Match Day SEMI FINAL Geelong v Sydney MCG 7.50pm Friday 15 September

[Sandrevan]

What a crap way to end the season - our worst defeat for the entire year. Like a lot of others on here I hold the view that we could not keep playing that way we have for the second half of the year. It's a major achievement just to make finals after the 0-6 start. I was hopeful of a comeback until about half way through the 3rd quarter then I realised it was all over red rover. The boys looked tired both mentally and physically. I don't think the umpiring made a difference - sure Dangerfield got a couple of freebies but we got some as well. Some on here have said it reminded them of the 2014 gf - i tend to agree with this as well. We go in as hot favourites, then get smashed.

I suspect that Chris Scott and Co had a good look at the Swans vs Hawthorn games this year. After the game was finished I thought the Swans have just been "Hawthorned" - by Geelong. I also wondered for a fleeting moment if Chris Scott had called up Alistair Clarkson.

The boys looked very upset after the game which is no surprise. i'm not going to take aim at any of them - they just looked off for the whole game. Too many fumbles and too many cheap turnovers. Looking on the bright side they get 2 extra weeks of holiday before they start back for the pre-season.

[stevoswan]

Please construct paragraphs.
Makes yr 'slab' much easier to read .

Please tell me how....I've never learnt. True story.....

Had to chuckle at this:



You could copy and paste this response to 99% of the posts on RWO, and it would be accurate in every instance.

True........

[chammond]

Had to chuckle at this:

Complete 'stab in the dark' theorizing.....unless your in the inner sanctum of the club, this is complete speculation and probably so far from the truth, it would be staggering.

You could copy and paste this response to 99% of the posts on RWO, and it would be accurate in every instance.

[O'Reilly Boy]

There's been lots of theorizing on this thread about last night's game, some of it good, some of it bad and some of it completely whack. Here's my take on the sad end to our season. I think we were complacent going into this match, much like we were leading into the 2014 GF. When things didn't go our way early on, we were on the back foot and therefore mentally under pressure. The umpires then helped continue to build Geelong's confidence with some obvious assistance and the ghosts of last years GF come back to haunt our players, when they realised they're efforts were not going to be duly rewarded. Panic sets in and our structures and coolness under pressure desert us and the mental and physical pressure of 19 weeks of 'elimination finals' finally catches up with our team, leaving them lethargic, confused and feeling hopeless....not the basis to mount a stirring comeback from. While very disappointing, it's not really surprising.......So what do the club do? Well, certainly not panic and sack coaches and players! Longmire will stay....get over it! The list needs to be looked at and maybe players who are proven chokers moved on (Rohan, as much as I love what he sometimes does, I have to agree with Barry, he is a finals liability). Our main problem lies with lack of salary cap space, so we may have to make do largely with what we've got. Our depth is good. We have some good talent coming through and the younger senior players will improve further. Our older senior players are fine but we will need to get a gun KPD in the next season or two and some more speed. I have no idea what to do with Kurt.....he is very talented but can't stay on the park long enough. Do we trade him while he's still got some value or keep him in the knowledge that we may have to pay half his salary for someone to take him? The off season will be intriguing and may shape the club fortunes for many season's to come.....but I have faith in our club to move forward sensibly and successfully. Not the time to panic....the club should take a few deep breaths, make measured decisions and look within themselves and their 'Bloods culture' to find the answers to our finals brain fades.....before the younger players become tainted by that failure. We have a winning culture at our club but we risk developing a 'nearly there' culture which will not bode well for our future.....I will go so far as to say if we make the finals next year but don't go all the way, a slide down the ladder is on the cards.....massive effort for little reward is draining on all involved and any clubs 'culture' can only stand up for so long under those circumstances.....while I feel our club is at a fairly perilous crossroad after last night, I still have confidence our club will prevail.

I just can't see that Rohan choked: the game was lost in the guts, and its just not fair to pick on the outside players. The narrative about his showing in the 2016 GF seems to overlook how badly injured he was in the Adelaide semi last year, and that it was almost a miracle that he got back on the field?and arguably shouldn't have been selected.

Last night we never got the ball outside, let alone under control into 50. We were playing one behind the ball, and Franklin was crocked, so we had no hope of maintaining defensive pressure inside forward 50: Rohan, Papley, Towers, Hewitt spent most of the game chasing the lateral kicks to the free man across half back. There was no way that he?or any of the outside players?could have any influence on the game. I'd be pointing the finger at the engine room: Parker, Heeney (who was clearly a shadow of himself), Kennedy. Perhaps Jones should have gone to the centre bounces to get some mongrel going.

I'd also be thinking about how the selection system works: too often players are put on the field who end up being liabilities?that was the story of the 2016 GF for mine: carrying well over half a dozen players who were nowhere near match fit. I suspect last night something similar was happening. We celebrate the Bloods culture of strapping up and running on, at freaks like Adam Goodes playing on without functional ligaments, and we scoff at Kurt Tippett's fragility, but teams carrying underdone players get found out more often than not.

[Hotpotato]

Please construct paragraphs.
Makes yr 'slab' much easier to read .

[stevoswan]

Match Day SEMI FINAL Geelong v Sydney MCG 7.50pm Friday 15 September

There's been lots of theorizing on this thread about last night's game, some of it good, some of it bad and some of it completely whack. Here's my take on the sad end to our season.

I think we were complacent going into this match, much like we were leading into the 2014 GF. When things didn't go our way early on, we were on the back foot and therefore mentally under pressure. The umpires then helped continue to build Geelong's confidence with some obvious assistance and the ghosts of last years GF come back to haunt our players, when they realised they're efforts were not going to be duly rewarded. Panic sets in and our structures and coolness under pressure desert us and the mental and physical pressure of 19 weeks of 'elimination finals' finally catches up with our team, leaving them lethargic, confused and feeling hopeless....not the basis to mount a stirring comeback from.

While very disappointing, it's not really surprising.......So what do the club do? Well, certainly not panic and sack coaches and players! Longmire will stay....get over it! The list needs to be looked at and maybe players who are proven chokers moved on (Rohan, as much as I love what he sometimes does, I have to agree with Barry, he is a finals liability).

Our main problem lies with lack of salary cap space, so we may have to make do largely with what we've got. Our depth is good. We have some good talent coming through and the younger senior players will improve further. Our older senior players are fine but we will need to get a gun KPD in the next season or two and some more speed.

I have no idea what to do with Kurt.....he is very talented but can't stay on the park long enough. Do we trade him while he's still got some value or keep him in the knowledge that we may have to pay half his salary for someone to take him? The off season will be intriguing and may shape the club fortunes for many season's to come.....but I have faith in our club to move forward sensibly and successfully.

Not the time to panic....the club should take a few deep breaths, make measured decisions and look within themselves and their 'Bloods culture' to find the answers to our finals brain fades.....before the younger players become tainted by that failure. We have a winning culture at our club but we risk developing a 'nearly there' culture which will not bode well for our future.....I will go so far as to say if we make the finals next year but don't go all the way, a slide down the ladder is on the cards.....massive effort for little reward is draining on all involved and any clubs 'culture' can only stand up for so long under those circumstances.....

while I feel our club is at a fairly perilous crossroad after last night, I still have confidence our club will prevail.

[barry]

Some say that a few of our players are "cream on top". In footy jargon that translates to front-runners.

Compare to the Kirk and Barry Hall era's we have too many front runners and need to get a bit of grit "Cortina's" back in there....

[Ludwig]

If we need another backman Aliir or Melican should have replaced Cunningham.

Both should be feeling pretty good today not having been part of that debacle last night. Their stocks have risen by their non-inclusion.

It really wasn't good forward thinking my the match committee. If we won the game we would have had to face Adelaide with Melican not having played in 4 weeks and still undersized for their 4 mobile tall forwards. I've always looked to Adelaide as a guide to how we should structure our back line to counter their forward setup. We didn't plan well for that this season.

[stevoswan]

This is my comment generally and not just about the game last night. My comment also applies to the twos.

I think there is a cultural problem at the club.

Whilst the goals are laudable; high bloods standards, toughness, ensuring accountability there is a recurring theme that is creeping in the seniors and the firsts. What ever we are doing seems to fail us in finals.

When I look at seconds and seniors I see young players unable to maintain the standards, especially being able to keep a cool head and dispose of the ball well. Last night our terrible disposal under pressure cost us.

What's missing? I believe that the senior players do not create an environment that nurtures and inspires confidence to the young players. Over the last couple of years I think guys like mills and Heeney have been pushed around by the senior guys not supported.

Guys like McVeigh just admonish the young players all in the name of high standards. Kennedy is a bit of a lone wolf. Hanners and Parker have not emerged as true leaders. Buddy is self focussed.

We have no hodge, MITCHELL or Selwood to give the kids confidence and to bring out their best.

The club needs senior players who are genuine leaders that the young guys feel have their back. And most importantly want the kids to succeed. So many swans senior players don't live that value. That was the bloods culture . Remember Kelly and kirky? You can't expect kids like Newman, Haywood etc just to know how to do it. Great sides have senior players who teach not direct. Until we can find them we will not win a flag.

Complete 'stab in the dark' theorizing.....unless your in the inner sanctum of the club, this is complete speculation and probably so far from the truth, it would be staggering.

[lwjoyner]

Very disappointing, maybe we were tired but didn't look that way last week, if we were perhaps the fitness guys have to take some of the blame and not freshening them up. Interested in the comments re plan a b etc our plan B seems to be weaken the forward line when we are in trouble and move Reid back and leave Buddy one out against a lot. WE cant do this to our fwd line we have no one taking marks which is what Reid can do. If we need another backman Alir or Melican should have replaced Cunningham. Last week it worked with the Dons having many small runners, the Cats don't have them, either late or find are fwd who can help Buddy. The whole coaching panel was outsmarted maybe we need a change here very stagnant group, too many mids.

[Blue Sun]

Looks like the bad start caught up to us. The boys looked tired and mentally unfit last night. It was still a remarkable effort to make the finals from 0-6, history-making. I'm happy with the boys because of that alone. Took a lot of guts.

[Billericay]

Having had a chance to sober up, sleep on it, and calm down, I think the defeat was a combination of factors:

1. Longmire was outcoached

There's a great piece in the Age Chris Scott 'Geelong's best player' in semi-final win over Sydney: Joel Selwood

"Geelong's best player at the MCG on Friday night was a man who hadn't played an AFL game in more than 10 years. That man, at least according to Cats skipper Joel Selwood, was the club's coach, Chris Scott. Scott's decision to play Patrick Dangerfield as a deep forward proved a masterstroke, as the Brownlow medallist kicked four first half goals, setting up a 36-point half-time lead over Sydney.

Scott says his decision to play Danger forward [against the Crows] depends on being confident he'll win the centre bounce "Do we win the first centre bounce? Well if we do, we start him forward... The hard part is winning the first centre bounce."

So Scott didn't concede the midfield battle, far from it, his decision to play Danger forward depended on being able to win around the ball without Danger.

If you think about the previous games between us and Geelong they've generally broken even in clearances / contested possessions and had more inside 50s, but we've beaten them by being more efficient in attack / defending better. It would make complete sense that Scott would look at ways to get more value from a mountain of inside 50s. Playing Danger forward, based on the game v Hawthorn, was the way to go. As Longmire said, he tried lots of things to counter it, and nothing worked. Coach John Longmire says his Swans looked 'buggered' in defeat to Cats

"We were trying. Nothing we did tonight worked. It was just one of those nights. It doesn't happen to often, to be fair on them."

It's a very difficult match up that we'll need to find an answer to by next season. Would someone like Parker be capable of playing as a defender on Dangerfield?

2. Swans were exhausted

I genuinely think the mental and physical toll of hauling themselves back from 0-6 left the Swans with nothing to give, or as Longmire put it "Our blokes looked a bit buggered tonight, to be honest... We didn't have much energy... We've been going flat out for 18 weeks, playing elimination finals every week."

In previous years (2013 v Freo, 2015 v North) we've played finals exhausted (admittedly with injury issues in 2015) and looked off the pace when we lost. I'm actually amazed the Swans kept up a high level of football for so long (18 games) without a major drop off.

3. Teams do have bad games

Just being factual and unemotional about this, Geelong got smashed by Richmond last week by 51 points and although people spent the entire week questioning them, they bounced back emphatically. Swans got killed by GWS last year and came back to make the Grand Final. It's arguable that we should have won the premiership last year despite that shellacking.

Last year we beat both Geelong and Adelaide comprehensively in finals. No one's calling for Chris Scott / Don Pyke's head or a wholesale clean out of players. They are playing off for a spot in the Grand Final next week.

4. Geelong's reputation was on the line

This was a statement game for the Cats, and credit to them, they put in a brilliant performance. They were Swans-like last week when nothing worked for them against a red-hot Richmond. I'll be very interested to see how they go against the Crows next week?

The Swans have put themselves in the position year after year to be exposed to the test of finals football, and they've failed to be the absolute best side since 2012.

They've got six months without a game to stew on this humiliating defeat and to work on how to counter Hawthorn-like ball movement etc. To those who are calling for Longmire's head perhaps they need to refresh the line coach lineup. Look at the difference Blake Caracella has made to Richmond?

[Hotpotato]

Need to do something to stop the mental disintegration in important games because I hate losing.

[Ludwig]

In the 2nd half of the season we were smashing sides out of the centre and giving our forwards first opportunity. You could see very early that Geelong were determined to thwart our centre clearances. We became spectators at centre bounces and paid dearly. Mills must immediately go to the midfield and have some intensive education on playing midfield in the off season.

I've been pleading for Mills to move to the midfield all year. We desperately need another player who can quickly pick out a forward on the lead instead of just bombing in to the opposition. I don't think he will need much education. He's a natural and has been playing midfield with us from his Academy days.

[Nico]

Geelong surely came into the game conceding the midfield contest. Guthrie out; Selwood playing injured; and then they take Dangerfield out of the midfield and put him in the forward line. No one would have been more shocked at what transpired than Chris Scott.

In the 2nd half of the season we were smashing sides out of the centre and giving our forwards first opportunity. You could see very early that Geelong were determined to thwart our centre clearances. We became spectators at centre bounces and paid dearly. Mills must immediately go to the midfield and have some intensive education on playing midfield in the off season.