydney boys in the NSW-ACT U16 team then I think it is fair to call their Academy a complete failure
Perhaps Barracuda, if he is reading, could provide a lie of the land re the difference of the two Sydney programmes
Last edited by Mug Punter; 31st May 2017 at 02:46 PM.
I call my myself a WA boy now but spent a considerable amount of time over east growing up n living there. Only been in WA ten years. What I was trying to point out Is that yes those regions were strong for a long time but did not produce regular standard AFL players. it will happen but they just have to build a program up n a successful AFL side does wonders for it. So I actually see what they have done, they have tried to sow and harvest the areas that have more chance of producing NSW talent & then grow their academy areas through a successful AFL side. Sydney were different they'd been a very successful side for a long time so a lot of families would have already had that attachment. GWS wouldn't have they would have basically been starting from ground zero. Look at when south went up in 82 they were given all of nsw as a zone n eventually people made that connection n sent their young kids along to train at the academy when it started up. It will just take time. But I do agree about not having endless amount of time. In my head it's 2020. If you would compare say Newcastle to West Sydney it gives how hard it can be. We've produced Heeney in that same amount of time and that's it. And when it comes to the region that was taken away from them watch it slowly wither n die unless something tangible is put in there. Before the area had an academy there it had dried up then the academy fixed what had been a barren area.
All this whining about GWS not investing in Western Sydney juniors seems to be some based on some romantic view of the world.
Facts are:
- Western Sydney is the least AFL region in Australia, and hasnt produced many AFL footballers. So thinking that will suddenly change is foolish.
- GWS is a business, yet to turn a profit, and so every cent must be spent as effectively as possible. Hence the investment in regional NSW where AFL is stronger.
- They have access to low draft picks continually by turning over their list, and so fringe locals in the 30-50th pick range is a very low priority.
- Their number one goal is achieve sustainability as a club. They need local fans, not local players.
However they have cracked 20,000 members as of today, and the stagnation in growth of crowds this year is a reflection of the reduction in number of free memberships and tickets given away. I would have expected them to get higher crowds, and I'm pretty sure the AFL are too, but all other indicators are heading in the right direction.
The jury is still out as to whether the showgrounds is a viable location. It doesnt have that community feel.
Hi, I don't know that much about the GWS program except that I don't think the Riverina guys participate much, or travel to Sydney much.
The number of swans in the under 16 Rams represents a turning point, as it is the first time it looks like merit rather than reputation influenced the selections. I think it would also have been impacted by the fact that the swans were filthy that the under 18s allies selection again favoured the GWS based purely on reputation rather than merit. I understand that the swans have been very vocal and angry that certain swans kids missed out in favour of kids who might have played well a couple of years ago, rather than are playing well now.
I see that some of the drafting sites said that some of the allies players, playing in the allies trial games in Melbourne over the weekend were clearly not up to it. It would be interesting to know where these players came from. If they were GWS players then it simply reinforces that it is a myth that you can't be a real AFL player unless you come from a traditional AFL area. If they were GWS players then there will be a few swans under 18s players who will be even more annoyed they missed out on allies.
These are the points I always get to with other people. GWS has started from year zero n academies work so well because of two things n that's the kids get the opportunity to stay in there home state and that is facilitated with the local AFL club. If the club is successful a connection to the club will happen thus choosing AFL over other sports. It takes time. And lastly all those points that GWS have to use on academy picks are because of the start up concessions they got. Take away the start up concessions n they don't have the players to trade for points to match bids. If only the Melbourne media weren't such liers and people weren't so gullible.
Gws until recently had about 15 guys max from Sydney in their under 17s academy
One picked was Jeremy finlayson
Awesome kick
Very lazy
Ran about a 12min plus 3km when 85kg max
The boys in the Riverina rarely came to Sydney
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