Alleged incident at hotel on Sunday night

[stevoswan]

"Constant speculation without facts".... No more of a fact than speculation Blakey wants out because he feels hard done by

Except the Bice thing is a fact.

[stevoswan]

Well said. I think another point to consider is whether the playing group will be prepared to accept the 5 back given the trust they have broken

Oh I think they will.

[liz]

Except the Bice thing is a fact.

Please back that up with a citation (and ideally a link).

[Ludwig]

The Swans' management is so ashamed of the men's team that they have been almost totaly eliminated from the Swans' website. Nearly every item on thw site is about the AFLW. You would hardly think that that we were in the finals or even had an AFL team.

[UUaswan]

The Swans' management is so ashamed of the men's team that they have been almost totaly eliminated from the Swans' website. Nearly every item on thw site is about the AFLW. You would hardly think that that we were in the finals or even had an AFL team.

I think the Women's program is working thru reintegration onto the website

[Syd76]

It is a good article, because it goes to the saturation and speculative coverage of matters under police and legal investigation, the behaviour of some of the complainant's lawyers and the NRL's no fault stand down policy on players charged.

But you need to be careful not to read into it a damnation of the club's approach to player standards.

It's more nuanced than that, and so is the whole situation.

Great article. Without wanting to go over old ground, one of the lawyers have bordered on unduly prejudicing the rights of the players and alleged victim(s) to receive justice on the grounds of erosion of the presumption of innocence, (at this point in time) unsubstantiated public claims and sensationalist framing. This is without getting into any potential defamation. FWIW, defamation is is the act of communicating false statements that harm a person or organisation's reputation - which the we know the Sydney Swans have sought legal representation on.

I don't want to get Liz in trouble here - just want to be balanced - but I could have been more vociferous in my language naming parties involved. We all know who we are referencing here.....

What I am really concerned about (other than the outcome of the Pullman 5) is the way the media has handled this situation. Some of the media have acted in a despicable way - sensationalist, unfair to various parties to peddle their own clickbait interest and should be held to account for blatantly incorrect reporting - particularly in the first 72 hours. About the only ones who have been balanced in their reporting have been Jay Clark and and Sam Edmund. Furthermore for tabloids to splash poor partners photos on front pages is ATROCIOUS. What on earth have they done wrong? The Media at times is a cesspit.

For what its worth, I think that everyone needs to take a chill pill and let all the facts play out as it is owed everyone to have due process be served. The players and the alleged victims deserve this.

List decisions for Sydney are secondary, and the players are innocent until proven guilty. So for all the talk about getting rid of players, players wanting out, time will allow the club, the players involved and the afl to digest the ramifications.

At this point in time, before any police investigation is concluded the only thing that we need to get to the bottom of is why some players took the mickey to go out on the lash so close to the finals. This is certainly something that cannot be denied by anyone, and obviously the club has taken action on this. Maybe it wont be then end of the ramifications...Everything else will be revealed in due time.

[UUaswan]

Great article. Without wanting to go over old ground, one of the lawyers have bordered on unduly prejudicing the rights of the players and alleged victim(s) to receive justice on the grounds of erosion of the presumption of innocence, (at this point in time) unsubstantiated public claims and sensationalist framing. This is without getting into any potential defamation. FWIW, defamation is is the act of communicating false statements that harm a person or organisation's reputation - which the we know the Sydney Swans have sought legal representation on.

I don't want to get Liz in trouble here - just want to be balanced - but I could have been more vociferous in my language naming parties involved. We all know who we are referencing here.....

What I am really concerned about (other than the outcome of the Pullman 5) is the way the media has handled this situation. Some of the media have acted in a despicable way - sensationalist, unfair to various parties to peddle their own clickbait interest and should be held to account for blatantly incorrect reporting - particularly in the first 72 hours. About the only ones who have been balanced in their reporting have been Jay Clark and and Sam Edmund. Furthermore for tabloids to splash poor partners photos on front pages is ATROCIOUS. What on earth have they done wrong? The Media at times is a cesspit.

For what its worth, I think that everyone needs to take a chill pill and let all the facts play out as it is owed everyone to have due process be served. The players and the alleged victims deserve this.

List decisions for Sydney are secondary, and the players are innocent until proven guilty. So for all the talk about getting rid of players, players wanting out, time will allow the club, the players involved and the afl to digest the ramifications.

At this point in time, before any police investigation is concluded the only thing that we need to get to the bottom of is why some players took the mickey to go out on the lash so close to the finals. This is certainly something that cannot be denied by anyone, and obviously the club has taken action on this. Maybe it wont be then end of the ramifications...Everything else will be revealed in due time.

The only thing that would have given the 5 the presumption of Innocence would be for the club to wait until an investigation is complete.

Even if you believe the sanction is unrelated, name another time ever a club as derailed a campaign and Suspended that calibre of player while being in this finals position. It hasn't happened, total miscalculation trying to appease the masses and now they rightfully look stupid.

Not a player on that list wgaf about that evening if they were lining up alongside the 5 next week.

[stevoswan]

Please back that up with a citation (and ideally a link).

Wow, so much speculation masquerading as fact on this thread (they know who they are and I think you do too) and I'm the one who has to prove my claim! Unbelievable.

Anyway, it was on ABC radio and presented as if it was a result of initial police investigations.

Make of that what you will, I know exactly what UUaswan and crackedactor will say. Something along the lines of 'woke BS'. Yawn.

[stevoswan]

The Swans' management is so ashamed of the men's team that they have been almost totaly eliminated from the Swans' website. Nearly every item on thw site is about the AFLW. You would hardly think that that we were in the finals or even had an AFL team.

Well, we aren't in it this week are we? Makes sense really to just let things cool down a bit. Good advice for some on here.

[Roadrunner]

Some on here don’t seem to understand that our 5 players had to be sanctioned for silly, reckless. immature and selfish behaviour- you don’t need any club rules for professional athletes to know this and behave accordingly and responsibly. Such actions must have consequences and I’m not talking about any alleged SA which is a separate matter. Of course we all want our best team to compete in finals but this cannot be condoned, irrespective of what other clubs have done or would do.

We have our own standards and they have nothing to do with the media or public opinion. Just ask yourself this simple question: was their behaviour appropriate at this point in the season? A 2 week sanction would clearly send a mixed message: what you boys did was wrong but we need you for the finals!

Sorry, but we need to send the correct message for the future.

[Dow]

Some on here don’t seem to understand that our 5 players had to be sanctioned for silly, reckless. immature and selfish behaviour- you don’t need any club rules for professional athletes to know this and behave accordingly and responsibly. Such actions must have consequences and I’m not talking about any alleged SA which is a separate matter. Of course we all want our best team to compete in finals but this cannot be condoned, irrespective of what other clubs have done or would do.

We have our own standards and they have nothing to do with the media or public opinion. Just ask yourself this simple question: was their behaviour appropriate at this point in the season? A 2 week sanction would clearly send a mixed message: what you boys did was wrong but we need you for the finals!

Sorry, but we need to send the correct message for the future.

this is it in a nutshell, it's not that hard to understand

[imuninformedtwo]

There’s also the assumption or claim in some of the posts that the club needed to wait for the results of a police investigation, which is in fact another matter. The club did its own investigation, including interviews with the players involved, about their behaviour up to and aside from any alleged sexual assault. I imagine they have a very clear view of what the players otherwise did.

You can make an argument they also responded to some pressure from commercial partners, which they’re perfectly entitled to do. But if they formed a view from the interviews that the players behaviour was impeccable and a case of nothing to see here, they might have pushed back more. Except they didn’t.

[UUaswan]

On field performance is paramount

Yes they need to hold themselves to a standard but not at the expense of a whole season

Acknowledge what they did was stupid but move on and move past it, like anything in life

Staying in a funk and keeping a cloud over the whole organisation in an attempt to appease interests outside the 4 walls is ridiculous

We haven't move on, we have made it worse, we have thrown our poster boy, most desired player and one of the most popular players under the bus, they make the Swans the Swans, no one else.

On field performance is paramount, fans watch Sydney because of consistent performance over a long period and love for their stars not because of sponsors

Its almost arrogance and a sense of, we will be in this position next year, that the club thinks it can make this decision without consequence