Match Day Thread Rnd. 5. Sydney V GWS. SCG. 19.25 pm.

[Billericay]

as for trusting Horse. The selections last week were unbelievable. Newman out yet Foote & Jack stay in. Stuff that. I will say this Kizza is a liability on the team. At least Goodsie had the guts to drop himself to the reserves to get form. Not so Kizza!

I was baffled by Horse's selections last week. The only way I could justify it was to imagine that he wanted to keep it simple, pick the "hardest" at the ball team he could, and focus on winning the contested ball. Hmmmm

Let's hope there are changes in personnel and approach this week.

[Sandridge]

Of course I knew that, and I don't think it should be necessary to sledge players, but we all know it happens all the time. I can sympathize with someone using a term directed at a person which a 3rd party might find offensive. It can be really hard to keep up with who gets offended by what terms. When I was a kid everyone used the word retard as a sledge, but no one thought it was offensive to mentally disabled people. We just didn't think about it. The term mentally retarded was the 'official' term applied to the mentally disabled. I couldn't tell you what the 'correct' term is now. Maybe it's because I've been living out of Australia for 6 years and I just don't get to hear the common vernacular.

I don't think people should be vilified. That's for sure. I took a very strong stand on the Adam Goodes incidents, because it was clearly racial vilification. But I also believe in free speech and we should carefully consider putting limitations on that freedom. I think there are times when we have to let some people be offended in order to protect that freedom.

I think Rhyce Shaw's sledge, and a lot of other things he does, is very poor form, but he didn't use the term 'retard' to vilify the mentally disabled.

Freedom of speech should be cherished. We have to understand that's it's a freedom that permits people to say offensive things. It permits people to blatantly lie. If we want to keep that freedom, it comes with the territory.

Please read the update part of wolftone's post #246 again. Explains perfectly why Heath Shaw's sledge was offensive.

[wolftone57]

Sorry, but I don't see it that way. Form varies, and I have faith that ours will turn.
The word 'rebuilding' being used right now?
To me that's laughable.
I get that some people will get frustrated and give up, but I still think we can turn it all around.

The incurable optimist. I'm not convinced we can turn this around at all. Game plan is a problem. So is personnel. The worst disposers in our club are; Smithy, Reg, JPK, Hannas, Kizza, Parksie, BJ, Tip & harry. Basically all the mids and most of the backs. Laids is not too good either. The best disposers; Newman, Melican, Talia, Aliir (when in form), Hayward, Dawson, Rose, Edwards (even though somewhat erratic he does manage 78% DE), Fisher, Towers, Cameron, Rampe, Lloyd, Jones, Papley, Bud, Heens, Mills, Florent.

I don't know if you get the drift but most of the best disposers are young players. The rest butcher the ball. towers is proving he has no ticker just like Bedford once said. Was hoping that would be different.

[wolftone57]

When you play 13 debutantes in 1 year + 5 games, it looks like rebuilding to me. It's not a curse word. Even though we are in the bottom 2 right now, it doesn't mean we can't be a decent competitive team in the process. I expect we will go on some sort of a winning streak now as we enter an easier part of the fixture. But there is no denying that there is a big gulf between us and GSW.

I think we had and excellent draft and expect 6 or 7 out of the 9 players drafted to make it in the AFL. That's a big number for one draft. Florent and Hayward are still a bit too young right now to handle a quality side like the Giants, but wait till next year. Fox looked okay. Fisher will be a good player.

Agree but I think regenerating is more the word. Rebuilding is a long process and Brendan Bolton is in that stage. He is looking beyond Gibbs Kruzer, Murphy etc. We are trying desperately to hang onto players like Parker, JPK, Hannas, Harry?, Tip, Bud, Smithy etc as we see them as part of the bright future. I don't see us as a 2-3 year proposition. I see us as a one year down, probably middle, side and next year up. But the coaching has to change not just the players.

[wolftone57]

I am confused by what you write. You seem to be contradicting yourself. On the one hand I agree with this paragraph (above). However, as you point out in your next post, we are already doing this. We *have* already blooded 13 since the beginning of last season with the prospect of more debutants to come. We already have one of the league's youngest sides.

However I think it would be a mistake to overdo it. We need the more experienced players to guide all the new blood. If you are only talking about dropping one additional player, Reg, then I still don't agree but that sounds more reasonable. But you seem to be going further and saying we should stop playing now all the players that we don't see as being part of our longer term future and I don't agree with that. As regards Reg in particular, I think even if we wish to transition to a more aggressive, rebounding defence, there is still room for one or more staunchly defensive individuals in the mix.

No we need to play only form players not those who live on reputation alone. Look at what freo have been able to do with young players. Maybe we chose to play Ollie & Will on talent alone and that was a mistake as their bodies were probably not ready. But there are others in the reserves who's bodies are ready and waiting. I think, like Ludwig, we have to bite bullet and play the young guys. all the out of form players go out. Injured players go out.

Next week this is what I'd do;

Out: Reg, Smithy, Foote, Tippett, K Jack, Hannas (to have his knee scraped as he should have at the end of last season). Cunningham & Parker stay in because they are the best of the worst and there is an upside. Come to think of it if Parksie is injured he goes too but if not Harry. I prefer Dawson

In; Rose, Aliir (ruck), Talia (played very well in reserves, has all season), Newman, Edwards, (upgrade for Hannas), Cameron (if fit), Dawson.

I think Jordan Dawson was given a pretty bum wrap. You should never just give a young player one game unless he is so unready, like Naismith's first or X. I think toward the end of his first game Dawson was starting to get the feel of it.

[Auntie.Gerald]

I don't have answers right now
Just lots of questions

Re the one game thing for a junior player

I have never had a problem with that as supporter, coach or player in any sport

Give the youth a taste and if they can't make it stick then they know exactly the areas of improvement needed

They won't find these areas when they dominate neafl each week

[wolftone57]

Can you imagine Horse going to training and saying "guys we are 0-5, you have no chance to win the flag. By the way we are dropping some you senior guys because we have no faith you can turn the team around. But stick around as we need you to play reserves and help rebuild the club."

The problem is not with our backline. No one could defend against the speed of entry they are facing. Wave after wave. The midfield is the cause of all our problems. We are missing a couple of quality inside midfielders that can take the heat off Hannebery and Parker. Their bodies are broken after years of being the best with little support around them. Hewett is trying but we have nothing after that. Lloyd and Cuuningham can't play inside, Robinson keeps getting injured, Foote not up to it and Florent is still developing. Is there any more???? Certainly don't want to destroy Heeney and Mills by throwing them inside the packs. No one should under estimate the physical toll they endure week after week. We are missing Mitchell and even McGlynn provided some inside grunt. Jones would love the physical nature of the midfield trenches, but we need to find another quality young inside midfielder. I wonder if we had our time again would Powell-Pepper have been a better choice. Recruiting one may be our best option.

Yes the midfield is the cause of our problems. But mainly because Horse & co seem to think that you can turn outside mids into top inside mids. You bloody well can't! Hannas was a perfectly good outside mid and most of his best work is still done there. But Horse, instead of recruiting another inside mid, decided he should be an inside mid at times. He isn't good at it and gets injured constantly. Hannas is a wonderful spread player. Why not use his real talent as the inside job is killing the kid with injury and psychologically. mills, Heens, Foxy, Fisher, Dawson, Lloydy & Jonsie can all play inside if we need. After Hannas gets his knee scraped he should only play outside spread. Use his speed and ability to provide space. If you use him inside you kill his ability to spread because he tires.

- - - Updated - - -

Now that we've got some quality forwards back in Papley, Rohan (swinging to backline) and Heeney (also through midfield) we should get Jack back in the middle. He's not a small forward and we need another hard head over the ball

Jack is baked. Forget him.

[Ludwig]

Next week this is what I'd do;

Out: Reg, Smithy, Foote, Tippett, K Jack, Hannas (to have his knee scraped as he should have at the end of last season). Cunningham & Parker stay in because they are the best of the worst and there is an upside. Come to think of it if Parksie is injured he goes too but if not Harry. I prefer Dawson

In; Rose, Aliir (ruck), Talia (played very well in reserves, has all season), Newman, Edwards, (upgrade for Hannas), Cameron (if fit), Dawson.

I think Jordan Dawson was given a pretty bum wrap. You should never just give a young player one game unless he is so unready, like Naismith's first or X. I think toward the end of his first game Dawson was starting to get the feel of it.

I generally agree with these changes, except that even if Hannas needs a chondroplasty he would only miss a couple of games, so wouldn't be put on the LTIL, therefore, no upgrade of a rookie for him. If this is his problem, it would be a good time to do it, as he would probably only miss the Carlton and Brisbane games. I'm also not ready to pull the plug on Smith. I think he's among a number of senior players that just needs to get back into form. I don't think he needs time in the reserves to do it and expect he will be a key part of our defence for several years to come.

[mattybloods]

Jack is baked. Forget him.

If Jack is healthy he needs to play midfield. If he's not fit drop him, stop using him up forward


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[ugg]

.@sydneyswans have confirmed Kieren Jack is injured. Will miss this week with a hip issue. How long he'll be out is TBD #TalkingFooty

[Billericay]

.@sydneyswans have confirmed Kieren Jack is injured. Will miss this week with a hip issue. How long he'll be out is TBD #TalkingFooty

Sad to say I'm relieved he won't be playing this week ditto McVeigh

[wolftone57]

I generally agree with these changes, except that even if Hannas needs a chondroplasty he would only miss a couple of games, so wouldn't be put on the LTIL, therefore, no upgrade of a rookie for him. If this is his problem, it would be a good time to do it, as he would probably only miss the Carlton and Brisbane games. I'm also not ready to pull the plug on Smith. I think he's among a number of senior players that just needs to get back into form. I don't think he needs time in the reserves to do it and expect he will be a key part of our defence for several years to come.

I'm not saying Smithy won't be a key player. just not now. He is sadly out of form. If you really want a look at how out of form he has given away 20 goals in 5 games. Not good. Every player no matter how important he seems to the team should expect to spend time in the reserves if his form is suspect. His form is not just suspect it stinks. he has now had 5 stinkers in a row. Not even Adam Goodes was allowed, he didn't allow himself, to get away with that. two players I think have put themselves above the team, Kizza and Smithy. Both pathetic. Reg has not been as bad as either of these. Now it turns out Kizza was injured. TUT TUT Longmire!!!!