Match Day Rnd.4 West Coast V Sydney. Domain Stadium 20.10 pm.

[aardvark]

Hold back on the gloating at this stage.

Our similar lowly predicament is not allowing me to experience the full joy of Hawthorn's demise unfortunately, although I did watch and enjoy every minute of Monday's game including Hodge getting his head removed.

[Sandrevan]

How good was it watching them getting beaten again by 86 points and seeing Hodge getting roughed up in the process.

Most likely that Hodge will retire at the end of 2017. Wouldn't it be nice if he retired with a wooden spoon. Having said that, the Swans are above Whorethorn by % only. Hold back on the gloating at this stage.

[ugg]

I'm sure Mitchell will be drowning his sorrows tonight when he realises he could be playing for the 16th ranked team instead of the 18th

[Hotpotato]

Will Tom Mitchell be enjoying this or is it just about the $$$ .

[dejavoodoo44]

The Hawks post match autopsy on the Big Footy site is quite an amusing read.

[Billericay]

Hawthorn remain on bottom of ladder - thrashed by Geelong

How good was it watching them getting beaten again by 86 points and seeing Hodge getting roughed up in the process.

[Industrial Fan]

Probably need to sack Clarkson ????

[Mountain Man]

Hawthorn remain on bottom of ladder - thrashed by Geelong

[Billericay]

Yeah, Aliir conceded a fair few marks on leads against Collingwood as well, but intercepted well and was so dynamic with the ball that it was sort of overlooked. I don't remember that being such an issue for him last year. Some ineffective punch attempts too. I don't know a massive amount about Melican, but it feels we need a genuine tall defender, hard to move, with a reliable spoil both in marking contests and on the lead (Rampe almost never concedes marks). I disagree that Aliir should be demoted, though. I feel these defensive issues are solvable and we need his dynamism in attack.

Feels like the ideal role for Aliir is as a spare defender or worst case on the third tall. He does seem to have dropped a lot more marks this year than last.

[MattW]

Watched the game in full on replay. Noticeable was that we were consistently second to the ball. Equally when disposing we were generally under pressure. The team just seems to be not working hard enough on the spread and missing 1 percenters when in possession eg blocking and leading up the ground etc. Allir played way too loose which i think put pressure on reg. I sort of hope he gets demoted yo work on his defensive game with melican coming in.

Yeah, Aliir conceded a fair few marks on leads against Collingwood as well, but intercepted well and was so dynamic with the ball that it was sort of overlooked. I don't remember that being such an issue for him last year. Some ineffective punch attempts too. I don't know a massive amount about Melican, but it feels we need a genuine tall defender, hard to move, with a reliable spoil both in marking contests and on the lead (Rampe almost never concedes marks). I disagree that Aliir should be demoted, though. I feel these defensive issues are solvable and we need his dynamism in attack.

I agree with you about work-rate. Lloyd and Jones are working hard. Not enough others. Suspect part of that is a lack of leadership and youth. We need Hannebery in particular to snap out of his slump and nail a couple of big games, inspire others.

[Legs Akimbo]

Watched the game in full on replay. Noticeable was that we were consistently second to the ball. Equally when disposing we were generally under pressure. The team just seems to be not working hard enough on the spread and missing 1 percenters when in possession eg blocking and leading up the ground etc. Allir played way too loose which i think put pressure on reg. I sort of hope he gets demoted yo work on his defensive game with melican coming in.

[Markwebbos]

I agree that Clarko has been the best coach in the past decade, but he's the one who seems to have lost the plot. He's sold the farm to bring in 2 midfielders who are big possession winners, but not know for speed or precision kicking. He also brought in a lazy error prone forward in Tyrone Vickery.

I always wonder how important Chris Fagan was to Clarko's success as a coach OR how much Hawthorn will miss having him around? He left right before they made those highly questionable list management decisions. Would Mitchell and Lewis have left for virtually nothing if he was still there?

[Ludwig]

Wauchope, you've nailed my fear precisely on the head with that comment. I really do wonder if Longmire is going to be able to transform our gameplan, as the changing style of AFL footy is going to demand. Contested ball is no longer the king it was, and you can't make up for a slow midfield by having lots of contested ball kings. If I was a Hawks fan, despite the clear holes developing in their list, I'd be confident their coach knows how to adapt to the way footy is going (being driven by the Commission and its rule changes I might add). I can't say I'm confident Longmire will manage the same.

He has been an enormous part of our clubs success, but I wonder if Longmire will be able to reinvent our game plan as the game moves in an uncomfortable direction. Our style of footy is no longer being rewarded in the way it once was.

I don't always agree with Longmire, especially when it comes to how he plays ruckmen, but there is a big divide in that regard among coaches and commentators. However, I do get the impression that Longmire has already committed to changing our game plan and has proven it by his actions.

He traded a proven contested ball winner in Mitchell in order to get another high draft pick. We took 2 speedy and mobile players in Florent and Hayward with our first 2 picks. We traded Nankervis and replaced him with a more mobile ruck-forward in Darcy Cameron. In fact, all 9 drafted players last year are quite mobile and some a very quick indeed. This alone shows his intention of transforming to a game style based on quicker ball movement.

Our defence has been staunch but slow in the past, but this too is changing. Recent additions Aliir, Newman and Marsh all have good pace. Melican appears close to a senior debut. Laidler is a reliable defender but has lost his spot seemingly due to lack of pace. Reg is the only holdover from the slow brigade. Once Rampe returns we should see much quicker ball movement out of defence.

I am not really sure what Swans' game plan some are referring too which is out of date. I think we are looking at a JPK, Parker and Hewett being the core of our on ball group, but supported by lots of others rotating through the midfield. Expect to see not only forwards taking turns in the midfielders, but defenders as well. Newman has already been at several stoppages in the midfield.

I agree that Clarko has been the best coach in the past decade, but he's the one who seems to have lost the plot. He's sold the farm to bring in 2 midfielders who are big possession winners, but not know for speed or precision kicking. He also brought in a lazy error prone forward in Tyrone Vickery. Even coaches with stellar reputations can find that the game has passed them by. Mick Malthouse was one of the most highly decorated coaches when he left Collingwood and went on to ruin Carlton and has probably set them back 10 years.

[Sandrevan]

I don't have Foxtel so I listened to the call on MMM. It was SO bad - incredibly one-sided. Andrew Embley was doing the 'special comments'. Whenever the Swans made a mistake he dwelt on it and then went on an on about how the WCE midfield were getting on top. it was truly nauseous.

About the game...what really stood out was the amount of turnovers. "Smith kicks a wobbly old kick out of defence straight to Gaff". Without seeing any of it the game and listening to the rubbish served up by Dennis Cometti I could tell our defence was poor. Like others have said we really missed Rampe and McVeighs finger pointing may actually be useful sometimes. When we got to 6 points down in Q4 the crowd started to get going - reminding the umpires that the home team needed to win. I knew it was all over then.
Yes, the Swans contested/stoppage kind of game is now passe. The AFL wants a free flowing game because it's more entertaining. So, we need to adjust to this. I don't see why it's such a problem as other teams are doing this quite easily eg Freo last week against the WB. Getting our injured players back could help but the Swans need to change the game plan. What happened to the Swans of the semi-final and the Prelim final of 2016?

[Sandrevan]

If we are going to rise from the ashes, Tom will be an essential part of the picture. He is exactly the kind of forward we have lacked and I enjoy his intensity, skill, sense of position and willingness to back himself.

And he's only a second year player off the rookie list. He showed us a lot last year so we just expect that to continue this year. I hope he does.